Gary Player's ridiculous comments

[AndrewM]

Was anyone else disgusted by his comments regarding "HGH, Creatine, or steroids"

I mean COME ON... first of all creatine isnt even in the same world.

Second, if he cant recognize the difference between baseball/football and golf in terms of how much benefit Any substance would give a player, then he has no right to make a single comment.

Third, Paul Azinger said it today, and it was what I was thinking all along... how will steroids help you make a 4 footer ?

Gary should be ashamed.

[gompers]

Golf is, and always has been mainly a game of skill, but it's increasingly a game of strength and endurance as well.

I'm not really defending Gary Player's comments, just saying that at the level that these guys play, anything that gives them a competitive advantage is something that needs to be looked into. If it wasn't the case, why would the PGA start testing next year?

[ChiChiIsMe]

I’m sure it’s a lot easier to putt when the HGH or steroids or whatever has taken your back pain away or made you feel 25 again on the 18th hole of round three.

[AndrewM]

Golf is, and always has been mainly a game of skill, but it's increasingly a game of strength and endurance as well.

I dont disagree at the face of it... but if we really sit down and analyze it... Brute strength means Zero in golf... Ask Charles Howell

Second, according to Fox News, steroids make you moody (roid rage, right?), give you high blood pressure and heart problems... I am not sure how that would help on a golf course... i mean, you hit a bad shot and you start breaking clubs. Or you are so emotional you cant hold yourself together down the stretch... seems like a losing proposition to me. third, I dont believe any golf tour will ever institute drug testing (well for "performance enhancers") Or maybe, just maybe we have all been lied to by the media and the positive effects of added testosterone in a middle aged or older male, is actually a good thing and Does restore an edge they may have lost, with no real side effects? But you cant have your cake and eat it too... they are either bad in all the way the media says, so therefore not beneficial to golf specifically at least... or maybe they arent as bad as we have been led to believe... and our whole outlook on them should change??? something to think about...

[gompers]

http://sports.espn.go.com/golf/news/story?id=2915988

It's inevitable that the PGA will start testing for drugs. Remember steroids aren't just for growing big muscles, but also for enhancing endurance (think cycling), or for helping to speed recovery (ever get sore after playing 36 holes?).

If brute strength means zero in golf, why are so many golfers working out and getting in shape?

I'm not saying any drug will make you a better golfer by itself, but I'd rather the PGA address it now before we end up with a baseball-esque situation.

[AndrewM]

If brute strength means zero in golf, why are so many golfers working out and getting in shape?

Why are they working out? For the exact reasons you said, endurance and fitness to keep up stamina on the course... NOT purely for brute strength... IE, training to move a 400lb linebacker out of the way.

If you cant see the difference between golf and baseball/football or even cycling... then the media has done its job. If you thinking moving that linebacker out of the way... hitting a 400ft home run, or cycling 100 miles and sprinting up mountains is the same as what happens on the golf course, then I cant help you. Golf requires SO much more skill, finesse and mental strength than any of those other sports that are having issues. In baseball, You can hit a homerun anywhere from the foul line in left field to the foul line in right field.... Try hitting a 400 yard drive down a 60 ft fairway... think there might be a difference? Oh and if you miss the baseball and it only dribbles between shortstop and first base, you're still good to go with a base hit.... If your 400 yard drive is mishit and only goes to the ladies tee, you're in trouble. But I guess you are right in a way... if your back hurts after 18 holes, you cant take advil anymore either (that helps you play pain free right?) If you go to the doctor and you have an enlarged prostate, sorry, thats just the way it is... oh you have a vitamin deficiency and need more calcium for stronger bones... Nope, too bad. You have arthritis and cant play? sorry nothing we can do for you.... If we actually sit back and analyze the argument aside from the media and all the hype they stir up... we can come to some pretty substantially different and more universally beneficial conclusions

[gompers]

I don't think you can pin it all on the media. Sure they are partially to blame for overemphasizing things, but there are legitimate concerns about the integrity of the sport.

Golf is different than those sports, but it's still an athletic competition. Strength certainly CAN help on the tour. Getting clubs through thick rough after you've driven it 300+ into the stuff in the first place requires some amount of strength. The difference between golf and other sports is that you need to have far more control of that strength.

Advil is a pain releiver. It just masks the pain. It doesn't help your body heal. HGH does help your body heal. Your body hurts for a reason. It's because something isn't right, and it needs to recover. It might not be a dramatic difference between a pain-free body due to advil and a pain-free body due to HGH, but when every thousandth of an inch in clubs and one stroke can mean victory or defeat, it MIGHT make a difference.

I don't see what it hurts to test for performance enhancing drugs on the tour.

[dwsell]

hmmm.....steroids. Come to think of it Phil Mickelson has been looking rather "cut" lately.

Seriously. I can't see this really turn into anything. There could be players using performance enhancers, but i don't think there are many of them and they are probably not your top notch golfers. PGA will get a drug program and I think that will pretty much end anybodys willingness to try a performance enhancer. The reward in golf would not be worth the risk. However, it would be hilarious if Brad Faxon was caught with a "whizinator"

[Franco!]

they have these stupid random drug tests too. Random drug test probably included corey pavin, brad faxon, and mike weir. If youre gonna do it, do it all the way, nobody gets left out. The USGA and R&A; are just afraid of their game being tarnished, imagine what would happen if someone like say, phil or vijay or godforbid tiger tested postive, golfers would stick around and continue to watch the players, but casual fans wont cause of the steriods. I'd listen to gary player, hes so insane that he might know what hes saying.

[iacas]

Second, according to Fox News, steroids make you moody (roid rage, right?), give you high blood pressure and heart problems... I am not sure how that would help on a golf course... i mean, you hit a bad shot and you start breaking clubs. Or you are so emotional you cant hold yourself together down the stretch... seems like a losing proposition to me.

There's more out there than steroids. Barry Bonds never really did "steroids" remember - but he's clearly done something. Mood levelers could even be performance enhancing, or something that calms nerves (Cabrera's nicotine, even?).

third, I dont believe any golf tour will ever institute drug testing (well for "performance enhancers")

I'll take that bet. How much? As high as you want, because I won't be paying out.

If you thinking moving that linebacker out of the way... hitting a 400ft home run, or cycling 100 miles and sprinting up mountains is the same as what happens on the golf course, then I cant help you.

Again, it's not just steroids, but even if it were, there are several ways to use steroids (and several kinds of steroids). For golfers, they could help alleviate the aches and pains and allow for faster recovery.

In baseball, You can hit a homerun anywhere from the foul line in left field to the foul line in right field.... Try hitting a 400 yard drive down a 60 ft fairway...

I tend to use this as a general rule: when someone feels they have to exaggerate to make their point, their point is bunk.

If we actually sit back and analyze the argument aside from the media and all the hype they stir up... we can come to some pretty substantially different and more universally beneficial conclusions

Then please go ahead and do so, because you've not yet done any of that here. Your bad examples about Advil and so on lack merit and common sense.

[AndrewM]

As far as exaggerated points... how many drives at the open this year were over 400 yards?? An exaggeration, I dont think so.

Next, when you have Actual personal or professional experience, you let me know. Until then every opinion you have is based on conjecture and what you hear from Fox News. If you want some REAL knowledge, read this, its a start at least: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...AGJ0AAI981.DTL As far as my advil example... the issue of back pain was brought up by a previous poster and I applied a perfectly legitimate counterpoint. In addition, as you even noted... what about nicotine? No more smoking during a tournament? And you are right, there are LOTS of things out there... no more cortisone shots either right?

[Q.Q.Quillume]

Was anyone else disgusted by his comments regarding "HGH, Creatine, or steroids"

No, I wasn't disgusted by Gary Player's comments, I think he has the right to make any comment he wishes to make and I'm not convinced his comments were "ridiculous".

[dwsell]

Does any one know what kind of drug policy the PGA has? Obviously illegal substances such as steroids, marijuana, cocaine, etc. are not allowed. But what about over the counter substances, are certain ones banned?

[gogolfing]

I know of his history and place in the game, but I've always found Gary Player to be a pompous, self-righteous ass. I think this is just another example of it; when I have seen him on the Golf Channel, he is always preaching about something, whether it is fitness, eating or how to play a shot. Goosen's comments on the Open coverage yesterday summed it up for me. If Player is going to come out with this stuff, he has to name some names so he doesn't paint all pros with the same brush. If he couldn't name names because of a promise he made, he should have kept his mouth shut. It will be interesting to see if he gets the cold shoulder from his team at the President's Cup in the fall.

[Big Don]

Was anyone else disgusted by his comments regarding "HGH, Creatine, or steroids"

I'd be astonished if some golfers weren't taking performance enhancing drugs. If strength isn't an important part of the modern game then why are professional golfers doing so much gym work? Steroids and HGH support muscle building and strength attainment. Bottom line, put big money on the table and some people will be tempted to cheat.

[iacas]

I know of his history and place in the game, but I've always found Gary Player to be a pompous, self-righteous ass. I think this is just another example of it; when I have seen him on the Golf Channel, he is always preaching about something, whether it is fitness, eating or how to play a shot. Goosen's comments on the Open coverage yesterday summed it up for me. If Player is going to come out with this stuff, he has to name some names so he doesn't paint all pros with the same brush. If he couldn't name names because of a promise he made, he should have kept his mouth shut. It will be interesting to see if he gets the cold shoulder from his team at the President's Cup in the fall.

Good points. I've never cared for Gary Player's personality. It's almost as if he's got a short man's complex... always bragging about something, even if it's just how many miles he's flown in his career. Ugh.

[Shindig]

I'll believe it when someone bends an X-shaft in half with his bare hands.

Seriously, unless there's a different definition of "performance enhancing drugs" than I'm familiar with, I wonder what's on his mind.

I do wonder if ADD medication would count as performance enhancing, or if protein shakes would count. I doubt it on the latter.

[flap]

My 2 cents.Name the names or shut the hell up!!!I work in the "Media" and know first hand how front pages are chosen and comments like his are perfect fodder.Gary,Put up or shut up!!!