Interesting thought from Butch Harmon

[concordeer]

Recently read where if your having trouble coming over the top and hitting a fade or slice that your flaw is your throwing your right shoulder into the ball to early. Your fix is to keep your back pointed towards the target as long as possible after initiating the downswing and that will drop the club inside into the slot and will promote an in to out path that will produce a draw. Agree or disagree?

[xmanhockey7]

Interesting swing thought even if you don't come over the top. I want to try it.

[Rfordeagle]

I agree fa sho!

[David in FL]

Not a problem I really have, but the swing thought seems like it might tend to keep someone way back on their back side......maybe even a reverse pivot. I'm no Butch Harmon though. I may have to try a swing or two, just to see.......

[iacas]

It just keeps your shoulders closed longer. It's fine as far as "general golf tips" goes.

[Mr. Desmond]

Like Butch, it's an old tip that works - if not overdone.

You keep your back to the ball a bit longer, allowing your arms to start down ... you're lower body is still doing what it does.

As Erik said, it's a general tip, and a good one.

[RPMPIRE]

It's an oldie but a goodie. This tip helped me get my shoulders square or just slightly opened at impact. Also helps to promote your lower body starting the downswing.

[bjwestner]

100% agree.  When I am about to hammer a good drive that does not slice, I can feel the proper turn with the right shoulder (which is late) and means that I am in the correct slot.  Thus I'll know before I even hit the ball if it's a good drive.  When I hit a marginal drive with too much cut/slice, I do not get that feeling.  If only there was a way to stop my swing at the moment when I can tell if it's good or not!

[LuciusWooding]

Originally Posted by bjwestner

100% agree.  When I am about to hammer a good drive that does not slice, I can feel the proper turn with the right shoulder (which is late) and means that I am in the correct slot.  Thus I'll know before I even hit the ball if it's a good drive.  When I hit a marginal drive with too much cut/slice, I do not get that feeling.  If only there was a way to stop my swing at the moment when I can tell if it's good or not!

The tip seems eerily reminiscent of "keep your head down". I feel like if you throw your right shoulder you sort of collide with your neck, but if you keep your shoulders on plane you stay centered around the spine. Back to the target + looking at the ball gives the shoulders room to turn fast and freely without needing to move the head.

Try making your weight shift and turning your hips and shoulders through in the downswing motion, but fixate your eyes at a spot 4 feet behind the ball; your eyes get pulled off it around impact. Fixate on a spot 4 feet or so in front of the ball, and it impedes your backswing leading to a big pull move. Am I right here?

[Paradox]

its not that complicated, Lucius.

Some people open their shoulders/bring their arms through too fast which causes an out to in swing.  Its not a very long process of keeping your back to the target..its just letting your arms drop down enough so that when you do swing through your shoulders will be more square at impact.

[concordeer]

Went out and had the chance to get about 200 balls with a PW today using this swing thought and I could definately start to get a feel for what Butch was talking about. When I was doing it properly I was hitting the ball slightly higher with the ball starting on my line then drawing off maybe 3 or 4 yards on a 125 yard shot. I COULD NOT for anything get the ball to start as a push and draw back to my line. If I aimed more right to counter the draw I would either hit a pull/draw that would start left and fly 10 to 12 yards left of the target or be a dead straight push that would be 10 or 12 to the right.

Do most of you draw a wedge or do you normally fly it straight?

I have a slight out to in swing path that usually plays a slight fade with every club from a 7 iron and up.

I'm scared to try this with a driver yet because I'm afraid it's gonna cause some nasty slices. Should you make the same swing with the Driver? Will it promote a draw flight pattern with longer clubs?

[RPMPIRE]

It's worth checking out the Ball Flight Laws article to better understand how to properly perform a draw or a fade.

To me, this swing thought is to help get you in a better position at impact (it could help get the out-to-in swing path) and proper sequence of the downswing. Of all the clubs in my bag, this swing thought was the most beneficial with my driver. My bad shots were bad push fades or slices and this helped straighten the ball flight but I still came out with a slight 2 to 3 yard fade, but I'll take that any day. Again, I would use this swing thought to better your positions at impact and promote proper sequencing of the downswing rather than use it as a way to draw the ball.

Originally Posted by concordeer

Went out and had the chance to get about 200 balls with a PW today using this swing thought and I could definately start to get a feel for what Butch was talking about. When I was doing it properly I was hitting the ball slightly higher with the ball starting on my line then drawing off maybe 3 or 4 yards on a 125 yard shot. I COULD NOT for anything get the ball to start as a push and draw back to my line. If I aimed more right to counter the draw I would either hit a pull/draw that would start left and fly 10 to 12 yards left of the target or be a dead straight push that would be 10 or 12 to the right.

Do most of you draw a wedge or do you normally fly it straight?

I have a slight out to in swing path that usually plays a slight fade with every club from a 7 iron and up.

I'm scared to try this with a driver yet because I'm afraid it's gonna cause some nasty slices. Should you make the same swing with the Driver? Will it promote a draw flight pattern with longer clubs?

[bjwestner]

Originally Posted by RPMPIRE

It's worth checking out the Ball Flight Laws article to better understand how to properly perform a draw or a fade.

To me, this swing thought is to help get you in a better position at impact (it could help get the out-to-in swing path) and proper sequence of the downswing. Of all the clubs in my bag, this swing thought was the most beneficial with my driver. My bad shots were bad push fades or slices and this helped straighten the ball flight but I still came out with a slight 2 to 3 yard fade, but I'll take that any day. Again, I would use this swing thought to better your positions at impact and promote proper sequencing of the downswing rather than use it as a way to draw the ball.

I agree.  I do not use it to draw the ball, I use it with my driver so that my natural fade with the driver does not turn into a slice.

I do not draw or fade my wedges intentionally.  I try to hit them straight for the most part, unless there is wind that I am taking into consideration.  My misses with my wedges do end up being draws or fades but not intentionally.

[cooke119]

Originally Posted by RPMPIRE

It's an oldie but a goodie. This tip helped me get my shoulders square or just slightly opened at impact. Also helps to promote your lower body starting the downswing.

Exactly, it helps you start the downswing with the lower body and your arms "fall" into the slot. I'm taking lessons and this is what I am working on, I'll give this thought a try.

[VegasRenegade]

My swing thought was to slide my left him straight down the target line which also keeps the back toward the target. The hip slide is the first part of my down swing as the arms drop.  I was turning my hip at the same time as I was sliding and this resulted in my right shoulder starting to early and an over the top first move.  I am finding that it is easier to retain lag when keeping back to target longer,