Who is worse to play with? Cheaters or High Handicappers?

[jmcd009]

I find most hackers are cheaters. They just don't play to the rules of the game... gimmies, mullies, drop a ball when OB, nudging the ball to get a better lie, etc.

do you call illegal defense in pick up basketball?

if it's not a competition or counting towards a handicap the rules don't really matter.

[ChiChiIsMe]

But the worst are the sand baggers in my men's league who carry a high HC, but magically have their best rounds in tournament play.

sandbaggers are cheaters.

[iacas]

by no means am I picking on Iacas, it's friendly jabbing...I don't mean any harm by it.....in fact I like his style of posting as well.....brings alot to the table with it imho.....

Hey hey, I can take it. I wasn't born with the Rules of Golf in my hand, no, but my mom did fall asleep on a copy of The Decisions on the Rules of Golf when I was six months old, she tells me.

Nah... And seriously, as I said, my answer depends on what you mean by "high" handicappers. If you mean 18, I'd rather play with them than any kind of cheater. If you mean 36, well, what kind of cheater are you talking about?

sandbaggers are cheaters.

So are reverse sandbaggers... but I still enjoy taking their money. They truly ARE only cheating themselves. Heh heh.

[Arsenal Forever]

Now that I've read every post in this thread, even though we're decent golfers, I guess you can qualify us as cheaters. Unless things really get messy, we don't take too many penalty strokes, we just note it on our card. We "give" each other putts that rimmed around the hole, and occasionally we improve our lie. It's not really a matter of cheating to cheat the game or act any better than we are, it's just to make what father-son time we have more relaxed, we're just having a good time.

Then, of course, every spring time when I play for my High School I obviously play by the rules, as I do with my dad at that time of year just to get used to it again.

I do know most of the rules though, pretty much all of them that everyone else knows by heart.

[Jeepthrills]

Now that I've read

I would tend to disagree with this. I think many of us do more than note on our cards what the score would be. If I blow one into the woods off the tee, I hit a provisional. I don't improve my lie and I don't count putts that lip out. Even when someone gives me one, I will still putt out. If I miss, it goes on my card.

[Arsenal Forever]

I would tend to disagree with this. I think many of us do more than note on our cards what the score would be. If I blow one into the woods off the tee, I hit a provisional. I don't improve my lie and I don't count putts that lip out. Even when someone gives me one, I will still putt out. If I miss, it goes on my card.

I meant like, we don't account lost balls into our score when we're trying to have a more relaxing round, we keep notes at the bottom....Like for one hole we may have "OB off Drive" or others we may have "Hit fairway, GIR."

[campb1pr]

I think that you have to categorize a little more clearly for this question - many posts have brought this up, but for example, I don't consider my father in law a "cheater" even though he routinely improves his lie, does not putt out completely, takes mulligans, etc. He is playing only for his enjoyment, and as a matter of fact, doesn't even keep score anymore. However, he is a pleasure to play with, and since he is not keeping score, nor sticking completely by the rules for himself, he plays rather quickly. He is playing as what I would call a "recreational only" golfer. I do play by the letter and spirit of the rules, call all applicable penalties on myself(when I know the rules), etc. I would call myself a "competitive" golfer. By that I do not mean that I play in a bunch of tournaments or try to win money, or whatever, it just means that I keep score, and keep a HCP index, and use it to compare myself against other golfers and the course I am playing. I wouldn't call anyone who falls into my personal classification of "recreation only" golfer a cheater, because they are not technically playing the same game as I am. As long as they follow good etiquette, and can keep pace, do they really bother you? (They may, but that is a matter of personal preference.)

The ones that bother me are the "competitive" golfers who cheat to gain a perceived advantage over others. Either sandbaggers, or straight cheaters. Sandbaggers bother me more, as they can be seen on the course following all the rules, and scoring exactly what they get (or even calling "extra" penalties on themselves to boost scores) and then when it comes time for that club tournament, they routinely shoot 5-10 strokes below their handicap.

If I could use my designations, I would rather play with a high handicap competitive golfer or a recreational only golfer, as long as they know and follow decent golf etiquette, and can keep a decent pace. I don't mind slowing down for other players too much, though.

[ChiChiIsMe]

So are reverse sandbaggers... but I still enjoy taking their money. They truly ARE only cheating themselves. Heh heh.

I sure felt like a reverse 'bagger after my last few rounds........hopefully 2 weeks off will have me straightened out!

[Cleveland Gunmetal]

No doubt about it - Cheaters! I have no problem whatsoever playing with someone with a high handicap, is starting out, isn't very good, whatever as long as they are enjoyable to play with. You can still have a high handicap and play ready golf. What I can't stand is people who cheat to try and validate their "ability". Or... if I'm getting beat because someone is cheating every other hole and they tell me about it, because lets face it the cheaters have to validate their ability verbally too.

[wachesawgolfer]

. He is playing as what I would call a "recreational only" golfer. they are not technically playing the same game as I am. As long as they follow good etiquette, and can keep pace, do they really bother you? (They may, but that is a matter of personal preference.)

The ones that bother me are the "competitive" golfers who cheat to gain a perceived advantage over others. below their handicap.

I agree totally. Calling people "cheaters" who simply play for fun is crazy and unfair. Its the "competitive" golfers or the ones who are out to maintain a legal score or handicap, who skirt the rules who should be called cheaters.

[lamebums]

. He is playing as what I would call a "recreational only" golfer. they are not technically playing the same game as I am. As long as they follow good etiquette, and can keep pace, do they really bother you? (They may, but that is a matter of personal preference.)

Yeah, I have to agree with this. So what if the guy is kicking his ball out from under the tree or fluffing up his lie in the rough? If his definition of fun is that (and he certainly isn't having fun hacking away in the trees all day), let him do it. If he ends up in an official round, he'll just end up reverse-sandbagging. That's his problem.

[Leek]

Yeah, I have to agree with this. So what if the guy is kicking his ball out from under the tree or fluffing up his lie in the rough? If his definition of fun is that (and he certainly isn't having fun hacking away in the trees all day), let him do it. If he ends up in an official round, he'll just end up reverse-sandbagging. That's his problem.

I won't play with people who do that regularly.

[King Cobra II]

Playing with cheaters defintly isn't any fun. I have a friend who will take two drives, lose both, take a drop, be on the green after two and be putting for par. Its frustrating because I'm competitive, but yet I give very honest scores, so he always ends up very close to me even though I actually shoot about ten shots better. Playing with high HC's isn't as bad, sometimes they can even help you with your game a little bit. Unless it's someone you don't know. Sometimes when I see these guys hitting 280 down the middle, my ego gets in the way and I don't play within myself, and that costs me.

[marto97]

I think this is a no brainier, I hate playing with someone that cheats it doesn't matter if they are a high or low handicap. Golf is an honorable game and cheating has no place in it period. Playing with high handicappers is part of the game and it doesn't bother me at all.