2013 Women's US Open Discussion Thread

[BostonBrew]

Originally Posted by SoundandFury

On a more serious note, am I the only one who thinks Park's sustained success is bad for the LPGA tour?  It's not like it's destination TV to begin with, but the fact it's basically become the Korean Ladies Professional Golf Association Tour completely seals the deal.  If you don't think the LPGA would be more popular if it was Creamer, Gulbis, Korda, Brittany Lincicome, or basically any of the girls from Big Break, you're nuts.  This is obviously somewhat subjective, but I really have no interest in watching a golf tournament where the majority of the players on the leaderboard can't, or can barely speak English.

Maybe you should re-evaluate why you watch professional golf? If the top players' inability to speak fluent English is a reason for you to not watch, then I'd say you're not a golf fan.

I agree that, as Americans, we'd have a higher interest if more Americans were top players. But that's because of national pride, not because the other girls don't speak English as their primary language. Also, Stacy Lewis has won twice this year (and she was also #1 on the WGR until Park's recent run). Cristie Kerr and Jennifer Johnson both have wins this year. And the girls you mentioned are almost always near the top of the leaderboard. So I'm not buying your argument.

[iacas]

Maybe you should re-evaluate why you watch professional golf? If the top players' inability to speak fluent English is a reason for you to not watch, then I'd say you're not a golf fan.

I call BS on that. I like players with stories, players who give interviews, players I can relate to. Those things are difficult if you can't speak very good English. I don't like when primarily foreign playing players (European Tour, male) win majors either because I like to see them playing. Helps you become more of a fan by getting to know them more.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by BostonBrew

Maybe you should re-evaluate why you watch professional golf? If the top players' inability to speak fluent English is a reason for you to not watch, then I'd say you're not a golf fan.

I agree that, as Americans, we'd have a higher interest if more Americans were top players. But that's because of national pride, not because the other girls don't speak English as their primary language. Also, Stacy Lewis has won twice this year (and she was also #1 on the WGR until Park's recent run). Cristie Kerr and Jennifer Johnson both have wins this year. And the girls you mentioned are almost always near the top of the leaderboard. So I'm not buying your argument.

Originally Posted by iacas

I call BS on that. I like players with stories, players who give interviews, players I can relate to. Those things are difficult if you can't speak very good English.

I don't like when primarily foreign playing players (European Tour, male) win majors either because I like to see them playing. Helps you become more of a fan by getting to know them more.

I think he threw you guys both for a loop with his "speaking English" comment at the end.  Sounded a lot more like a rant against unattractive girls to me.  A heck of a lot of these girls speak perfectly fine english, but he didn't mention them.  Yani Tseng for example.  She has an accent, yes, but speaks quite well.  Why did he list the "Big Break" girls instead of her?  My guess?  He thinks shes a troll.

[BostonBrew]

Originally Posted by iacas

I call BS on that. I like players with stories, players who give interviews, players I can relate to. Those things are difficult if you can't speak very good English.

I don't like when primarily foreign playing players (European Tour, male) win majors either because I like to see them playing. Helps you become more of a fan by getting to know them more.

I must be in a different boat then. I'm not a story guy. I just want to see good golf. I become a fan based on how they play, not on how they conduct interviews.

[iacas]

I must be in a different boat then. I'm not a story guy. I just want to see good golf. I become a fan based on how they play, not on how they conduct interviews.

I don't rate the LPGA as particularly good golf, so I need more. :)

[sacm3bill]

Originally Posted by SoundandFury

Quote:

Originally Posted by sacm3bill

Well now I regret the thumbs up I just gave you in another thread... :-)

I mean come on - it's bad enough to be that shallow, worse to actually admit it, and worse still that she's not even that bad looking!

You're kidding right? I'm going to guess that was sarcasm, because she seriously looks like a troll.

Nope, wasn't kidding. I'm as shallow as the next guy, but I don't see a troll.

[SoundandFury]

Originally Posted by BostonBrew

Maybe you should re-evaluate why you watch professional golf? If the top players' inability to speak fluent English is a reason for you to not watch, then I'd say you're not a golf fan.

I agree that, as Americans, we'd have a higher interest if more Americans were top players. But that's because of national pride, not because the other girls don't speak English as their primary language. Also, Stacy Lewis has won twice this year (and she was also #1 on the WGR until Park's recent run). Cristie Kerr and Jennifer Johnson both have wins this year. And the girls you mentioned are almost always near the top of the leaderboard. So I'm not buying your argument.

They break the top 10, but they don't seem to break through, and certainly not in majors.  What's the stat, 7 or 9 or 9 of 11 (i forget the exact stat) of the last ladies' majors have been won by koreans?

It's not entirely a nationalism thing.  Of course I'd always prefer Americans on the top, but I enjoy watching Suzann Petterson and Annika play golf, just like I enjoy watching Dirk play basketball.  I just find the korean players on the LPGA tour incredibly boring, robotic, and unlikable (and not in the Tiger "I'm not here to talk, I'm here to f***ing destroy everyone in the field" sort of way).  They're utterly devoid of personality.  I'm not a huge Phil fan, but I enjoy watching him play if only to cheer against him because at least there's something to the guy.

[SoundandFury]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I think he threw you guys both for a loop with his "speaking English" comment at the end.  Sounded a lot more like a rant against unattractive girls to me.  A heck of a lot of these girls speak perfectly fine english, but he didn't mention them.  Yani Tseng for example.  She has an accent, yes, but speaks quite well.  Why did he list the "Big Break" girls instead of her?  My guess?  He thinks shes a troll.

Well, it's a bit of both.  It would certainly help if she wasn't so hard to look at.

[chriskzoo]

Originally Posted by BostonBrew

I must be in a different boat then. I'm not a story guy. I just want to see good golf. I become a fan based on how they play, not on how they conduct interviews.

See, this is my problem with the LPGA - while the golf is more "relateable" to the game of a good weekend golfer and there is value to watching that - it is simply an inferior product.  It's like watching the WNBA.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by chriskzoo

See, this is my problem with the LPGA - while the golf is more "relateable" to the game of a good weekend golfer and there is value to watching that - it is simply an inferior product.  It's like watching the WNBA.

I disagree with this comparison.  It's not like these ladies are out there hacking it around and shooting 80's.  The top of their leaderboards are littered with 66's and 67's on a daily basis just like the men.  They're damn good golfers.  The big difference, obviously, is power, but that doesn't really come across too well on TV anyway.

The PGA, Champ., and LPGA products, on TV, are a lot more similar than the NBA is to the WNBA.  They show a close up of a solid swing, a ball land in the fairway, then on the green, then putts being made.  The difference between womens golf and mens golf is just speed ... very similar to the difference in tennis.  And, again, because you don't really SEE the speed difference on TV, they aren't quite THAT different.

The visual difference between the NBA and WNBA is enormous, because the biggest draw (I think) about the NBA is how much of the game is played around the basket ABOVE the rim.  The WNBA, not so much.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I disagree with this comparison.  It's not like these ladies are out there hacking it around and shooting 80's.  The top of their leaderboards are littered with 66's and 67's on a daily basis just like the men.  They're damn good golfers.  The big difference, obviously, is power, but that doesn't really come across too well on TV anyway.

How can you disagree with a comparison between the LPGA and another woman's professional sport? :P

And yes, they're occasionally shooting 66 or 67, but so could a +1 handicapper. It's not an awesome sport to watch.

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

The visual difference between the NBA and WNBA is enormous, because the biggest draw (I think) about the NBA is how much of the game is played around the basket ABOVE the rim.  The WNBA, not so much.

I still think the comparison is appropriate even if you want to get into that. The speed is apparent to me, even on TV, and the general skillset is so much higher tuned - putting, short game, quite literally everything.

The LPGA is boring. I'll watch it in person (because you're outside on a golf course, and the crowds are tiny), but watching it on TV… eh. I'd rather practice putting on my carpet or, well, doing a lot of different things.

Heck, I'd rather watch college golf (or the U.S. Amateur) than virtually any women's event on television.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by iacas

How can you disagree with a comparison between the LPGA and another woman's professional sport? :P

And yes, they're occasionally shooting 66 or 67, but so could a +1 handicapper. It's not an awesome sport to watch.

The exact same way that further up this thread, several people can disagree with the comparison between one dominating major winning golfer and another dominating major winning golfer.   So there. :PPPPP

Originally Posted by iacas

I still think the comparison is appropriate even if you want to get into that. The speed is apparent to me, even on TV, and the general skillset is so much higher tuned - putting, short game, quite literally everything.

The LPGA is boring. I'll watch it in person (because you're outside on a golf course, and the crowds are tiny), but watching it on TV… eh. I'd rather practice putting on my carpet or, well, doing a lot of different things.

Heck, I'd rather watch college golf (or the U.S. Amateur) than virtually any women's event on television.

Yeah, and I almost added into my comment something about laymen.  Golf pros and instructors, and other expert golfers, are certainly going to see things differently than most.  You guys are going to notice a lot of things that us regular joes won't.

Of course, I don't know what I'm doing here ... somehow I've backed myself into this corner arguing the merits of watching women play golf when, to be 100% honest, I rarely do so.

[dave67az]

The top-20 PGA Tour golfers currently have a combined scoring average of 69.82.

The top-20 LPGA Tour golfers currently have a combined scoring average of 70.81.

If you're going to find a reason not to watch, you might want to pick something other than how they don't score as well because the numbers don't back you up.

They play from different tees.  They don't hit it as far.  Their caddies sometimes appear too intrusive into their games (my major complaint).  Inbee Park isn't as cute as Tiger Woods (or whatever argument you guys were trying to make).

But the shot-making, particularly in the short game, is just as good as the men (barely a 1-stroke difference) and the scoring shows it.

And some of you guys sound like the chicks I know who, when discussing football, can't seem to get past the "I'm a Patriots fan because Tom Brady is so dreamy" crap.  Really?  All the free porn on the internet and you think any of us who watch golf do it just because the girls are cute?  Yes, some of them ARE cute, but seriously I doubt that's the main reason anyone watches the LPGA (unless their parents have their internet locked down and they can't find their sister's Victoria's Secret catalog).

[BostonBrew]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Of course, I don't know what I'm doing here ... somehow I've backed myself into this corner arguing the merits of watching women play golf when, to be 100% honest, I rarely do so.

Hahaha, I had to silently withdraw from the argument as well. This past Women's US Open was the first LPGA event I've watched and followed. And as much as I enjoyed it, I don't really see myself watching non-Major events. But I felt the argument needed to be made haha.

[geauxforbroke]

Originally Posted by dave67az

The top-20 PGA Tour golfers currently have a combined scoring average of 69.82.

The top-20 LPGA Tour golfers currently have a combined scoring average of 70.81.

And I can probably average 70 on a 5800 yard course. Doesn't mean it would be fun to watch.

[dave67az]

Originally Posted by geauxforbroke

And I can probably average 70 on a 5800 yard course. Doesn't mean it would be fun to watch.

Your driving distance determines the tees you play.

What's your driving distance, and what tees SHOULD you be playing from?

And the most important question...can you score just as well as the ladies if you are playing the tees you're supposed to be playing according to your driving distance?

I could kick some ass at the special olympics.  Not sure what your point is.

[geauxforbroke]

Originally Posted by dave67az

I could kick some ass at the special olympics.  Not sure what your point is.

Low scores don't necessarily equal entertaining golf. Thought I was pretty clear about that.

[dave67az]

Originally Posted by geauxforbroke

Low scores don't necessarily equal entertaining golf. Thought I was pretty clear about that.

I'd hazard a bet that most people would disagree with you.

Seeing people playing from appropriate tees and scoring consistently below par is what most people find entertaining (read this thread again if you don't agree, because it's a pretty common theme).

You made the comment that if you were playing from tees suited for shorter hitters you could do just as well.  Again, I don't see how you playing inappropriate tees compares to someone playing the correct tees.  You're the one who brought up the 5800 yard stat...not me.