Jump to content
Note: This thread is 4723 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

  • Moderator

This was provided by TST member and golf instructor Brian McGrew (cbrian).  Thanks for sharing Brian!
Before I get into the point of this post I want you to stop and ask yourself a question: If someone asked you to check his alignment and he was aimed 5 yards right of his target, what would you tell him?  Would you tell him his aim is wrong?

I had a lesson about a week ago that reminded me how much I despise a certain piece of advice.  I understand the reasoning behind this advice, but I think it has been dumbed down to a point where it is, in a lot of cases, counter productive.  For whatever reason a lot of instructors think most of you are too stupid to handle real information (or don't understand it themselves).  They think they have to tell you that there is one right way to have your hands on the club, one right way to have your feet aligned, one right way to have the clubface aligned, etc etc.  Some of them have even gone as far to call them fundamentals... well sorry, but I just don't agree.

The lesson: A guy comes up to me and says he wants to have an "alignment lesson" because he hits the ball really far left at times.  I told him I doubted that was the problem, but if that was all that was wrong then I wouldn't charge him for a lesson.  He says ok and starts hitting... yea, definitely not his alignment.  On his good shots he was hitting a decent looking pull fade.  Then he would miss one left because the face would catch up with path.  He hits a few more and asks me what I think, so I told him his alignment was fine and what I thought the real issue was.  He likes what I have to say and we work on it a bit, and about 15-20 minutes later he starts consistently losing some of his pull fade and the ball is now falling right of the target.  I start getting excited like I have a tendency to do and announced, "You are hitting it too good now... if you keep this up we are going to have to shift aim left." (Insert dramatic car braking noises here) It was at this point that our lesson hit a brick wall. He just stops hitting and stands there... "wait, you said my alignment was correct".  I try to explain to him that his alignment was correct for the shot shape he was playing.  However, he just couldn't get what I was trying to explain to him.  At this point I kept having to come up with new ways to tell him that if you hit a 10 yard pull with 5 yards of fade , then you need to aim 5 yards right of your target, which is exactly what he was doing.  If at the beginning of the lesson I had shifted his alignment 5 yards left to where he would be aimed at his target, his shot would end up 5 yards left of it... at best.

It wasn't that this player didn't understand the math of it.  His problem was he was using the method of a guy that really hammered home the idea of one right way to aim.  The usual, club face NEEDS to be aimed at target, your feet NEED to be parallel to that, your shoulders NEED to be parallel to that, etc. The player was just at a loss because he was scrambling for a reason why what I was saying didn't make sense.  I just had to keep explaining to this player that there are a lot of extremely talented golfers that do not aim at their targets.  A lot of guys on tour are very good at aiming away from their target to account for their over or under curvature of the golf ball.  A lot of guys change their feet or shoulder alignment to neutralize or minimize tendencies.  And all change alignment to hit certain shots.

The point of all this being that the answer to the question I asked at the beginning of this thread is: " it depends". Yes, I understand that some or most instructors are just trying to emphasize the need to be somewhat neutral by using the "train tracks" theory of alignment.  However, there is never an explanation that goes along with that advice that says it its quite OK to not be perfectly square (and that it is a fruitless quest).   It is never explained that guys like Bubba Watson often aim at entirely different fairways, or that there are guys that set up slightly open or closed, guys that have the face wide open or extremely shut, etc.  In my opinion, what's lost is the understanding that aim, ball position, etc are components that can and should be manipulated to meet the needs of different players and different shots.  And this player was a perfect example of just that.  Not only did he not understand how to manipulate setup to hit different shots, had he seen himself on video, he would have shifted alignment left and started missing every single target left.

I think most of you are smart enough to hear that "it depends".  If you asked me for advice on "correct" alignment I'd say two things.  First, find a routine that helps you align the same way each time. If you practice that routine and try to hit shots to a target, I think your alignment will figure itself out for the most part.  And two, understand why your alignment works for you and understand how you can change it to hit different shots.

I hope this helps some of you, but even if it didn't, it sure made me feel better... Posted Image
  • Upvote 1

Mike McLoughlin

Check out my friends on Evolvr!
Follow The Sand Trap on Twitter!  and on Facebook
Golf Terminology -  Analyzr  -  My FacebookTwitter and Instagram 

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Great post-I love playing around with different set ups and see how they effect things. Maybe someday I'll stick wuth the one that works!

BO THE GOLFER

In my Top Flite stand bag:

Driver-Ping G400+ 10.5 degrees regular flex Hybrids-Ping I25 17 & 20 degrees stiff flex Irons-Ping I3 O-size 4 through lob wedge regular flex Putter-Nike Oz 6


Thanks for posting this for me. I just don't think enough emphasis is placed on the right pieces at times. Getting your clubface aimed perfectly at target wont make you hit it straight.

Hit the ball solid, control your curve, aim your shot.

  • Upvote 2
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Very good thread!

I've never understood instructors that try to teach students how to hit a dead straight shot. It's the hardest shot in the book and if you don't pull it off the shot will ALWAYS curve away from the target. It neither makes the instructor look very good nor fill the student with any confidence. You don't have to be a golfing genius to realise this, it's common sense. So why do 99% of instructors continue to teach this way? This is why it is important for the student to understand the ball flight laws and the reasoning behind why you are aiming them right of the target with the clubface open relative to the target line in order to hit a push-draw.

"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." – Winston Churchill


Thats why, when i practice i try to hit over the yardage markers on the range. I set that up square. So i know if i hit a pull then it will start off left of that yardage marker. so instead of focusing on the final end result, i focus on the flight of the ball. Because you can always adjust alignment to get it to end up were you want it.

Matt Dougherty, P.E.
 fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver; :pxg: 0311 Gen 5,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: Sub 70 TAIII Fordged
Wedges: :edel: (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :leupold:
Bag: :ping:

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades



Originally Posted by saevel25

Thats why, when i practice i try to hit over the yardage markers on the range. I set that up square. So i know if i hit a pull then it will start off left of that yardage marker. so instead of focusing on the final end result, i focus on the flight of the ball. Because you can always adjust alignment to get it to end up were you want it.



To me, it makes more sense to try and hit a fade or a draw at the yardage markers. You still focus on the ball flight and you have a better chance of hitting your target. Plus you are practicing what you should be doing on the course. Setting up square and trying to hit a straight shot is very difficult. Just slightly off and the ball always curves away from your target. I guess it is OK to do if you honestly don't know what your normal ball flight is and want to find out.

"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." – Winston Churchill




Originally Posted by colin007

so...did you charge the guy?



Yea he paid me. That lesson took well over an hour though.

And for the two posts above the one I quoted, what I suggest is this: If you are working on a mechanical piece then its fine to keep aim constant (ie: alignment sticks, rope on ground, etc). If you are hitting balls to groove your swing or want to work on hitting shots, then go through your routine and try to land on a target. Basically treat it like you are on the course.

I feel like that's the most efficient way to use your time and also feel like it will keep you from falling into bad habits.

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Quote:

Setting up square and trying to hit a straight shot is very difficult. Just slightly off and the ball always curves away from your target.

I never said about trying to hit a straight shot. What i usually do is, if you imagine a line from me through the yardage marker to a point in the distance were the ball will land. So if i am on the course, it would be if i was aiming at the flag, but i imagine the flag like 100 yards infront of me, now i want to make sure the ball starts to the right or left of the flag, and then fade or draw back to that line. So i am practicing hitting to a spot in the distsance, i just have a visual infront of me making sure i am hitting push drawas instead of pull fades.

Matt Dougherty, P.E.
 fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver; :pxg: 0311 Gen 5,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: Sub 70 TAIII Fordged
Wedges: :edel: (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :leupold:
Bag: :ping:

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades



Originally Posted by saevel25

I never said about trying to hit a straight shot. What i usually do is, if you imagine a line from me through the yardage marker to a point in the distance were the ball will land. So if i am on the course, it would be if i was aiming at the flag, but i imagine the flag like 100 yards infront of me, now i want to make sure the ball starts to the right or left of the flag, and then fade or draw back to that line. So i am practicing hitting to a spot in the distsance, i just have a visual infront of me making sure i am hitting push drawas instead of pull fades.


Ah OK, now I getcha! That makes perfect sense and a great way to practice.

"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." – Winston Churchill


Note: This thread is 4723 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • TST Partners

    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    ShotScope
    The Stack System
    FitForGolf
    FlightScope Mevo
    Direct: Mevo, Mevo+, and Pro Package.

    Coupon Codes (save 10-20%): "IACAS" for Mevo/Stack/FitForGolf, "IACASPLUS" for Mevo+/Pro Package, and "THESANDTRAP" for ShotScope. 15% off TourStriker (no code).
  • Posts

    • Its way past time both tours  have  major  penalties for  slow  play. I  hate  it when they say" This group is  on the  clock". Big damn deal. Issue  penalties. Maybe Hull is a  bit too harsh but  its time a slew  of  2 stroke  penalties start  being  issued.     Charley Hull is fed up with slow play on the LPGA, so she offered a ‘ruthless’ solution “I’m quite ruthless, but I said, ‘Listen, if you get three bad timings, every time it’s a tee shot penalty; if you have three of them, you lose your Tour card instantly.’ I’m sure that would hurry a lot of people up, and they won’t want to lose their Tour card. That would kill the slow play, but they would never do that.” Who knows if that will work. But if it does not, maybe the PGA Tour should adopt Hull’s idea. The LPGA should, too, or at least assess penalty strokes for slow play. Five-hour rounds for a final group on Sunday is unacceptable and a quick way to lose interest and engagement from fans.
    • Wordle 1,248 4/6 🟨⬜⬜🟩⬜ ⬜⬜🟩⬜⬜ ⬜🟩🟩🟩🟩 🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
    • A hair under 190. It was pretty downhill, though, so I think we were playing between 180-185 to the pin. My 6 iron went 187 according to shot scope and ended up 18 feet away.
    • That's a tough pin on 14 at TR, had to make the hole play much longer, how far was that shot? I've only played that hole with a front pin.
    • No, but I spent (marginally) less time in the trees at Southern Pines, so it definitely played wider for me 😆. It definitely felt wider.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...