Size Matters in putting

[john ambrose]

There is a traditional mindset going on in the golf world that says light is better than heavy when it comes to golf clubs. While that may be true when a full swing is happening, it is not true when the putt stroke is. Everything in physics will tell you that slow, smooth, stability , [MOI],needs enough weight to be effected by gravity which is a steady state. I am no scientist, but common sense will tell you that means HEAVY. The one challenging thing that a heavy putter does do is make it difficult to feel impact. But what if you could feel impact and still have the benefit of stability that more weight gives you. A well distributed weight with a "hollow" body, produces the feel response so you know your impact feel as you stay stable through the stroke. I hear a lot of "light" putter advocates say they get no feedback for off hits with a heavy club. I would rather not have any off hits. Thats like closing the barn door after the horse gets out. We don't need a reason for why we miss, we need help with a stable stroke so we don't miss because of a miss hit.

[Danattherock]

Interesting thought. I prefer a lighter putter myself. I just had two custom Sunset Beach putters made that are right around 340 grams. I have recently been using a Balance Certified shaft stabilizer with AMT in my Yamada 85029 and adjusting the weights down low increases club head feel for me. Putting is very subjective at best. Everyone has their own definition of what a proper putting stroke should be. There are just as many different thoughts on what the proper putter should be like as well.


-Dan

[TourSpoon]

Hmmmm, tried an Odyssey blade two baller and set it to 360 which gave it a little extra weight. This was after stroking a few with a Nationwide Tour model Odyssey that was filled in to 365. I just loved the feel of the extra weight as it tended to "swing" a little more freely.

[jamo]

I've always been a fan of heavier putters myself.

[saevel25]

Thats your perspective, i use what ever is comfortable. Heavy putters do feel more stable, but thats if you have a pendulum stroke. What if you have an arc stroke. You take it back on an arc, now that momentum is going that way and you have to move it down that arc again, and then turn it inward. Thats one initial direction, change, and change again. 3 change along an arc. With a heavy putter were momentum is mass times velocity, heavier mass = harder to change directions.

So for straight back to straight through, its probably better, for an arc, i don't think it is.

[jamo]

Thats your perspective, i use what ever is comfortable. Heavy putters do feel more stable, but thats if you have a pendulum stroke. What if you have an arc stroke. You take it back on an arc, now that momentum is going that way and you have to move it down that arc again, and then turn it inward. Thats one initial direction, change, and change again. 3 change along an arc. With a heavy putter were momentum is mass times velocity, heavier mass = harder to change directions.

The thing is, as I understand it, an arc stroke, due to the fact that the the shaft is not vertical, actually requires less change in direction. It's the SBST strokes that actually require more wrist movements and thus more changes in direction. "Pendulum" seems to actually be a misnomer.

[john ambrose]

It is really hard to bring a putter face back to square when the stroke is a screen door motion. The two most important parts to an accurate stroke involve contact with the sweet spot, and face direction at impact. The screen door stroke , although it may work for some, has been proven not to be as dependable as an up and down the line, pendulum motion.

A lot of the square to open to square to closed motion in the screen door stroke offers a lot of oppertunity for movement in body parts that are not desirable like shoulders,wrists,hands, and arm roll.

I think a light feel in a putter leaves room for the little muscles to get involved. The more intense we become in our desire for accuracy, the more these muscles become active. This is fine on the practice green, but when the adrenalin flows, it goes right to the small muscles.

[wrx_junki]

Heavy putter is what I prefer. Allows me to keep the putter head steady through the stroke and not worry about having it waver. Lighter putters are extremely difficult to keep stable when it's windy.

[john ambrose]

The stability in the wind is a good point.

[JackLee]

I can roll the ball the correct distance much better with a light putter. I also have no trouble rolling it where I am aiming. Now, if I could read the breaks correctly more often.....

[saevel25]

mine is not really a screen door stroke, its mostly keeping the clubface square to what ever putter path i have. I can't stand the pendulum motion because i will pull all my putts. I guess i am just pretty good at having dead hands in putting, to me all i do is rock my shoulders and the path the club face takes is what it naturally takes and it returns to impact.

[john ambrose]

That would seem true but it is not. The lie angle does not disturb a pendulum motion. On my website, I have made a pendulum machine with my L2 putter that has a 79 degree lie angle. The club will swing straight back and forth. But the real sense of the pendulum comes from the constant tempo no matter how large the stroke. The smaller size of a putt stroke allows for the square face motion from backstroke to follow through. David Pelz Putting Bible explains and endorses this motion and concept from cover to cover. I really appreciate the perspectives you bring out. Thanks

[Danattherock]

I can roll the ball the correct distance much better with a light putter. I also have no trouble rolling it where I am aiming. Now, if I could read the breaks correctly more often.....

You sound like someone I know -Dan

[Phil McGleno]

It is really hard to bring a putter face back to square when the stroke is a screen door motion. The two most important parts to an accurate stroke involve contact with the sweet spot, and face direction at impact. The screen door stroke , although it may work for some, has been proven not to be as dependable as an up and down the line, pendulum motion.

Sorry, I'm not gonna buy it. 99% of the PGA Tour use an arc stroke and unless your spine is perpendicular to the ground (in a standard putting stance) then an arc stroke is the only thing that makes sense - it's the straight-back-and-through stroke that requires manipulation of the wrists.

The best putters of all time have putted with an arc, and even the "straight back" guru Dave Pelz can't get his students (or student, singular) to switch because it simply doesn't work. Now I know you're not pitching putting from the side, and that's fine - an arc doesn't make sense if you're facing the target - but for everyone else, the arc or screen door makes far MORE sense because the blade simply stays square to the arc the entire time with no actual wrist manipulation.

[iacas]

I'd just like to add that it's not the lie angle that necessitates an arc stroke, it's the fact that your spine is at an angle that necessitates an arc stroke. If your spine between your shoulders is horizontal (parallel to the ground) then yes, you can stroke SBST. If it's at an angle, the arc is actually the "square" stroke.

Same reason our hands go in on the backswing in a full swing - to stay on the plane.

[john ambrose]

The stroke is called a PILS stroke; [PURE IN LINE STROKE], The hang of our arms off our shoulders allows for the square in line stroke.

The lateral line stroke does allow for a perfect up and down the line stroke with a constant pendulum tempo. This stroke definitly does need a weighted, well balanced high MOI club and is as simple a stroke as rolling a ball.

[Phil McGleno]

The stroke is called a PILS stroke; [PURE IN LINE STROKE], The hang of our arms off our shoulders allows for the square in line stroke.

This thread is about the weight of a putter, not your line of putters or your putting stroke... Most people don't putt standing up facing the hole, and my comments are about the way the vast majority of people putt (whether that's truly best for them or not).

[JackLee]

I'd just like to add that it's not the lie angle that necessitates an arc stroke, it's the fact that your spine is at an angle that necessitates an arc stroke. If your spine between your shoulders is horizontal (parallel to the ground) then yes, you can stroke SBST. If it's at an angle, the arc is actually the "square" stroke.

It occurs to me that if a player actually uses a pure SBST stroke, a putter with a 90 degree lie angle would be needed, and that is against the rules.