Does President Obama play too much Golf?

[David in FL]

[INDENT][/INDENT][quote name="zipazoid" url="/t/54663/does-president-obama-play-too-much-golf/342#post_780647"] You still don't have to buy it under Obamacare.  [/quote] True. You just get fined if you don't. A distinction without a difference....

[dave67az]

Originally Posted by David in FL

If I choose to buy insurance it's a voluntary choice.

Well, it used to be, before Obamacare...... Now it's become redistributionist and yes, even socialist in it's application. If you haven't heard any "whining" about it, you really haven't been paying attention!

Didn't know auto insurance was optional in Florida.  Guess you learn something new every day.

[David in FL]

Curious - which group did they do this to during Obama's first term? I don't recall an 'affluent' group having money taken from them & it given to another group.

Fortunately, so far he's been less successful than he'd like. Thanks primarily to the Republicans in the House. His lack of success so far certainly isn't for the lack of effort nor desire. He's been clear on that....and like I said, I believe him.

[David in FL]

Didn't know auto insurance was optional in Florida.  Guess you learn something new every day.

Certainly it's optional. You only have to have it I you make the choice to own a car. It's always good to learn something new, isn't it?

[dave67az]

Originally Posted by David in FL

Certainly it's optional. You only have to have it I you make the choice to own a car.

It's always good to learn something new, isn't it?

Oh, well that's cool then.

I'm all in favor of a law that only requires people who operate a human body to buy health insurance then.

[David in FL]

Oh, well that's cool then. I'm all in favor of a law that only requires people who operate a human body to buy health insurance then.

You seem to be having trouble understanding the whole "choice" thing......

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by David in FL

Fortunately, so far he's been less successful than he'd like.

So that would be a no.

But it's good that you know what he really wants to do, eh?

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by David in FL

True. You just get fined if you don't.

But you aren't forced to buy it. So personal choice remains.

Hey, I can choose to speed if I want to. I'll get fined for that too.

[dave67az]

Originally Posted by David in FL

You seem to be having trouble understanding the whole "choice" thing......

Well you see, here's the problem.  We in the medical field don't have a "choice" to not treat people who show up in Emergency Rooms.  This is why I, and most people in the medical profession that I've worked with, feel that everyone should have health insurance.

And, for the record, TRICARE, the system that the military uses is nearly identical to the program that "Obamacare" proposes.  And our patient satisfaction rates are higher than nearly any civilian plan you can find.

We could all stand to learn a few things.  Personally I'd be thrilled if civilians who claim that Obamacare won't work would do a little research into the success that our military healthcare system has been.

[Joakim]

Has anyone here tried to get private insurance. I have been denied by all major medical insurance as having to many issues. The best I found was with a $8,500.00 deductable before they start paying for basic perscriptions. 50% and up co-pay if they have to pay any hospitalization or specialized care.

If this limited and excessive insurance doesn't make financial sense, why would anyone worry about a fine? I was charged $2,900 for a 5 mile ambulance ride that stated they drove 45 miles. What is needed is Medical overcharging reform.

[David in FL]

Well you see, here's the problem.  We in the medical field don't have a "choice" to not treat people who show up in Emergency Rooms.  This is why I, and most people in the medical profession that I've worked with, feel that everyone should have health insurance. And, for the record, TRICARE, the system that the military uses is nearly identical to the program that "Obamacare" proposes.  And our patient satisfaction rates are higher than nearly any civilian plan you can find. We could all stand to learn a few things.  Personally I'd be thrilled if civilians who claim that Obamacare won't work would do a little research into the success that our military healthcare system has been.

23 years of military service. I have a pretty good understanding of it. And btw.....that healthcare system isn't available to most civilians. It's a benefit provided by the employer, in this case the U.S. government, for its employees. You were allowed access to it because you chose ( there's that word again) to enter the military and serve your country.

[dave67az]

Originally Posted by David in FL

23 years of military service. I have a pretty good understanding of it.

And btw.....that healthcare system isn't available to most civilians. It's a benefit provided by the employer, in this case the U.S. government, for its employees. You were allowed access to it because you chose ( there's that word again) to enter the military and serve your country.

I'm pretty sure I know a little about TRICARE and to whom it's available.

I also know the satisfaction rates compared to civilian plans.

http://christus.usfhp.com/Default.aspx?tabid=107&EntryID;=17

http://www.defense.gov/releases/release.aspx?releaseid=1422

http://www.pacificmedicalcenters.org/index.php/usfhp/news/military-beneficiaries-rate-us-family-health-plan-among-highest-2011/

Again, hospitals don't get to choose who to treat if they need medical care (http://www.emtala.com/).

If you choose not to get health insurance, your irresponsibility is costing those of us who DO have insurance and that makes you just as much of a leech on society as those people who choose not to work simply because they know there's a government program that will provide for them if they're poor.

We need fewer leeches in America.

We also need people to stop saying a government contracted health insurance plan wouldn't work because in the military we've PROVEN many times that not only does it work, it's cheaper than a private "for profit" plan and the patient satisfaction is far higher as well.

But here's the deal...if you REALLLLY want to spend more of your money to a private company, you get to.  Isn't that cool?  You can waste as much money as you want.  But if you want the government contractor (patterned after TRICARE) you can choose that option.

What you CANNOT do is be a leech.  We're taking that option away from you.  Sorry.

And, by the way, as soon as you are able to CHOOSE not to get sick or injured, you can CHOOSE not to get health insurance.  We can put that in the law as well if you want.  Would that make you feel better?

[Joakim]

Originally Posted by dave67az

I'm pretty sure I know a little about TRICARE and to whom it's available.

I also know the satisfaction rates compared to civilian plans.

http://christus.usfhp.com/Default.aspx?tabid=107&EntryID;=17

http://www.defense.gov/releases/release.aspx?releaseid=1422

http://www.pacificmedicalcenters.org/index.php/usfhp/news/military-beneficiaries-rate-us-family-health-plan-among-highest-2011/

Again, hospitals don't get to choose who to treat if they need medical care (http://www.emtala.com/).

If you choose not to get health insurance, your irresponsibility is costing those of us who DO have insurance and that makes you just as much of a leech on society as those people who choose not to work simply because they know there's a government program that will provide for them if they're poor.

We need fewer leeches in America.

We also need people to stop saying a government contracted health insurance plan wouldn't work because in the military we've PROVEN many times that not only does it work, it's cheaper than a private "for profit" plan and the patient satisfaction is far higher as well.

But here's the deal...if you REALLLLY want to spend more of your money to a private company, you get to.  Isn't that cool?  You can waste as much money as you want.  But if you want the government contractor (patterned after TRICARE) you can choose that option.

What you CANNOT do is be a leech.  We're taking that option away from you.  Sorry.

Sure I'll just sign my whole check over to

[Joakim]

Nevermind it ain't worth my time. I do agree we need a government contracted health insurance to allow competition to the abusive medical charging practices, i.e. Canada and the UK.

Obama care won't work until then. Maybe we need to divert some of that 680 Billion Federal Military budget to this endeavor. Or we just start another war so we can make use of the most Federal expenses since WWII.

In the interim I guess I'll just sign my check over to ACME insurance and eat leaches for dinner.

[David in FL]

We need fewer leeches in America. What you CANNOT do is be a leech.  We're taking that option away from you.  Sorry.

I agree, we need fewer leaches. A good start would be to require that everyone who works pay at least some federal income tax. Right now nearly half do not. Our current welfare system is in desperate need of reform too. The current system is replete with leeches, the vast majority of which will be voting for Obama, if they can actually be troubled to vote at all. The only thing "you" are taking away from the rest of us, is individual freedom with personal responsibility. You're intent on replacing it with a socialist nanny state that can force someone to purchase a product whether they want to or not. That's sad. Fortunately, you represent a real minority in our armed forces. Most of us are proud to have served and fought for the very type of freedoms that you want so badly to take away.

[David in FL]

But you aren't forced to buy it. So personal choice remains. Hey, I can choose to speed if I want to. I'll get fined for that too.

You don't see the difference between a law that prohibits driving at an unsafe speed and one that forces you to purchase a product that you may not want? I really don't believe that. I sure hope I'm right......

[Joakim]

Originally Posted by David in FL

I agree, we need fewer leaches. A good start would be to require that everyone who works pay at least some federal income tax. Right now nearly half do not. Our current welfare system is in desperate need of reform too. The current system is replete with leeches, the vast majority of which will be voting for Obama, if they can actually be troubled to vote at all.

The only thing "you" are taking away from the rest of us, is individual freedom with personal responsibility. You're intent on replacing it with a socialist nanny state that can force someone to purchase a product whether they want to or not. That's sad.

Fortunately, you represent a real minority in our armed forces. Most of us are proud to have served and fought for the very type of freedoms that you want so badly to take away.

Simple, You make everyone on welfare or able disabled to undertake government assisted medical services to cut cost, add quality and give purpose for workers. I'd be in for that. Bam, Health care solved, recession solved, deficit solved.

[phan52]

Originally Posted by Joakim

It's a matter of what station you watch, Fox made a big deal about it. I honestly can't say if the journalism is true or not, I can say when confronted they took the 5th on the amount spent.

Also, there's no need for name calling.

Well, there you go. Seriously dude. $200 million dollars a day. Do you have a functioning brain? Can you think for yourself?