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Wrist 'hinging' vs 'cocking'?

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 

This is the one aspect of my swing that I can't seem to settle on. If you hold your fist straight out in front of you knuckles up, hinging would be the up and down bending and cocking would be the side to side bending of the wrist...is that right? Cocking would result in a more open clubface at the top, and hinging a more closed clubface (ala Dustin or Duval).

 

I have used both effectively throughout my golf life, but I can't really say that I 'know' much about this part of the swing, as they both work for me so I never payed it much attention (right now, I am in a Dustin phase). So, I was wondering what others think about this subject. Specifically, what are the effects of each on the rest of the swing (leg drive, swing plane/path, release, etc), and on ball flight?

post #2 of 15

To me there the same thing, i prefer hinging term more than cocking term, but i thought they were the same. But as you describe it, you do a little of both. Because the position at the top of the swing, put your self there, then bend and straighten your right wrist, for a flat left wrist at the top, your right wrist has to collaspe a bit in a cocking motion. But also the club hinges as well, because you get lag. So its a bit of both i think

post #3 of 15

dak and saevel,

 

You guys are both better players than I am, so I'm not really trying to give you advice. I'm just describing what I have heard about hinging and cocking. (I go to a lot of golf expos and free golf clinics.)  Let me know if I make sense or not.

 

Hinging is more of a mechanical term that describes the bending of the wrists and hands during the takeaway, and followthrough.

 

I've also heard hinging as the term for properly holding a golf club for a full shot: At address, the club sticks out at an angle from the dominant hang line of your arms at address, with the butt of the club laying diagonally across the palm of the upper hand. Some beginners try to twist their hands so that the shaft is almost parallel to the dominant hang line of the arms. This stiffens their arms, and usually produces chunk misses.

 

One pro I worked with emphasizes hand-loading, and the hinging actually moved the clubhead up - at the same time the shoulders rotated back - on the initial takeaway. This corresponds to dak's idea of hinging.

 

A previous pro emphasized bringing the club shaft to parallel during takeaway as part of the shoulders rotating back. The hands performed more in the cocking move that dak described - this helped me get rid of over-the-top moves.

post #4 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by dak4n6 View Post

This is the one aspect of my swing that I can't seem to settle on. If you hold your fist straight out in front of you knuckles up, hinging would be the up and down bending and cocking would be the side to side bending of the wrist...is that right? Cocking would result in a more open clubface at the top, and hinging a more closed clubface (ala Dustin or Duval)....

As is obvious from my HC, I'm nowhere near as good a golfer as you are, nor do I pretend to be an instructor - but my understanding is that hinging/cocking are essentially two terms for basically the same movement....the up/down (toward the pinky or thumb) bending of the wrist.  The side to side movement (toward the palm or toward the back of the hand) is referred to as "cupping" or "bowing" (or extension and flexion, to be more technical).

post #5 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by dak4n6 View Post

This is the one aspect of my swing that I can't seem to settle on. If you hold your fist straight out in front of you knuckles up, hinging would be the up and down bending and cocking would be the side to side bending of the wrist...is that right? Cocking would result in a more open clubface at the top, and hinging a more closed clubface (ala Dustin or Duval).

 

I have used both effectively throughout my golf life, but I can't really say that I 'know' much about this part of the swing, as they both work for me so I never payed it much attention (right now, I am in a Dustin phase). So, I was wondering what others think about this subject. Specifically, what are the effects of each on the rest of the swing (leg drive, swing plane/path, release, etc), and on ball flight?


wrist does not hinge or cock?.... stop believing what they tell you.

leg drive?....whatever makes people happy

swing plane?....in ones imagination...never seen one appear

release?...it happens

post #6 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by notsohard View Post


wrist does not hinge or cock?.... stop believing what they tell you.

leg drive?....whatever makes people happy

swing plane?....in ones imagination...never seen one appear

release?...it happens


HUH!!!! 

 

Might want to be clearer in your response, some people actually like to learn here. 

post #7 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by notsohard View Post


wrist does not hinge or cock?.... stop believing what they tell you.

leg drive?....whatever makes people happy

swing plane?....in ones imagination...never seen one appear

release?...it happens

 

What the heck?? Gotta love the internet. Thanks for the input though..

 

 

To expound, I got these terms from a tennis forum. Wrist hinging/cocking is very important in tennis but maybe not so much in golf.

 

What is comes down to is, at the top do you set your wrists with the clubface open, ie. with the 'toe hanging', or with the clubface facing the sky, and what are the implications of each?

 

When I do my Dustin Johnson imitation (shut at the top), I feel like I can load the shaft against the base of my right index finger, and maintain that pressure all the way down to contact, and that really helps me feel the lag and puts a little extra 'crunch' on the ball. I remember reading a long time ago that Laura Davies said she feels like her right hand is in position to hold a waiter's tray at the top - that means her left wrist is bowed and her right wrist is 'hinged' rather than 'cocked'.

 

However, when I go back to the more classic position at the top where the clubface is open, I feel like the shaft could slip down the 'V' of my right hand, so I support the weight of the shaft and initiate the downswing more with my left hand, and the right hand is more passive and just pronates the clubface shut rather than applying pressure.

 

I have heard from TV analysts (I know, not the best place to get swing tips) that those who keep the face closed at the top need more leg drive to hold off the face through impact....

post #8 of 15

It depends, theres more to it. Dustin Johnson has a very strong grip, so that's part of it as well. I believe he has to hold off releasing the club or he will duck hook the ball. But i am not sure if that generalization is correct, but its for Dustin Johnson.

 

But, cocking/hinging the wrist happens with a very strong grip or a very weak grip, or if the left wrist is bowed at the top or cupped at the top.

post #9 of 15

Cocking/Uncocking is a similar motion to hammering a nail. Vertical plane of motion.

 

Hinging/Unhinging is a similar motion to openning and closing a door. Horizontal plane of motion.

 

Cocking/Uncocking are essentials of a good golf shot.

 

Hinging/Unhinging are totally destructive to a good golf shot.

post #10 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post


HUH!!!! 

 

Might want to be clearer in your response, some people actually like to learn here. 


sometimes i don't have the time to sit in front of a computer to type detailed responses...

anyhows, the wrist is one of 6 synovial joints, it is a saddle joint....only the elbow hinges in a golf swing.

one of the great detriments to one learning a golf swing is to tell them that the wrists hinge/cock.....this thought will ruin them.

hinge the right elbow and let the wrists do what they will do naturally....but they do not hinge.

post #11 of 15
Thread Starter 


sometimes i don't have the time to sit in front of a computer to type detailed responses...

anyhows, the wrist is one of 6 synovial joints, it is a saddle joint....only the elbow hinges in a golf swing.

one of the great detriments to one learning a golf swing is to tell them that the wrists hinge/cock.....this thought will ruin them.

hinge the right elbow and let the wrists do what they will do naturally....but they do not hinge.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by burner View Post

 

Cocking/Uncocking are essentials of a good golf shot.

 

Hinging/Unhinging are totally destructive to a good golf shot.

 

So here we have the right wrist hinged, and I believe this guy hits pretty good golf shots. As I said, I use this method succesfully. How do we do it?

 

 

 

Duval is not as extreme as Dustin, but there is some hinging going on there.

 

 

post #12 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by burner View Post

Hinging/Unhinging are totally destructive to a good golf shot.

 

For some reason the classic "holding the tray" position of the hand on top of the swing requires quite a bit hinging.

post #13 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by burner View Post

Cocking/Uncocking is a similar motion to hammering a nail. Vertical plane of motion.

 

Hinging/Unhinging is a similar motion to openning and closing a door. Horizontal plane of motion.

 

Cocking/Uncocking are essentials of a good golf shot.

 

Hinging/Unhinging are totally destructive to a good golf shot.

 

 

 

There has to be some wrist hinge, just occurs naturally. Some people probably have to wrist hinge to make there swing work, as a feel mechanism. So i wouldn't make that general claim its destructive to a good golf swing, maybe to your's it is. 

post #14 of 15
If people do not have hinge at all in bsw, then would they add it during dsw to have it at impact?
post #15 of 15

Perhaps we should all take a step back and ponder on the differences of "hinging and unhinging" through impact - totally destructive, and

"bowing", a la Dustin's left hand, and "cupping", the opposite to bowing of the left hand, both seen often but without disastrous consequences at the top of the back swing - where nothing gets hit.

 

The right hand at the top of the back swing has to cup, assume the waiter's tray carrying position, but that starts almost from take away and flattens out the cupping which is present in the left wrist at address.

 

The waiter position of the right hand should be held to some degree, depending on the club being used, through the impact interval to ensure that the club head does not precede the club shaft, and hands holding it, at the moment of truth.

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