Nicklaus as an architect

[RandallT]

There's a course right smack in the middle of Hilton Head Island (Indigo Run Plantation) that is called "Golden Bear." My parents live there, so it's the de facto family retreat course, and we have scorecards from years and years of grudge matches. Maybe it's just because it's a family thing, but that course is probably the most fun of any course I've ever played.

Lots of variety in the way the holes set up.  

Over the years, it has gone through many different phases- perhaps the peak to me in early 2000s when there was great technology on the carts, and the pristine conditions near the peak. I think the economics of it all has taken its toll, so the feel is less high-end now. Far fewer amenities and the course conditions are not quite as perfect as it once was. Not sure how it is faring after the recent storm that hit the island.

But for a really nice test of golf where you want variety and a chance to use strategy, I think the Golden Bear is top notch. I've always wondered how representative of his other designs this course was. To give the course his moniker in such obvious fashion, I assumed he was proud of it.

[Buckeyebowman]

I also remember an article I read where Jack, and a bunch of other pros, were invited to play Greg Norman's first "resort course" design at Hobe Sound, in Florida. After the round he wanted to hear their comments. Remember, this was supposed to be a resort. Jack remarked that there were far too many 200+ yard forced carries over water, and one comment Nicklaus made really stuck in my brain. He told Norman, "Look Greg. As good as I am, I still have a hard time hitting a long iron to the hood of a car!"

[1badbadger]

19 minutes ago, Buckeyebowman said:

I also remember an article I read where Jack, and a bunch of other pros, were invited to play Greg Norman's first "resort course" design at Hobe Sound, in Florida. After the round he wanted to hear their comments. Remember, this was supposed to be a resort. Jack remarked that there were far too many 200+ yard forced carries over water, and one comment Nicklaus made really stuck in my brain. He told Norman, "Look Greg. As good as I am, I still have a hard time hitting a long iron to the hood of a car!"

Yeah, Greg designed a course in Fort Worth next to The Texas Motor Speedway called The Creeks at Beechwood.  It was so hard and just not very playable.  A writer called it "tighter than a camel's rear in a sandstorm."  The first time I played it, I piped one down the middle on the first hole, got to my ball and there was a huge tree in the middle of the fairway!  I couldn't go over it or around it, and going under was no bargain.  If I'm in the middle of the fairway, I feel I shouldn't have to pitch-out because I'm blocked.  It was like that all day.  When we got done I felt like I had gotten in a fight and lost.  Norman's name has been removed from the course and it has been re-designed.

I like Jack's stuff though.  He tends to offer a lot of tees (5 or 6 sets of tees) and the courses I've played are very straight forward.  I think one of his strengths is his practice areas.  The facility at Cordillera Ranch just outside of San Antonio has a huge range with actual greens for targerts, several putting greens, practice bunkers, and 3 full size practice holes.

[Top100Golfer]

The standard take on Nicklaus as an architect is that his courses are too difficult. Ie, he designs them for his game and for big hitters, frustrating a golfer who isn't able to hit a draw with a two-iron off a hanging lie to a green over water. I understand the criticism but think he is misunderstood. Partially, you should play from tees that suit your game. Yea, if you are playing the blue tees but should really be playing the white then his courses will kill you.

My own experiences on the 3 and 1/2 of his courses that I have played have been good. I found Mayacama in Santa Rosa to be eminently playable and interesting with a lot of shot variety.

I also enjoyed his Cabo del Sol course in Mexico. Really beautiful and challenging without being killer. The same for Muirfield Village, which I think he would call his masterpiece. Jack is not a fan of uphill shots and the thing that makes Muirfield interesting is that there are almost no uphill shots to greens, they virtually all play down hill. The par 5 holes at Muirfield Village are especially good holes.

I also enjoyed Sebonack which he designed with Tom Doak. If I understood it right Nicklaus did most of the tee to green work and Doak did the greens. The course is worth going out of your way to play.

He doesn't get as much love as the minimalist architects like Coore/Crenshaw and Doak who are obviously in vogue, but Jack's courses I believe will stand the test of time.

[holmesgr]

I just played his tournament course at PGA West. I thought it was a fair course that rewarded good shots, but the greens were on the smaller side. If you were going to miss, it was better to miss long as there were plenty of bunkers short of the hole.  I also liked that there were not many, if any, blind shots, which makes a resort course very difficult when you are playing it only 1 or 2 times during the visit. Just about every green set at a 45 degree angle, so if you could hit draws and fades on command you had a better chance of holding the green.