Scramble Alternatives?

[MEfree]

It seems like someone is complaining about cheating or sandbagging (or both) about once a month at a scramble event they played in.

What alternative formats are there for charity and other events that attract lots of golfers with limited skills?

The beauty of a scramble is that it doesn`t force bad golfers to grind over every shot while giving them the opportunity to help the team out occasionally.  Some of the negatives include the potential for cheating (no non-team members playing in the group to verify the score or keep things honest) and the fact that nobody has any idea on what they shot on their own ball.

I would suggest combining random A, B, C and D players based on handicap and taking the best 3 to 6 gross scores relative to par of each player as follows:

A- 6 lowest

B- 5 lowest

C- 4 lowest

D- 3 lowest

Guys can pick up or do whatever they want on the 12-15 holes that don`t count for their team, but must have their 3 to 6 lowest scores verified by a playing competitor (as they would not be pair with teammates).  Lowest gross relative to par for the combined 18 wins.  An effort could be made to balance out teams (i.e. if you have one of the lower handicap A players, then you are paired with a higher handicap B or D player) or they could be determined by blind draw (either before or after the round).  I suppose you could have guys pick their own teams but play separately, but this could lead to some sandbagging if the B, C, and D players were really all A players.

What do you think?  What other alternatives do you suggest?

[VegasRenegade]

People will always cheat. My advice donate your money get drunk have fun and forget the score. Most of the fun is going out with your buds. It is not and never will be a contest

[Dave2512]

The complaints seem limited to a few people. In most of those threads the majority of the responses are from people suggesting to go out and have fun. It will be tough to find a viable alternative simply because the scramble is an easy way to host an event for golfers of varying abilities on the cheap that doesn't take much time or effort. That and you likely won't find many courses that will be willing to host something more complicated and time consuming because it effectively closes the course to the public for a longer time. Also the scramble is a good way for the course to make money on alcohol sales because the sponsors buy loads of drink tickets. A more serious format typically doesn't go hand in hand with the massive booze consumption associated with the scramble. I doubt a few whiners will be enough to get courses and hosts to change their minds.

[mdl]

I've never played in one of these things, but it seems like all the problems are taken care of if you have competitors keeping an eye on each other.  So why not do teams of two playing in foursomes or teams of three playing in sixsomes (yeah they'd be slow, but just tee everyone off with a bigger time gap between groups, total course time for the event shouldn't change too much)

[hendog]

I've done a 3-man scramble before where 2 teams played together. Wasn't that bad time wise. I'd say about normal for a round. The biggest issue is you either have to have 2 guys from different teams in a cart together or you add extra carts to the field which could add up quickly. It was an honest round though. No cheating and still lots of fun.

Agree though that 4-man is all about drinking and having fun. Consider entry a donation and forget it. See if you can cheat just enough to win but not so much that its ridiculous. This is the real challenge for the day Closest to the pin and longest drive contests can add some fun to this as well. You may still have cheaters but this is a little more egregious IMO. I can't see a bunch of people just grabbing the long drive sign and moving it way down and putting their name on it although I'm sure it happens. Big tourneys could just sit someone at those holes to watch. I've also seen club pros on a par 3 challenge each group to get it closer to the pin then the pro for some extra cash.

All in a days fun.

[Dave2512]

I've never played in one where teams weren't split into group A and B. In the corp events it's not uncommon to play in a group of strangers because it's as much about networking as anything. In those the host often decides who ends up where. The cheating and complaints seem to stem from the events where a group of friends can enter as a team and not be monitored by other participants. One thing I've seen that discourages cheating is when you don't know what prizes are awarded for what place. I've played in scrambles with prizes for last place. That and it's not uncommon for the best prizes to be awarded for closest to hole and longest drive etc. I avoid the scrambles set up to mock a real golf tournament, handicaps, big prizes. Those seem to lure the creeps that can't win a real tournament and that's when the trouble starts. IMO the biggest hassle a scramble presents is finding a designated driver for the ride home.

[WUTiger]

If you're talking about a charity event at a prominent golf course, why go with scramble? Try best ball.

IF you play best ball for the foursome, all players have an 18-hole score they can post from a famous course. Best ball was popular back in the 1980s, but seems to pretty well have disappeared during the 1990s.

[clubchamp]

Originally Posted by WUTiger

If you're talking about a charity event at a prominent golf course, why go with scramble? Try best ball.

IF you play best ball for the foursome, all players have an 18-hole score they can post from a famous course. Best ball was popular back in the 1980s, but seems to pretty well have disappeared during the 1990s.

The problem is the 7 hour round that goes along with it, now I'm basing that on the OPs comment about people with limited skill playing. It's another thing if you have seasoned golfers playing and the entry fee would usually be high if its at a prominent golf course.

Honestly a scramble for charity is more about the charity than the golf so just enjoy the day and be glad your money is going somewhere good. I only play in scrambles 1 or 2 times a year and both tournaments are for charities close to my heart so I have no problem with the cheating if it occurs.

[MEfree]

Originally Posted by clubchamp

The problem is the 7 hour round that goes along with it, now I'm basing that on the OPs comment about people with limited skill playing. It's another thing if you have seasoned golfers playing and the entry fee would usually be high if its at a prominent golf course.

Honestly a scramble for charity is more about the charity than the golf so just enjoy the day and be glad your money is going somewhere good. I only play in scrambles 1 or 2 times a year and both tournaments are for charities close to my heart so I have no problem with the cheating if it occurs.

Do you really think best ball is really that much slower than a scramble?  In a scramble, EVERYONE hits shots from the same spot until a putt is holed.  There can also be time spent figuring out which ball to play (especially if you have to use X number of drives from each player).  Of course, there is the advantage that everyone gets to play from the best ball instead of their own.

In a 4 person BB, you can pretty much pick up if you pop one OOB, hit in a lake, lose it in the woods (unless multiple guys from the group do it at the same time).  I would say that with good golfers focusing on speed, a 4 person BB could actually be played faster than a scramble...probably not the case with poor golfers, but I don`t think it would be a 7 hour round as long as you had one or two decent players in each group.