Jump to content
IGNORED

DQ due to a Non-Conforming wedge


Divot Tool
Note: This thread is 4700 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

For those who are planning to play in any USGA sanctioned tournament, let this be a lesson learned.

http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-equipment/blogs/hotlist365/2011/05/why-bad-things-keep-happening.html

I feel bad for the kid, but in this instance it really hurts when you don't do your homework, especially considering this was Local Qualifying.  II believe that the majority of people on this forum (equipment junkies) would have known immediately that the Vokey wedge in question was non-conforming.

Tough Luck.

You don't know what pressure is until you've played for five dollars a hole with only two in your pocket - Lee Trevino

MP-600 @ 10.5°
Insight BUL 3-wood @ 15°
Insight BUL 5-wood @ 18° IDEA a2 4i Hybrid @ 23° MX-25 5-PW MP-R Series 52° > 50°/05° MP-R Series 54°/10° MP-R...
Link to comment
Share on other sites


The USGA is a pile of crap.

When they install rules like this they should have a couple hundred brand new wedges on hand to swap with amateurs who have spent their hard earned money on their equipment.  I am kinda glad my USGA days are done.

It's a damned stupid ruling any way. it should be either conforming or not the day they make that ruling. No exceptions no delays.

The grooves haven't done a bit of damage to the game or the tour, but yet here we are.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I found the bit I underlined very interesting. So apparently after the competition is closed it's still possible to be DQ'd for an equipment violation? Is that distinction specified in the rules somewhere? Does that mean anthing to anyone else?
"The USGA strongly suggests that all players verify the conformance of their clubs well in advance of their scheduled qualifying competition. It is the player's responsibility - not the USGA's responsibility - to ensure that their clubs conform. Waiting until the day of the competition is the fault of the player. The Committee is under no obligation to test the club the competitor may play. If it is later determined that the club is non-conforming, including after the competition has closed, the player will be disqualified ."

Read More http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-equipment/blogs/hotlist365/2011/05/why-bad-things-keep-happening.html#ixzz1MWyFfJlY "

Mizuno MP600 driver, Cleveland '09 Launcher 3-wood, Callaway FTiz 18 degree hybrid, Cleveland TA1 3-9, Scratch SS8620 47, 53, 58, Cleveland Classic 2 mid-mallet, Bridgestone B330S, Sun Mountain four5.

Link to comment
Share on other sites




Originally Posted by sean_miller

I found the bit I underlined very interesting. So apparently after the competition is closed it's still possible to be DQ'd for an equipment violation? Is that distinction specified in the rules somewhere? Does that mean anthing to anyone else?

"The USGA strongly suggests that all players verify the conformance of their clubs well in advance of their scheduled qualifying competition. It is the player's responsibility - not the USGA's responsibility - to ensure that their clubs conform. Waiting until the day of the competition is the fault of the player. The Committee is under no obligation to test the club the competitor may play. If it is later determined that the club is non-conforming, including after the competition has closed, the player will be disqualified."

Read More http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-equipment/blogs/hotlist365/2011/05/why-bad-things-keep-happening.html#ixzz1MWyFfJlY"



It is the player's responsibility to know whether his clubs conform to the rules of the competition.  Because of that responsibility, the player is deemed to have knowingly played with nonconfoming clubs to gain an advantage on the field, thus there is no statute of limitations on disqualification.

Rick

"He who has the fastest cart will never have a bad lie."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades



Originally Posted by ND Fan

The USGA is a pile of crap.

When they install rules like this they should have a couple hundred brand new wedges on hand to swap with amateurs who have spent their hard earned money on their equipment.  I am kinda glad my USGA days are done.

It's a damned stupid ruling any way. it should be either conforming or not the day they make that ruling. No exceptions no delays.

The grooves haven't done a bit of damage to the game or the tour, but yet here we are.

My, someone got up cranky this morning.  This isn't a revelation.  It's been discussed in in the news on TV, on many tournament broadcasts, on golf forums ad nauseum.  The information was widely available.  Some people just need a wake-up call.  Guess he just got his.

Rick

"He who has the fastest cart will never have a bad lie."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades



Originally Posted by Fourputt

It is the player's responsibility to know whether his clubs conform to the rules of the competition.  Because of that responsibility, the player is deemed to have knowingly played with nonconfoming clubs to gain an advantage on the field, thus there is no statute of limitations on disqualification.



Good to know - thank you!

Mizuno MP600 driver, Cleveland '09 Launcher 3-wood, Callaway FTiz 18 degree hybrid, Cleveland TA1 3-9, Scratch SS8620 47, 53, 58, Cleveland Classic 2 mid-mallet, Bridgestone B330S, Sun Mountain four5.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


This really isn't a case about wedges being conforming or not but is more a case about a player using borrowed equipment and not verifying that equipment meets the rules of play.     Quoting from the article:

"He realized his regular wedges, which are OK for elite amateur play until 2014, would not be allowed in the local qualifier being played Tuesday. So after a buddy told him he could borrow his wedges, which he said were conforming, Fontaine thought he was good to go."

The player was indeed aware of the USGA rules on conforming wedges and knew that his were not.    But someone else loaned him some equipment and the player did not do his diligence in ensuring the equipment was acceptable.   This could happen with a wedge, a driver, putter, golf balls.....any equipment which someone gives you.     It isn't hard to determine if your equipment meets the rules or not, and it is the players responsibility to check.   In this case he did not.


Link to comment
Share on other sites


This is a tough break, but the part that concerns me about the article is that the discovery potentially involved what can be generally described as a 'snitch'.  My comprehension of the article says that either 1) one of his playing competitors possibly knew of the wedge all along, allowed him to play with it, then at the end alerted officials or 2) someone on the fringe of advancing was looking in peoples' bags, looking to find a non-conforming wedge, found one then alerted officials.  All in all, if I qualified as a result of this, I'd take the bid, but it would feel a little cheap.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I was thinking the same thing. I would not have took a buddies word for it. I am not even on the level of having to worry about conformity, but I do know that my Vokey wedges are not even close.  I think that the player should have looked at the USGA's conforming list.  I found my clubs in less than 2 minutes at:

http://www.usga.org/infoclubsdb/intro.html

Cobra LTDx 10.5* | Big Tour 15.5*| Rad Tour 18.5*  | Titleist U500 4-23* | T100 5-P | Vokey SM7 50/8* F, 54/10* S, SM8 58/10* S | Scotty Cameron Squareback No. 1 | Vice Pro Plus  

Link to comment
Share on other sites


It's unfortunate for the guy, and while I'm sure his intentions were honest, he screwed up and the committee is unquestionably doing the right thing here.  The rule is clear, the method for verifying that your club conforms is straightforward, and if you're not sure, you can pick up a guaranteed-conforming wedge from any sporting goods store for $100 or less.  "Meaning" to follow the rules is not the same as following the rules.

In the bag:
FT-iQ 10° driver, FT 21° neutral 3H
T-Zoid Forged 15° 3W, MX-23 4-PW
Harmonized 52° GW, Tom Watson 56° SW, X-Forged Vintage 60° LW
White Hot XG #1 Putter, 33"

Link to comment
Share on other sites


This is a tough break, but the part that concerns me about the article is that the discovery potentially involved what can be generally described as a 'snitch'.  My comprehension of the article says that either 1) one of his playing competitors possibly knew of the wedge all along, allowed him to play with it, then at the end alerted officials or 2) someone on the fringe of advancing was looking in peoples' bags, looking to find a non-conforming wedge, found one then alerted officials.  All in all, if I qualified as a result of this, I'd take the bid, but it would feel a little cheap.

This depends on when the fellow competitor discovered it. If I were playing in this, and suspected one of my fellow competitors had a non-conforming wedge _after he had used it_, I'd keep quiet until the end. The penalty is DQ for it, so it's not like it's just penalty shots he can try to get back (as if I had noticed 16 clubs on the second tee). There's no need to alert him during the round; if it's a false positive, it may only serve to hurt him by saying it.

-- Michael | My swing! 

"You think you're Jim Furyk. That's why your phone is never charged." - message from my mother

Driver:  Titleist 915D2.  4-wood:  Titleist 917F2.  Titleist TS2 19 degree hybrid.  Another hybrid in here too.  Irons 5-U, Ping G400.  Wedges negotiable (currently 54 degree Cleveland, 58 degree Titleist) Edel putter. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades



Originally Posted by ElWagonne

This is a tough break, but the part that concerns me about the article is that the discovery potentially involved what can be generally described as a 'snitch'.  My comprehension of the article says that either 1) one of his playing competitors possibly knew of the wedge all along, allowed him to play with it, then at the end alerted officials or 2) someone on the fringe of advancing was looking in peoples' bags, looking to find a non-conforming wedge, found one then alerted officials.  All in all, if I qualified as a result of this, I'd take the bid, but it would feel a little cheap.



Maybe he suspected the club, but didn't want to affect the outcome in case he was wrong. Ultimately he had to voice his concerns or he was breaking the rules as well.

Mizuno MP600 driver, Cleveland '09 Launcher 3-wood, Callaway FTiz 18 degree hybrid, Cleveland TA1 3-9, Scratch SS8620 47, 53, 58, Cleveland Classic 2 mid-mallet, Bridgestone B330S, Sun Mountain four5.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Note: This thread is 4700 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • TST Partners

    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    ShotScope
    The Stack System
    FlightScope Mevo
    Direct: Mevo, Mevo+, and Pro Package.

    Coupon Codes (save 10-15%): "IACAS" for Mevo/Stack, "IACASPLUS" for Mevo+/Pro Package, and "THESANDTRAP" for ShotScope.
  • Posts

    • Wordle 1,013 4/6* ⬛🟦🟦⬛⬛ ⬛🟦⬛🟦🟦 🟧⬛🟧🟧🟧 🟧🟧🟧🟧🟧 par is good after a double bogey yesterday.
    • I did read the fine print tonight. It said replace with “similar features & function”.  8 yeas ago my purchase had features that today are available on the lower end models and the current version of my model has more “bells & whistles” than what I got 8 years ago.  So I am thinking they honored the agreement and I can’t argue the offer. since getting a credit for the full purchase price all I am really out over the past 8 years was the cost of the extended warranty, which was less than a low end  treadmill would have cost me. now the question is which model to replace with.  I’ll stay with Nordic Track or I forfeit the $1,463 credit so I will get Nordic Track.  And they honored the warranty and were not hard to work with which is a plus.
    • Generally speaking, extended warranties are a terrible deal and should almost always be avoided. They are a huge profit center for the companies that offer them, which should tell you almost everything you need to know about how much value most consumers get when purchasing them.  This is correct, and the old adage applies - only buy insurance when you can't afford the loss. This usually doesn't apply to most consumer goods.  To your second question, no I don't believe the offer is fair. They are replacing it, but it is not being replaced at "no cost to you". Since the amount being disputed (over $500) is non-trivial, I would probably push the issue. Don't waste your time on the phone with a customer service agent or a supervisor. They have probably given you all they have the authority to do. Rather, I would look at the terms of your agreement and specifically legal disputes. The odds are you probably agreed to binding arbitration in the event of a dispute. The agreement will outline what steps need to be followed, but it will probably look something like this.  1. Mail the Nordic Track legal department outlining your dispute and indicate you are not satisfied with the resolution offered.  2. Open up a case with the AAA (American Arbitration Association), along with the required documentation. 3. Wait about 4-5 weeks for a case to be opened - at which point someone from Nordic Track's legal department will offer to give you the new model at no cost to you.  They certainly don't want to spend the time and energy to fight you over $500. 4. Enjoy your new Nordic Track at no cost to you. I recently entered binding arbitration against a fairly large and well known company that screwed me over and refused to make it right. In my demand letter, I made a pretty sizeable request that included compensation for my time and frustration. Once it hit their legal department, they cut me a check - no questions asked. It was far cheaper to settle with me than to send their legal team to defend them in the arbitration.
    • I never thought of looking at it on multiple purchases like you said.  Yes, the extended may help me on 1 or 2 items but not the other 5 or 6.
    • Day 84 - Forgot to post yesterday, but I did some more chipping/pitching.    Back/neck were feeling better today, so I did a much overdue Stack session. 
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...