3 steps forward, 2 steps back

[Hatchman]

23 minutes ago, Marty2019 said:

Now, if I had the nationally recognized Erik Barzeski as my instructor, I'd undoubtedly be getting a lot more for my money.   Seriously.  But I live in Jacksonville, so I don't get that opportunity.  

Hands on instruction, or would you consider online instruction now since you've have one on one already and have benefited?   Online works also.

[Marty2019]

16 minutes ago, Kalnoky said:

Harvey Penick said a good instructor can fix in one (1) hour what it would take you 6 months to figure out on your own. Or he said something very similar to that...

It's true.   After probably a hundred buckets of balls over the last few years, and hundreds of youtube videos, I still had no clue as to what was the major issue with my golf swing.  Amazing. 

Just now, Hatchman said:

Hands on instruction, or would you consider online instruction now since you've have one on one already and have benefited?   Online works also.

Let me finish the ones I am taking and then move on to that type of thing.   I bought 10 lessons, and I still have 5 to go before May something.  

[iacas]

29 minutes ago, Kalnoky said:

Harvey Penick said a good instructor can fix in one (1) hour what it would take you 6 months to figure out on your own. Or he said something very similar to that...

Or might never figure out.

@Marty2019 I'll respond more from home later tonight.

[Hatchman]

I got you @Marty2019 .  :)

Edited December 23, 2016 by Hatchman

[Rainmaker]

On 12/23/2016 at 4:05 PM, Kalnoky said:

Harvey Penick said a good instructor can fix in one (1) hour what it would take you 6 months to figure out on your own. Or he said something very similar to that...

Yeah . . .but that's not to say it's going to fix it *permanently*.  I've never taken a lesson from Harvey Penick . .and he is a legend . .so maybe he could fix me permanently in 1 hr.  However, what I find is more to the point of this thread  . .I keep learning and building on what I've learned - but I periodically "lose" things.   One of my big tendencies is to take it back way too flat and laid off.  I know this and I know how not to do it.  But periodically I will catch myself doing exactly this on video.  

3 steps forward and 2 steps back is still 1 step forward!  1 step forward is, in my estimation, pretty good!

I will also join the chorus of those who don't necessarily 100% get good vibes from the advice your relayed from your teacher.  It does sound like you're a little all over the place.  Take my teacher, for example . .if I come back to the lesson tee and say "yeah - everything's going great . .I did what you told me and it's working awesome" . .he'll say "show me" . .and if it's not right then we're going to do it again.  Pretty much no matter what I say . . he will look at my swing and see the same thing every time . .this week, next week . .a month from now if it's still the case.  We tend to work on one thing until we get it.  

I could be wrong about this - but I don't think shoulder tilt is something he would even talk about at all.  We did work on flattening the shaft - for about 6 months . .and I'm sure we'll revisit it again.  That is, in my strongest opinion, not a 1 lesson topic.  And to go from shoulder tilt, to flatten the shaft to weight shift in 3 lessons is kinda . .well . .scattered . .again, imo.  If you had all 3 of those problems there is literally 0% chance you've corrected them all and are ready to move on.  At your first lesson you walked in with a "biggest problem"..whatever it was . ..I'm sure you still have that problem and it hasn't changed.     

Speaking for only myself, of course . .learning golf is a pretty difficult undertaking.  It takes lots and lots of practice . .and I'm not always on a curve of constant improvement . .there are peaks, valleys, plateaus, etc.  Good luck and hang in there!

[iacas]

1 hour ago, Rainmaker said:

and if it's not right then we're going to do it again.  Pretty much no matter what I say . . he will look at my swing and see the same thing every time . .this week, next week . .a month from now if it's still the case.  We tend to work on one thing until we get it.  

That's a reasonably good sign that you have a pretty good instructor. Often the bad instructors feel that they have to give you something else new each week. Whether they do this because they feel THEY have to show progress, or they feel you have to feel as if you've progressed or you'll stop coming, or both… I don't know.

I tell students when they ask me when to come back for their next lesson:

• Come back when you've got this piece to the point where you don't have to think about it too much.
• Come back when you lose the feel or want to check in or brush up on this piece.

The latter happens occasionally, and often it surfaces when you get a tinkerer who will take what he learned in the lesson and try to look up "advanced" or "different" ways to do it online.

1 hour ago, Rainmaker said:

And to go from shoulder tilt, to flatten the shaft to weight shift in 3 lessons is kinda . .well . .scattered . .again, imo.  If you had all 3 of those problems there is literally 0% chance you've corrected them all and are ready to move on.  At your first lesson you walked in with a "biggest problem"..whatever it was . ..I'm sure you still have that problem and it hasn't changed.

I tend to agree with that. Now obviously neither @Rainmaker nor myself have seen your swing or lessons, but that's a lot to cover in a few lessons. We could be wrong. But I'd bet on it.

[Marty2019]

On 12/27/2016 at 9:06 AM, iacas said:

That's a reasonably good sign that you have a pretty good instructor. Often the bad instructors feel that they have to give you something else new each week. Whether they do this because they feel THEY have to show progress, or they feel you have to feel as if you've progressed or you'll stop coming, or both… I don't know.

I tell students when they ask me when to come back for their next lesson:

• Come back when you've got this piece to the point where you don't have to think about it too much.
• Come back when you lose the feel or want to check in or brush up on this piece.

The latter happens occasionally, and often it surfaces when you get a tinkerer who will take what he learned in the lesson and try to look up "advanced" or "different" ways to do it online.

I tend to agree with that. Now obviously neither @Rainmaker nor myself have seen your swing or lessons, but that's a lot to cover in a few lessons. We could be wrong. But I'd bet on it.

I've thought about it, and there's a lot of truth in what you say.   I definitely need to slow down my lessons.  

I don't blame my instructor for 2 reasons: first, the part about the weight shift was not his fault, it was something I brought up, not him.   He was just answering my question.   Secondly, I don't want to start doubting my instructor when I still have 5 lessons to go!  So, whether he is to blame for the fast pace or I am to blame for the fast pace, I will choose to blame myself, at least until I finish the 10 lesson package I bought. 

He gave me the part about shoulder tilt, and it worked on the range, and I came back and said, "I got it." and I demonstrated, and he said, yes, that's it, and we moved on.  And we've only had one other thing since then, and that is, getting my down swing on plane in order to hit the ball more squarely.    

Now, of course, when I go to the range, and try to implement what he taught me about getting my down swing on plane, I can't do that and the shoulder tilt at the same time.   I need to ingrain the shoulder tilt part a lot better.   But that's not his fault, that's my fault, and what I need to do is slow down my lessons.   In this case, it's on the student, not the teacher. 

 

 

Edited December 28, 2016 by Marty2019

[iacas]

23 minutes ago, Marty2019 said:

He gave me the part about shoulder tilt, and it worked on the range, and I came back and said, "I got it." and I demonstrated, and he said, yes, that's it, and we moved on.

…

Now, of course, when I go to the range, and try to implement what he taught me about getting my down swing on plane, I can't do that and the shoulder tilt at the same time.   I need to ingrain the shoulder tilt part a lot better.

Right, you didn't actually "have it." You could do it when you were actively thinking about it. You'd moved to conscious competence, but hadn't made the leap to unconscious competence yet.