Does Zach Johnson move up a tier now...?

[oregongolfguy]

Well, he is eligible for the HOF now.  And his career stats are going to be floating around the Couples, Kite, O'Meara range....

[mvmac]

Pretty cool his two major wins are at Augusta and St. Andrews, doesn't get much better than that.

[Golfingdad]

2 Major victories

10 other PGA victories to go with those.

[ChrisP]

Closing in on Hall of Fame for sure. Don't think he's there yet, but he can get in with two majors. Just needs some more wins. If he gets 5-10 more, for sure. But he's definitely up a tier. The guys a solid champion.

[Golfingdad]

2 Major victories

10 other PGA victories to go with those.

For comparison (all below are HoFers):

O 'Meara has 2 majors and 14 other PGA tour wins (5 of which were at Pebble Beach)

Kite had 1 major and 18 other PGA victories

Couples 1 major and 14 other PGA victories

Lanny Wadkins 1 and 20

Curtis Strange 2 and 15

Larry Nelson 3 and 7

ZJ is basically on the cusp of that group right there, no?  If he disappeared right now, I could see him on either side of the fence, but any more success, and certainly with another major, it seems he'd be a sure thing.

[David L Yskes]

I'd say he's right on the edge of being " elite " if you want to call it that......  i think he needs a couple more wins, but it would be tough to say he's not a favorite going into any of the majors....

usually i'd say if you have around 10 PGA tour wins, you've had a good golf career...  over 15 ( depending on majors ) you are near elite

20+  PGA tour wins you are in Top Tier Elite status.....

But i think if you end up with multiple majors, you tend to automatically end up in Elite status.... and the # of other PGA Tour wins tend to not matter as much....

[ccotenj]

if couples is in, zach has to be... :-) any 2 time major championship winner (especially if 1 of them isn't the pga), as long as he hasn't "done an andy north", certainly deserves to have at least 1 foot in the door... imo, that 2nd major is a big differentiator... i would put zach's career (which isn't done) easily above kite/couples/wadkins, around the same or a bit better than o'meara/nelson, and bit below strange....

[Gunther]

He's far ahead of Couples so yeah, he is a playa. Great dude too.

[Golfingdad]

Looks like Davis Love III is the best "modern" player not in the Hall.  19 PGA wins, 1 major.  Not to mention, 2 of those wins were Players Championships.

After that is Jim Furyk (16 and 1), Tom Weiskopf (15 and 1), and Corey Pavin (14 and 1)

The magic number clearly seems to be that second major championship.  There are some HOFers with 1 and some non HOFers with many regular wins and one or no majors, but there are ZERO players with double digit regular wins and 2 or more majors NOT in the Hall of Fame.

When looking at it from that perspective, seems like he belongs.

[saevel25]

The magic number clearly seems to be that second major championship.  There are some HOFers with 1 and some non HOFers with many regular wins and one or no majors, but there are ZERO players with double digit regular wins and 2 or more majors NOT in the Hall of Fame.

When looking at it from that perspective, seems like he belongs.

I wonder what the criteria should be for the GHOF.

If you look at total wins, top 10% is 25 PGA Tour wins and over. Top 10% for majors is 3 wins and over.

I'd say it should be something like, if 1 or none majors at least 25 wins or more. If you have 2-3 majors then that overall wins drops to 20. If you have 4 and over that overall wins drops to 15.

[Gunther]

I wonder what the criteria should be for the GHOF.  If you look at total wins, top 10% is 25 PGA Tour wins and over. Top 10% for majors is 3 wins and over. I'd say it should be something like, if 1 or none majors at least 25 wins or more. If you have 2-3 majors then that overall wins drops to 20. If you have 4 and over that overall wins drops to 15.

I could live with that. More in that shouldn't be than out than should be.

[ccotenj]

Looks like Davis Love III is the best "modern" player not in the Hall.  19 PGA wins, 1 major.  Not to mention, 2 of those wins were Players Championships. After that is Jim Furyk (16 and 1), Tom Weiskopf (15 and 1), and Corey Pavin (14 and 1) The magic number clearly seems to be that second major championship.  There are some HOFers with 1 and some non HOFers with many regular wins and one or no majors, but there are ZERO players with double digit regular wins and 2 or more majors NOT in the Hall of Fame. When looking at it from that perspective, seems like he belongs.

that's not an unreasonable perspective... :-) fwiw, none of the 4 would be in my hof (edit: zach is in, imo)... i'm still steamed that they put couples in there on the "we have to elect somebody this year" theory... "funny" seeing furyk, pavin and weiskopf listed next to each other... two guys who have gotten just about everything they could have gotten out of their talent, and the other (arguably) the least he could have gotten...

[tristanhilton85]

At this point, even if he doesn't get another win, I think that he is in.

[Golfingdad]

I'd say it should be something like, if 1 or none majors at least 25 wins or more. If you have 2-3 majors then that overall wins drops to 20. If you have 4 and over that overall wins drops to 15.

Seems reasonable.  Looks like your Hall would exclude Lanny Wadkins, Ben Crenshaw, Doug Ford, Hubert Green, Tom Kite, Julius Boros, Nick Price, Curtis Strange, Jack Burke, Ralph Guldahl, Mark O Meara, Denny Shute, Tommy Bolt, Fred Couples, Jock Hutchison, Ken Venturi, Payne Stewart, Larry Nelson and maybe a few others.

I should note that I don't really care about this stuff that much.  By that, I mean, I don't have strong opinions either way about who does or doesn't "belong."  When I went to Cooperstown a few years ago I was not very interested in the actual "Hall" part with all of the players busts.  I liked the museum part much better, and I'm sure that I'd feel the same way if I ever obey Gary Player and make my way down to Florida.  No dammit, I don't "got to go!"

[saevel25]

Seems reasonable.  Looks like your Hall would exclude Lanny Wadkins, Ben Crenshaw, Doug Ford, Hubert Green, Tom Kite, Julius Boros, Nick Price, Curtis Strange, Jack Burke, Ralph Guldahl, Mark O Meara, Denny Shute, Tommy Bolt, Fred Couples, Jock Hutchison, Ken Venturi, Payne Stewart, Larry Nelson and maybe a few others.

I should note that I don't really care about this stuff that much.  By that, I mean, I don't have strong opinions either way about who does or doesn't "belong."  When I went to Cooperstown a few years ago I was not very interested in the actual "Hall" part with all of the players busts.  I liked the museum part much better, and I'm sure that I'd feel the same way if I ever obey Gary Player and make my way down to Florida.  No dammit, I don't "got to go!"

I was strictly speaking PGA Tour wins because that is the data I found, but European tour wins would count as well. Maybe that ups the totals wins a bit if you combine. I am sure some PGA Tour players don't play in as many European events as European players play in PGA Tour events. I am not sure how to weight some of the wins versus others.

I thought top 10% would be a good number to go by.

The World Golf HOF is a pretty cool place. I'd only go back if I was playing TPC Sawgrass again ;)

[mvmac]

BTW here's the criteria.

http://www.worldgolfhalloffame.org/induction/criteria/

Quote:

Beginning with the Class of 2015, the World Golf Hall of Fame & Museum will use the following process and criteria for an individual to be inducted:

SELECTION COMMISSION

The process is governed by a Selection Commission made up of 16 individuals who will be responsible for electing individuals into the Hall of Fame.  To be inducted, an individual must receive approval from at least 75% of the Selection Commission.  The Selection Commission is Co-Chaired by Hall of Fame members Nancy Lopez, Arnold Palmer, Gary Player and Annika Sorenstam.


CATEGORIES & CRITERIA

Female Competitors

A player must have a cumulative total of 15 or more official victories on any of the tours with membership in the Rolex Women’s World Golf Rankings (LPGA, Ladies European Tour, Japan LPGA, Korea LPGA and Australia Ladies Professional Golf)  OR at least two victories among the following events: U.S. Women’s Open, LPGA Championship, du Maurier Classic (1979-2000), Women’s British Open (2001-current), Kraft Nabisco Championship (1983-current), The Evian Championship (2013-current), Titleholders Championship (1937-1942, 1946-1966, 1972), and the Western Open (1930-1967).A player must be at least 40 years old at the start of the year in which selections are made (example: A player must have turned 40 years old prior to January 1, 2014 in order to qualify for the Class of 2015), or be at least five years removed from being an active participant (as determined by the Tour) on any of the tours with membership in the Rolex Women’s World Golf Rankings.

Male Competitors

A player must have a cumulative total of 15 or more official victories on any of the original members of the International Federation of PGA Tours (PGA TOUR, European Tour, Japan Golf Tour, Sunshine Tour, Asian Tour and PGA of Australasia) OR at least two victories among the following events: The Masters, THE PLAYERS Championship, the U.S. Open, The Open Championship and the PGA Championship.

A player must be at least 40 years old at the start of the year in which selections are made (example: A player must have turned 40 years old prior to January 1, 2014 in order to qualify for the Class of 2015), or be at least five years removed from being an active participant (as determined by the Tour) on any of the original members of the International Federation of PGA Tours.

Veterans Category

To be considered for selection in the Veterans category a player’s competitive career must have primarily occurred prior to 1980.  There is no minimum win criterion.  Amateurs and professionals are eligible to be considered in the Veterans category.

Lifetime Achievement Category

To be considered for selection in the Lifetime Achievement category, an individual must have contributed to the game significantly in areas outside of the competitive arena (i.e. administrator, course architect, innovator, instructor, media, etc.).

Individuals may be nominated in the Veterans and Lifetime Achievement Categories by a member of the Selection Sub-Committee.

[Gunther]

BTW here's the criteria. [URL=http://www.worldgolfhalloffame.org/induction/criteria/]http://www.worldgolfhalloffame.org/induction/criteria/[/URL]

Thanks for the info. I'm ok with all of the criteria except minimum age, should be 50, imo. I just think it's weird that Vijay, Phil and Ernie are out there competing as HoFers with the young guys.

[Rick Martin]

Zach has played and beaten some pretty good competition, including winning during the Tigs-era, so there's that.

He definitely has more than Couples - not sure Freddie deserves to be there, but that's another thread.