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KFT Players Penalized for a Cart Ride

iacas

By iacas,
in Rules of Golf

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TourSpoon Super Member

TourSpoon

On 4/22/2023 at 6:19 AM, boogielicious said:

I agree. I just thought that it had the potential to be confusing by having cart transport at all. 

I with you on this. I have seen it before at events where there is a large expanse to traverse to speed up play. I am sure the guys knew it was ok in specified areas but probably didn't think twice when the guy who took them to the range, and then to the tenth tee, was the same guy taking them from 18 to 1. I bet it doesn't happen again as the KF will clearly mark areas and make sure their volunteers aren't randomly picking up golfers outside of designated areas. I am also sure the players will not ever make the mistake again either. 

Now the responsibility lies with the players to know the rules. I do have to give a little blame on the guy who was parked there as well. If he was not there sitting in a cart marked "player shuttle," it wouldn't have happened. It is unfortunate, but I can also see how it could happen. 

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Vinsk Incredible Member

Vinsk

(edited)
48 minutes ago, TourSpoon said:

Now the responsibility lies with the players to know the rules. I do have to give a little blame on the guy who was parked there as well. If he was not there sitting in a cart marked "player shuttle," it wouldn't have happened. It is unfortunate, but I can also see how it could happen. 

1. Is it a rule that card rides are not permitted during play? Yes.

2. Can there be local rules that allow some shuttling to occur? Yes.

3. Are rules posted stating which areas shuttling is allowed? Yes

4. Were these rules provided to the players? Yes.

5. Did the players read them? No.

Zero blame on the volunteers.

Edited by Vinsk

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StuM Super Member

StuM

42 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Zero blame on the volunteers.

It is not an excuse for the players but I do feel the volunteer was partly to blame.  From my reading of the OP the volunteer asked them if they wanted a ride.  I do not believe that would negate the penalty, but the volunteer did contribute to the breech.  Of course, you can't penalize the volunteer so he will just need to live with his "Guilt".

 

Stuart M.
 

I am a "SCRATCH GOLFER".  I hit ball, Ball hits Tree, I scratch my head. 😜

Driver: Ping G410 Plus 10.5* +1* / 3 Hybrid: Cleveland HIBORE XLS / 4,5 & 6 Hybrids: Mizuno JP FLI-HI / Irons/Wedges 7-8-9-P-G: Mizuno JPX800 HD / Sand Wedge: Mizuno JPX 800 / Lob Wedge: Cleveland CBX 60* / Putter: Odyssey White Hot OG 7S / Balls: Srixon Soft / Beer: Labatt Blue (or anything nice & cold) 

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Vinsk Incredible Member

Vinsk

26 minutes ago, StuM said:

It is not an excuse for the players but I do feel the volunteer was partly to blame.  From my reading of the OP the volunteer asked them if they wanted a ride.  I do not believe that would negate the penalty, but the volunteer did contribute to the breech.  Of course, you can't penalize the volunteer so he will just need to live with his "Guilt".

 

There are many other situations where a player can accept something from a volunteer that would cause a penalty. There’s one sure way to avoid this:

Know the rules.

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TourSpoon Super Member

TourSpoon

17 hours ago, StuM said:

It is not an excuse for the players but I do feel the volunteer was partly to blame.  From my reading of the OP the volunteer asked them if they wanted a ride.  I do not believe that would negate the penalty, but the volunteer did contribute to the breech.  Of course, you can't penalize the volunteer so he will just need to live with his "Guilt".

 

I am sure that guy feels guilty as hell! 

 

18 hours ago, Vinsk said:

5. Did the players read them? No.

Better question, Did the players recall the specific circumstances in which shuttling was allowed? We don't know what the players read or didn't read or even comprehend. 

 

18 hours ago, Vinsk said:

Zero blame on the volunteers.

I will change "blame" to amend my statement to say that the volunteer with the cart that was marked "Player's Shuttle" (and verbally confirmed as an official shuttle) was a "contributing factor" to the rules violation. No cart in the area, no ability to make the mistake. It is still the player's responsibility to know that he can take the shuttle here and here but not there. 

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DaveP043 Incredible Member

DaveP043

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29 minutes ago, TourSpoon said:

Better question, Did the players recall the specific circumstances in which shuttling was allowed? We don't know what the players read or didn't read or even comprehend. 

 From https://www.golfchannel.com/news/how-one-shuttle-ride-mightve-cost-one-korn-ferry-tour-player-his-job

"Tosti and Furr both said they didn’t read the specific rule (Andersen respectfully declined to comment on the situation)"

 

Dave

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iacas Hall of Fame Member

iacas

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Here’s the thing: even at my college events we will say to players “you may be shuttled from 9 green to 10 tee and from 18 green to the first tee as well as back-and-forth for stroke and distance.”

They know, then, that at no other times are they allowed to take a shuttle.

This shit isn’t hard.

The problem is that players who don’t play tournament golf are commenting on how unfair this all is.

Erik J. Barzeski — ⛳ I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • Author, Lowest Score Wins
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TourSpoon Super Member

TourSpoon

37 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

 From https://www.golfchannel.com/news/how-one-shuttle-ride-mightve-cost-one-korn-ferry-tour-player-his-job

"Tosti and Furr both said they didn’t read the specific rule (Andersen respectfully declined to comment on the situation)"

 

This is a better version of the story. It definitely pays to read! 

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StuM Super Member

StuM

1 hour ago, DaveP043 said:

Tosti and Furr both said they didn’t read the specific rule

That was 100% in their control.  I bet they do not make that mistake again.

Stuart M.
 

I am a "SCRATCH GOLFER".  I hit ball, Ball hits Tree, I scratch my head. 😜

Driver: Ping G410 Plus 10.5* +1* / 3 Hybrid: Cleveland HIBORE XLS / 4,5 & 6 Hybrids: Mizuno JP FLI-HI / Irons/Wedges 7-8-9-P-G: Mizuno JPX800 HD / Sand Wedge: Mizuno JPX 800 / Lob Wedge: Cleveland CBX 60* / Putter: Odyssey White Hot OG 7S / Balls: Srixon Soft / Beer: Labatt Blue (or anything nice & cold) 

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iacas Hall of Fame Member

iacas

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Borrowing this from elsewhere:

Wilson Furr, who lost his job last week, is T4 in the final round of this week’s event.

Yep.

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Erik J. Barzeski — ⛳ I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • Author, Lowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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TourSpoon Super Member

TourSpoon

On 4/30/2023 at 6:16 PM, iacas said:

Borrowing this from elsewhere:

Wilson Furr, who lost his job last week, is T4 in the final round of this week’s event.

Yep.

Sometimes some adversity can propel you to great things. Like yesterday when I was standing over a juicy birdie putt and I left it 4 feet short, I regathered myself, concentrated, and sank it for par. Yeah, like that times 1000! Seriously, I am glad to see these guys not let an avoidable mistake ruin their season.  

https://www.golfchannel.com/news/week-after-shuttle-mishap-alejandro-tosti-and-wilson-furr-bounce-back-big-ways

And according to the article, 6 players were penalized for the rogue cart ride. I am sure that everyone payed attention to the local rules this past weekend! 

Cobra LTDx 10.5* | Big Tour 15.5*| Rad Tour 18.5*  | Titleist U500 4-23* | T100 5-P | Vokey SM7 50/8* F, 54/10* S, SM8 58/10* S | Scotty Cameron Squareback No. 1 | Vice Pro Plus  

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StuM Super Member

StuM

1 hour ago, TourSpoon said:

I am sure that everyone payed attention to the local rules this past weekend! 

100% agree.  I'll even wager the shuttle drivers, if any, were given very specific reminders/instructions in excess of what they may have been given at prior events.

Stuart M.
 

I am a "SCRATCH GOLFER".  I hit ball, Ball hits Tree, I scratch my head. 😜

Driver: Ping G410 Plus 10.5* +1* / 3 Hybrid: Cleveland HIBORE XLS / 4,5 & 6 Hybrids: Mizuno JP FLI-HI / Irons/Wedges 7-8-9-P-G: Mizuno JPX800 HD / Sand Wedge: Mizuno JPX 800 / Lob Wedge: Cleveland CBX 60* / Putter: Odyssey White Hot OG 7S / Balls: Srixon Soft / Beer: Labatt Blue (or anything nice & cold) 

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