Rules of the game.....

[David in FL]

Erik's thread about stroke and distance prompted me to ask this.....

Are there any other sports where so many participants either ignore, or somehow modify the basic rules to suit their own preferences?

Why does it happen so often in golf? Are the rules too complicated? Are people too lazy? I'm not talking about people who may make a mistake in interpreting a rule......I'm taking about those that improve their lie, take mulligans, and give themselves 3 foot putts. I tend to agree with those that say, "to each his own", but I still don't understand it. Maybe someone smarter than me (that doesn't narrow the field much) can help me out here......

[Jcp907]

Erik's thread about stroke and distance prompted me to ask this.....

David,

Are there other sports with modified rules? I believe that there are. Billiards or pool comes to mind. I speculate that you and the people that play without regarding the more specific rules, have different objectives with the game of golf. For many, following rules isn't as fun. For them, it's more fun to improve the lie than it is to hit it as it lies. As far as understanding it, I would bet that someone that plays this way doesn't understand why some are so stringent with the rules.

[Fourputt]

David,

I think that David is talking about is those who deliberately break the rules when they do know the correct way to play. It's one thing to play an odd version of 8-Ball because that's how your were shown the game or because those are the "house rules". It's quite another to ignore penalties. or improve your lie, or play a mulligan, or give yourself 4 foot putts when you know that it's against the rules.

Other than an occasional sanctioned local rule, there are no "house rules" in golf. Everyone plays the same game from the same book, and there really is no valid excuse for just ignoring them. I know that not everyone has a rule book, but most golfers have at least a vague idea of the principle of playing the ball as it lies. I even know non-golfers who know that just from seeing it in movies or having it come up in general conversation. Yet it's probably the most ignored rule in golf. In a casual round, it isn't a requirement to know every nuance of the Rules of Golf, but anyone who calls himself a golfer should at least know how to deal more or less with the common situations that arise on the course. But I just don't see it happening very often, and that's a shame. I see it as a reflection on the lack of organized golf in the US. Most players are not club members, do not play any sort of competitive golf, and as a result they are not exposed to the rules like players are in other parts of the world. Then when they do get some instruction they are shocked to find out that they aren't anywhere near that 12 handicap that they've been publicizing. Instead all of those mistakes on the rules have made the game they play only similar to golf... not really golf at all. I personally don't care what the casual golfer does, that's his own business. But if he's bumping the ball, dropping on the wrong side of the hazard, not counting stroke and distance when he should be... if he's deliberately ignoring these and other rules... then he isn't really playing golf.

[Jcp907]

I think that David is talking about is those who deliberately break the rules when they do know the correct way to play. It's one thing to play an odd version of 8-Ball because that's how your were shown the game or because those are the "house rules". It's quite another to ignore penalties. or improve your lie, or play a mulligan, or give yourself 4 foot putts when you know that it's against the rules.

I believe we are talking about the same type of player...One that hooks one into the woods, and takes a mulligan, or gives himself a club length gimme, or relief from a tree in front of him. It's not by the rules, but there are a slew of individuals that play this way, and refer to it as golf. Perhaps they don't call themselves golfers, but they say they are playing golf. I am not sure if there is another recognized name for it. This may or may not be the same person that combos or banks a pool shot off of an opponents ball, but I do believe the analogy is valid-not sure if that would be considered a house rule or not, but it's still called pool.

Take for instance the LPGA pro that was teaching my wife. She says while she's learning, to tee the ball up, even in the fairway. Perhaps it's not playing golf, it's certainly not by the rules, but it's not only accepted by the local pro, it's actually endorsed by her! I am not going to argue with my wife that she isn't playing golf though. She's learning and when she is good enough, will play by the rules. She doesn't even keep score at this point in time, and to keep the game moving, often plays best ball. I am not trying to defend the breaking of the rules. I am just trying to offer David a valid reply to his question, because I believe I understand why someone would intentionally break the rules and take a mulligan, or improve their lie. Honestly, I wouldn't doubt it if on a Saturday or Sunday, it wasn't more common to see it played this way, as opposed to adhearing to the rules, local or not.

[denver_nuggs_15]

I would say baseball has the biggest misconception in sports: tie goes to the runner. In more casual settings (Little League, a league between friends, wiffle ball, etc.), people abide by this. The rules of the game state that a runner must beat the throw and thus a tie does not go to the runner. It's more of a misconception than a modification.

In basketball, the rules are bent all of the time. Walks, carries, and fouls are the things that come to my mind. The rules say that you are allowed 1.5 steps in certain cases...I'm almost positive they don't say 2.5 steps like the pros take. This rule is always modified in the pros.
Don't quote me on this one, but I'm pretty sure that the rules also say that players cannot make contact with eachother. Seems like that one went to waste.

Even in golf, a casual golfer will give himself a better lie. If the ball lands in a divot, he may move it. Hardpan, let's move it. And how many casual golfers (someone who doesn't really care about score) actually know the stroke and distance rule?

[TheLauncher]

I see it as a reflection on the lack of organized golf in the US.

Unless you are playing organized golf, which is almost never for the average golfer, you wont be subject to a rules official, and even then not always. Unlike baseball, basketball, soccer, football, hockey, lacrosse, etc., the game of Golf is self-policing and not dependent on a Referee or Umpire. Sadly, when left to the honor system many individuals will resort to bending or ignoring the rules if it means they can claim a lower score at the end of the day. Also, in the absence of an official on your casual Sunday round, the onus is on the golfer to understand the varied and complicated (relatively speaking) rules of the game. Sometimes this just doesn't happen. With beginners or younger golfers I can understand the occasional fluff of a lie so that a simpler stroke can be practiced, or allowing them to play an OB ball like that is a hazard to speed up a round. But when one becomes serious and reasonably proficient at the game, there is no excuse for not understanding and applying the rules as they are written. Oh and Dave, simply by pontificating here I don't presume to be any smarter than you.

[Shorty]

Even in golf, a casual golfer will give himself a better lie. If the ball lands in a divot, he may move it. Hardpan, let's move it. And how many casual golfers (someone who doesn't really care about score) actually know the stroke and distance rule?

If he is cheating he'll do this. If his mates do it too, they're cheats.

I couldn't care less if they do it in non-competition play, but they should not add up a score at the end of the round because they haven't been scoring. I am loathe to discuss golf with people who aren't regular competition players because they think the measure of a golfer's worth is whether he has ever had a hole in one, and if you mention your own handicap, they'll compare you to a friend of theirs who (unbeknownst to them) does not actually have a handicap, has never played with anyone who does, could not break 110 in a fit, but plays off "about 9" and adds up the "could've" and "should've" scores rather than what they did have.

[clubhousehero]

I think you aren't comparing apples to apples. Most people only play casual golf but have played competitive sports. I think you need to compare casual golf to another casual version of a sport like pick up basketball. According to the rules, a game of basketball should be 5 on 5 full court and all the rules should be enforced. How often does this happen? it's usually 2-2 or 3-3 half court and no free throws on fouls. I think this is a more accurate comparison.

Also, golf is the only sport where everyone, from tiger to myself, all follow the same rules. In every other sport the rules get harder the higher the level you play at. For example, high school baseball is only 7 innings. little league has 60' bases and 45' between home and the rubber. Should they play on a major league size field because those are the rules official rules of baseball?

I guess what i am trying to say is i have no problem with a high handicap fluffing his/her ball up but i do think a scratch golfer should be playing by the rules.

[jojoampt]

How do you guys feel about winter rules? Right now where i live its VERY wet and muddy. Do you feel its cheating if when you pick, clean, and place it you always give yourself a great lie? Do you feel like since its winter rules you should always be able to shuffle the ball around a bit until you get a better lie? This is a grey area to me.

[iacas]

Winter rules, by definition, don't matter much because it's during winter or the off-season. In other words, it's not "in season" and thus you can't post handicap rounds anyway. And winter rules are sometimes about protecting the course as much as anything else.

I think winter rules is another topic (and thus another discussion). Let's stick to this one, please.

[iWALK18]

I'll throw another sport in there for the "ignoring the rules" list: Hockey.

I'm a youth level official, so I have a bit of experience on the subject. Up until a few years ago, most rules reguarding penalties were very very loosely enforced at all levels. Now in the NHL and youth organizations, there is a new "standard of play" where we are actually supposed to call all penalties by the book.

Shockingly, a lot of players and organizations don't like this.

As for golf, I completely understand your average or poor player giving him or herself a decent lie. This game is about enjoying yourself first. But I agree that if you want to be a serious player, you should play this game by the rules.

[NM Golf]

You asked why people don't play by the rules, I have two answers.

1. They don't know them
2. Bad players don't want to know how bad they really are.

You have to figure if some hack shoots 99, chances are if you actually counted the strokes and penalties it would probably be at least 5-6 stokes more than that.

[iacas]

Take for instance the LPGA pro that was teaching my wife. She says while she's learning, to tee the ball up, even in the fairway. Perhaps it's not playing golf, it's certainly not by the rules, but it's not only accepted by the local pro, it's actually endorsed by her!

You said it yourself: she's learning to play golf, she's not playing golf. This is endorsed as a "learning" method, not a "playing by the rules" method. Again, you said it yourself.

I think you aren't comparing apples to apples. Most people only play casual golf but have played competitive sports. I think you need to compare casual golf to another casual version of a sport like pick up basketball. According to the rules, a game of basketball should be 5 on 5 full court and all the rules should be enforced.

Word.

My whole take on this: if you're serious enough to play for prizes (including money with your buddies), you should know the rules. They help you as often (or even more so) as they hurt you.

[jojoampt]

I didnt know you werent supposed to post during winter. Sorry for getting off track.

[Jcp907]

You said it yourself: she's learning to play golf, she's not playing golf. This is endorsed as a "learning" method, not a "playing by the rules" method. Again, you said it yourself.

I just don't understand why you wouldn't call it "playing golf". For another thread I suppose.

My whole take on this: if you're serious enough to play for prizes (including money with your buddies), you should know the rules. They help you as often (or even more so) as they hurt you.

I definately agree with this statement.

[Shorty]

I tend to agree with those that say, "to each his own", but I still don't understand it. Maybe someone smarter than me (that doesn't narrow the field much) can help me out here......

This is why golf is different:

A 15 year old says his baseball team won 9 to 4. Great A 9 year old says his basketball team won their game. Great. A middle aged businessman says his soccer team won 5 nil and he scored a hat trick. Now...... Any of the above say they shot 76 at (insert course name here) You have to think -"Wow, this guy must be able to play!" It changes everything because with the first 3 examples you know that the games are played against similar players, so however the rules were applied, it's all relative. Winning 10 nil doesn't imply brilliant play - it may say more about the opposition. When a ten year old says he hit six home runs or scored four goals or won 6-2,6-0 you don't immediately assume that he's a great player. But in golf, 76 playing a casual round with a pro, all other things being equal is the same as 76 with your grandfather or someone who's never played before. The score implies something very significant. Golf is different to all other sports and that's why we love it. This is why correct scoring and playing by the rules is important.

[too keen to young]

hi today during my round i hit a ball and couldn't find it. so i went back to the place i originally hit from where i was rudely met by two old ladies who precedded to blast me on how i should ask there permission to play that ball again.the next hole as my group had hit off and about to walk down the fairway one of the ladies told us to wait as we held them up they said they had the right to make us wait while they putt out and tee off. on the hole they: touched someone elses ball,take a drop from a spot nowhere near the point of entry and slow play. now i thought copping an ear bashing was harsh and enough, but they went to the pro shop and complained!! this is the stereotypical bullshit juniors are known to cop. I know she's probably right but is she ???

[ProfessorGAC]

Meh!

I think most folks like us are WAY too serious about the "purity" of the game.

We all need to calm down.
GAC