Blue staked area, play prohibited, free drop?

[keeps21]

Hi All

Just a question with regards to what I should've done.

I hit a shot into an area of the course surrounded by blue stakes. Looking at the local rules the only mention was that play from areas marked by blue stakes is prohibited.

I found my ball in the blue staked area and took a free drop it in the rough in line with the point where it entered the blue staked area.

Is this right or should I have given myself a 1 stroke penalty / dropped somewhere else?

Thanks

[Johanna]

The area you decribe is called GUR (ground under repair), and what you should have done is find the nearest spot outside the GUR where interference ceased to exist for your stroke and stance, and from that spot drop the ball within one clublength, not nearer the hole Rule 25-1b.

The spot where you dropped the ball would have been correct if your ball was lost in GUR.

[keeps21]

Thanks.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Johanna

The area you decribe is called GUR (ground under repair), and what you should have done is find the nearest spot outside the GUR where interference ceased to exist for your stroke and stance, and from that spot drop the ball within one clublength, not nearer the hole Rule 25-1b.

The spot where you dropped the ball would have been correct if your ball was lost in GUR.

This is an assumption not necessarily borne out by fact.  There is no provision in the rules for blue stakes to mark anything, so that could mean anything at all.  I've seen GUR where play is prohibited marked by white stakes or white lines, never by blue anything.  You may be right, but the information provided doesn't say that.  The best answer is to ask in the pro shop what the procedure is.

[Johanna]

Fourput,

The original question came from a member situated in the UK. I'm from the Netherlands and in Europe blue stakes are normally used to indicate GUR play prohibited.

Regards,

Johanna

[Dormie1360]

Hi Johanna, nice to see you here.

Hi Rick, checkout http://golfrules.freeforums.org/ .

Most of the folks there make me look like a rules neophyte.

FWIW, if I didn't no who Johanna was, I would have thought the same as you.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Johanna

Fourput,

The original question came from a member situated in the UK. I'm from the Netherlands and in Europe blue stakes are normally used to indicate GUR play prohibited.

Regards,

Johanna

Well, never having played in Europe, I hope I'm forgiven.  I am a past Colorado Golf Association rules official, so I have some experience, but never outside of the US.  In my experience, it is considered as really only proper to mark GUR with a line unless the area is extensive.  Stakes are too lacking in definition to properly identify most GUR areas.  I have participated in course marking in the past and I can only think of one instance where we let stakes mark GUR, and that's because the area was extensive, and we happened to run out of marking paint halfway around the area because of its size.  I can't recall ever seeing a blue stake on any course I've ever played or officiated on.

[Johanna]

Hi Fourputt - in my club we mark GUR in two different ways: 1) with blue stakes, play prohibited, installed by the green keepers for areas they want to protect (newly sown grass for example) and 2) with white lines installed by the competition committee or referees to indicate bad patches from which the player MAY drop the ball, or play the ball as it lies.

The course where I play is a woodland course and sometimes the white-lined areas where in such a spot that when the player had to drop his ball in accordance with the Local Rule,  he had to drop it in a far worse place than the GUR. We therefore marked the GUR in two ways, the green keeper doing the blue markings, and the Rules Officials or Competition Committee the white markings. This method of marking GUR is now widely used in Europe and is printed on the score card as (for example): "GUR - marked in blue, play prohibited, GUR marked with white lines, play allowed". Everybody happy

Johanna

[Rulesman]

I can confirm what Johanna says with one common variation.

Certainly blue stakes are used to identify an area of GUR play prohibited but as many courses have no other use for blue paint they will more often than not use white lines to define the margin.

Another use I have seen is around small plantations of young staked trees, where taking multiple relief simply wastes time.

[Johanna]

@ Rulesman - the only reason we have blue paint in my club is to paint the stakes blue. On grass blue paint is practically invisible.

[Rulesman]

Johanna

Do you white line the margins or ?

[MEfree]

I`m playing at Keystone in Colorado USA this season and we also have blue stakes that are used to mark Environmentally Sensitive Areas- I haven`t hit in one yet so I haven`t read the local signs or asked one of the Pros about it, but the card says "Environmentally Sensitive Areas- defined by signs.  Do not play ball from marked areas."

No mention on the card about whether you take a penalty or not, but most of these areas look like they should be hazards.

[Johanna]

MEfree - if blue stakes are used to mark environmentally sensitive areas (ESA's for short) it would  be helpful to players to add for example a red or yellow band round the top to indicate what kind of hazard it is, lateral or normal water hazard. When play is not allowed from these areas, the player cannot escape the one stroke penalty according to R. 26-1.

[Johanna]

Originally Posted by Rulesman

Johanna

Do you white line the margins or ?

No, that would be confusing players. The margins are line of sight between one stake and the next.

[Rulesman]

There seem to be a variety of colour codes for other than straightforward red(LWH), yellow(WH) and white(OOB).

In addition to those above, I have seen mentioned

- green (with appropriately coloured tops) for ESAs

- red, yellow or white with green tops also for ESAs,

- white with black tops to indicate the presence of OOB,

- white on two sides black on the others to indicate the sides of internal OOB,

- red or yellow with black tops to indicate the presence of LWH or WH.

When doing a pre-tournament inspection of a course I actually saw a line of purple stakes but had no idea what they were for. I asked the greenkeeper and he said it was where an irrigation pipe was going to go. The TD put a notice on the 1st tee.

Provided the LR specifies what means what, I can live with it but when there is no LR

[Johanna]

The Royal Golf and Country Club of Calcutta (India) has Out of Bounds marked with orange stakes !

[MEfree]

Originally Posted by Johanna

MEfree - if blue stakes are used to mark environmentally sensitive areas (ESA's for short) it would  be helpful to players to add for example a red or yellow band round the top to indicate what kind of hazard it is, lateral or normal water hazard. When play is not allowed from these areas, the player cannot escape the one stroke penalty according to R. 26-1.

I agree that the red/yellow bands would be helpful.

Doesn`t 26-1 only apply to Water Hazards?  If there is only unkept foliage/long grasss and no water in the ESA (and no red or yellow bands/stakes), why is the player to assume it is a water hazard?  If there is a local rule that says free drop, wouldn`t this take precedent?  (I haven`t read the posted signs so hopefully they clarify the situation, but the card is ambiguous and never calls these ESA areas a hazard).

[Rulesman]

Environmentally-Sensitive Areas

If an appropriate authority (i.e., a Government Agency or the like) prohibits entry into and/or play from an area on or adjoining the course for environmental reasons, the Committee should make a Local Rule clarifying the relief procedure.

The Committee has some discretion in terms of whether the area is defined as ground under repair , a water hazard or out of bounds . However, it may not simply define the area to be a water hazard if it does not meet the Definition of a “ Water Hazard ” and it should attempt to preserve the character of the hole.