Chevron World Challenge 2011 Thread

[bplewis24]

Originally Posted by iacas

Zach's response was, to me, "Yup, kinda figured that'd go in. I gave it all I had and he got the better of me."

I still think anyone saying anything about Zach Johnson trying to lose on purpose is being far more insulting than they think.

If a reporter were to ask a golfer that question (implying they didn't try to win, or conspired to lose), that would probably be one of the few guaranteed ways to make them lose their cool and create an instant Youtube classic.

By the way, does the Chevron tournament count towards your bet?  I recall you and another poster had a bet about Tiger winning a tournament this season.

Brandon

[mvmac]

Originally Posted by bplewis24

By the way, does the Chevron tournament count towards your bet?  I recall you and another poster had a bet about Tiger winning a tournament this season.

Brandon

Yeah, it probably does, good stuff Erik

[iacas]

Originally Posted by bplewis24

By the way, does the Chevron tournament count towards your bet?  I recall you and another poster had a bet about Tiger winning a tournament this season.

Yep. I worded the bet specifically to include it. It's a "PGA Tour sanctioned event." I put the odds of collecting as very low. I'm not worried about it, though I'd have paid up right away.

[franky21]

Originally Posted by Golfz

This is just one tournament. By mid season next year, only then can you make judgements on whether he is back or not. That's just my opinion.

I have to agree with your statement.Someone said that Tiger was using alot of irons off of the tee.The Chevron isnt a bad course to hit irons but there will be longer courses and Tiger will have to pull out the big stick which hasn't been very friendly to him as of late. I think he is playing well but he will have to built some confidence with his driver.I am sure  I am sure that Tiger is fully aware of his driving woes and will find his range with it.

[Deryck Griffith]

Originally Posted by franky21

The Chevron isnt a bad course to hit irons but there will be longer courses and Tiger will have to pull out the big stick which hasn't been very friendly to him as of late.

Depends...Tiger can control his 3wood quite well and can opt to hit that off of the tee vs. his driver on longer holes (of course, he will hit the driver on the really long par 4s that are 470+yds plus).

With the way Tiger is hitting his irons right now, I think we are going to seem him play a lot of longer second shots into holes vs. in the past when he would try to blast the driver to have a shorter second shot.  We saw this strategy in the Australian Open, Presidents cup and now at Chevron.  I noticed that when he did decide to pull the driver, it was mostly on par 5s and par 4s that had more generous fairways.

Personally, if he continues to play this way it's a great strategy and one that many people have always asked of him in the past.  "Why not hit the hard 270+ yard 3 wood instead of blocking the driver into the trees on the right?"  I remember, like others, asking that question over and over again.

[franky21]

Originally Posted by Deryck Griffith

Depends...Tiger can control his 3wood quite well and can opt to hit that off of the tee vs. his driver on longer holes (of course, he will hit the driver on the really long par 4s that are 470+yds plus).

With the way Tiger is hitting his irons right now, I think we are going to seem him play a lot of longer second shots into holes vs. in the past when he would try to blast the driver to have a shorter second shot.  We saw this strategy in the Australian Open, Presidents cup and now at Chevron.  I noticed that when he did decide to pull the driver, it was mostly on par 5s and par 4s that had more generous fairways.

Personally, if he continues to play this way it's a great strategy and one that many people have always asked of him in the past.  "Why not hit the hard 270+ yard 3 wood instead of blocking the driver into the trees on the right?"  I remember, like others, asking that question over and over again.

His long irons do go far because those stingers he hits roll forever,i feel that the driver needs to be hit consistently to get a little closer.He does hit his irons very high which helps.But getting a 4-iron to spin to stay on a fast green is extremely hard to do.I do feel that he will figure out his driver situation and lets not forget courses are getting longer and longer.Tiger is a great golfer and he works likes no other so that 3-w and driver will be finding fairways by the start of the 2012 season.

[sonicblue]

Originally Posted by Shorty

No.

You'll CERTAINLY have to do it again and then do it on average HALF the time. Not once and maybe once again. I'm talking about a correctly maintained handicap.

I know that, as a standing-still view , your handicap is the average of your ten best, and usually five will be lower, and five will be higher but that is not a mathematical certainty.  Median works that way, average does not.  In my current calc, I only have two scores below my index, and the other eight are either at it or within two strokes above (I shoot mid-80's a lot, but then occasionally light it up).

However, just looking at lowering your handicap, just shooting under your current index once will lower it by some amount.  On a technical note, though, you don't HAVE to.  Say my 10 best differentials are my last ten rounds, and they are five 4.0's, three 7.0's and two 11.0's (a 6.0 index).  All I have to do is shoot something that pushes that 11.0 out and my index will drop some.  Actually beating your index will impact it quickly, especially depending on what it pushes out.  For the record, though, re-read my post: I did say, "shoot it once, then again, then probably again."  That's 2, maybe 3 times; not once, maybe twice.  THAT will make some progress, no matter what.  In my example, if I add two 4.0's and push out the two 11.0's, it drops to 4.7.

What I was really talking about was, though, as a long-term goal of lowering your index.  Whatever your index is, the 'optimism' of that calc means beating your index is a "good round."  However, while doing that will hiccup it down at first, if you go back to your usual, it will eventually go back up, especially once the low round falls off.  You have to shoot "good rounds" again just to maintain it, let alone lower it.  It was to reiterate that, even at my level, even to maintain my handicap, I have to play well "again," and Tiger epitomizes "playing well again" at the highest level of the sport.  That's what set his run(s) apart, and I think that's really why people root for him.  When he pulls off the victory, grinds it out, torches the field, whatever, he's done it again....and for his 15th....or 83rd again, and that's entirely different than anyone else, even the guys who have done it a handful of times - Rory, Dustin, Luke, Lee, even Phil - out there right now.

[Dave H]

Originally Posted by Deryck Griffith

Depends...Tiger can control his 3wood quite well and can opt to hit that off of the tee vs. his driver on longer holes (of course, he will hit the driver on the really long par 4s that are 470+yds plus).

With the way Tiger is hitting his irons right now, I think we are going to seem him play a lot of longer second shots into holes vs. in the past when he would try to blast the driver to have a shorter second shot.  We saw this strategy in the Australian Open, Presidents cup and now at Chevron.  I noticed that when he did decide to pull the driver, it was mostly on par 5s and par 4s that had more generous fairways.

Personally, if he continues to play this way it's a great strategy and one that many people have always asked of him in the past.  "Why not hit the hard 270+ yard 3 wood instead of blocking the driver into the trees on the right?"  I remember, like others, asking that question over and over again.

Also, he out drove ZJ (who used driver) with a 3-iron on 18 in the final round Sunday. I think if he had to use the 3-iron more often off the tee as we've seen recently he'd be just fine.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by sonicblue

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shorty

No.

You'll CERTAINLY have to do it again and then do it on average HALF the time. Not once and maybe once again. I'm talking about a correctly maintained handicap.

I know that, as a standing-still view, your handicap is the average of your ten best, and usually five will be lower, and five will be higher but that is not a mathematical certainty.  Median works that way, average does not.  In my current calc, I only have two scores below my index, and the other eight are either at it or within two strokes above (I shoot mid-80's a lot, but then occasionally light it up).

However, just looking at lowering your handicap, just shooting under your current index once will lower it by some amount.  On a technical note, though, you don't HAVE to.  Say my 10 best differentials are my last ten rounds, and they are five 4.0's, three 7.0's and two 11.0's (a 6.0 index).  All I have to do is shoot something that pushes that 11.0 out and my index will drop some.  Actually beating your index will impact it quickly, especially depending on what it pushes out.  For the record, though, re-read my post: I did say, "shoot it once, then again, then probably again."  That's 2, maybe 3 times; not once, maybe twice.  THAT will make some progress, no matter what.  In my example, if I add two 4.0's and push out the two 11.0's, it drops to 4.7.

What I was really talking about was, though, as a long-term goal of lowering your index.  Whatever your index is, the 'optimism' of that calc means beating your index is a "good round."  However, while doing that will hiccup it down at first, if you go back to your usual, it will eventually go back up, especially once the low round falls off.  You have to shoot "good rounds" again just to maintain it, let alone lower it.  It was to reiterate that, even at my level, even to maintain my handicap, I have to play well "again," and Tiger epitomizes "playing well again" at the highest level of the sport.  That's what set his run(s) apart, and I think that's really why people root for him.  When he pulls off the victory, grinds it out, torches the field, whatever, he's done it again....and for his 15th....or 83rd again, and that's entirely different than anyone else, even the guys who have done it a handful of times - Rory, Dustin, Luke, Lee, even Phil - out there right now.

You had me and then you lost me. What's that last paragraph about again?

[franky21]

Originally Posted by Dave H

Also, he out drove ZJ (who used driver) with a 3-iron on 18 in the final round Sunday. I think if he had to use the 3-iron more often off the tee as we've seen recently he'd be just fine.

Well the reason Tiger out drove him with a iron was because Zach's ball landed in the rough which killed alot of his distance,but even if Zach didn't hit the rough Tiger would of been no more then 25 yards behind him which is crazy.Tiger does get alot of distance with that stinger shot he has been hitting.I never question Tiger's golf decisions because he knows what he is doing.I am sure he knows there is a problem with the driver that needs to be fixed.Iron play is more of a conservative way to play,i think we all know with the way Tiger thinks he does not like to play that way.He was thinking about hitting 3-w on the 16th from 273 yards away.Tiger was hitting those iron shots because the wing was blowing alot.But i would be shocked if Tiger settles for iron shots off of the  all of the time.

[sacm3bill]

Originally Posted by franky21

Well the reason Tiger out drove him with a iron was because Zach's ball landed in the rough which killed alot of his distance...

Actually I think Zach's ball was short mostly because it got knocked down by a tree.

[Shorty]

Originally Posted by franky21

Well the reason Tiger out drove him with a iron was because Zach's ball landed in the rough which killed alot of his distance,but even if Zach didn't hit the rough Tiger would of been no more then 25 yards behind him which is crazy.Tiger does get alot of distance with that stinger shot he has been hitting.I never question Tiger's golf decisions because he knows what he is doing.I am sure he knows there is a problem with the driver that needs to be fixed.Iron play is more of a conservative way to play,i think we all know with the way Tiger thinks he does not like to play that way.He was thinking about hitting 3-w on the 16th from 273 yards away.Tiger was hitting those iron shots because the wing was blowing alot.But i would be shocked if Tiger settles for iron shots off of the  all of the time.

Very wise of you never to question Tiger's decisions. It's very respectful and he appreciates it, I'm sure.

And thanks for pointing out that playing irons off the tee is a conseravtive way to paly. I didn't realise that.

Franky - you and I will never agree on some things, but PLEASE stop writing "alot" instead of "a lot", "would of" instead of "would have" and "then" instead of "than".

I'll respect you a lot more and Tiger will too.

[franky21]

Originally Posted by sacm3bill

Actually I think Zach's ball was short mostly because it got knocked down by a tree.

Well i am sure we can put both accounts into effect.It hit the tree and landed in the rough then first cut and trickled into the fairway.Regardless what it was, all those reasons were the real reason why Tiger's tee shot was farther. Tiger still did smash that that 3 iron off of the tee.

[franky21]

Originally Posted by Shorty

Very wise of you never to question Tiger's decisions. It's very respectful and he appreciates it, I'm sure.

And thanks for pointing out that playing irons off the tee is a conseravtive way to paly. I didn't realise that.

Franky - you and I will never agree on some things, but PLEASE stop writing "alot" instead of "a lot", "would of" instead of "would have" and "then" instead of "than".

I'll respect you a lot more and Tiger will too.

Shorty if you haven't realized it by now anything you say goes right over my head,you tell me to stop calling players Zach and Dustin and i continue to do it.Shorty the way i do things is the way i do things.I have come a long way in life to be successfull to let a guy with a pipe dream tell me what to do.

[Kieran123]

Originally Posted by franky21

Shorty if you haven't realized it by now anything you say goes right over my head,you tell me to stop calling players Zach and Dustin and i continue to do it.Shorty the way i do things is the way i do things.I have come a long way in life to be successfull to let a guy with a pipe dream tell me what to do.

If you truly believe his pipe dream to be a serious endeavour - then I feel sorry for you.

'right over my head' isn't exactly the right way to explain things - but maybe it is?

[franky21]

Originally Posted by Kieran123

If you truly believe his pipe dream to be a serious endeavour - then I feel sorry for you.

'right over my head' isn't exactly the right way to explain things - but maybe it is?

Dude this has nothing to do with you so mind your business.Shorty loves to get off topic and try to correct people which is annoying. Lets just stick to the thread,i can't stand bickering back and forth with people that i dont know.This is a golf forum so lets stick to golf.

[Kieran123]

Originally Posted by franky21

Dude this has nothing to do with you so mind your business.

Sorry, but if you post in a public forum - it has everything to do with anyone

[franky21]

Originally Posted by Kieran123

Sorry, but if you post in a public forum - it has everything to do with anyone

Ok well it was pretty cute for you to defend your buddy.Now let's move on and get back on topic.