Fitting Your Entire Set Yourself

[ShotShySheriff]

Has anyone ever fitted their entire set of irons themselves ?

By that, i mean tested every club, adjusted their own lie angles, lofts for gapping, desired spin, shaft lengths, swing weights etc etc

This is a topic that interests me and there is very little informative information out there about it that is recent. So decided to give it a go as an EXPERIMENT to find out results.

Purchased a new set of of the shelf Adams Idea 2014 irons for the experiment and I'm in the process of cutting them down etc etc. The reason why I chose these irons is I have hit before, quite liked, and they are not adjustable for lie or loft really as cast (might move a little) so I really wanted to see the affect of manipulating lie from amending shaft lengths etc.

I like to know what my clubs are doing and why, so this is a learning experiment to understand just how I can change my own shots / game etc

Anyone had a go at this to see what happens as a DIY project ?

Don't worry, I have another set of TaylorMade Rsi 1, so I dont care if I bugger these up. If I do bugger them up then ill probably learn more from it. :)

[freshmanUTA]

I'm sure there's a lot of people that bend and cut their own clubs. It's all about knowing what to do and why.

 

Its always safe to get a second opinion.

[Patch]

I have done it just to see what would happen. I even purchased all the components and built a set of irons. Of course I first read some books on club tinkering to get an idea as to what needed to be done to get the desired effects I was looking for.

In the end I pretty much decided to leave my club adjustments to the professional who could analyze my swing, and ball flights. I still mess with putters to this day. I am even building one right now. Again, just to see what it does. 

I once read a story on how Moe Norman adjusted his own clubs.He said he used a vise, hammer,  and 2 X 4s to bend his clubs. He'd tweak a club, and then try it out. Maybe tweak it again, or as many times needed to get it to play like he wanted.  

Edited February 22, 2016 by Patch

[ShotShySheriff]

Yep, similar. I've done plenty of looking into and as I am a software tester by trade I am quite analytical so therefore like seeing GC2, Trackman numbers etc.

I have a bad back which means I cant carry so as we have now had months of trolley bans I am more of a summer golfer, but not through choice.

I am not one of those people who go for lessons, have done in the past, I just want to enjoy my golf in the limited time I get to play it. So, for me, it is about getting the club to do what suits me and my bad back, especially the off days, and not about getting me to suit the club.

The way I started off with this I first wanted to stop being erratic on my bad days, and that erratic-ness was to roll my hands too much to compensate for not being able to rotate correctly. What this led to was shots left and shots right, so the first thing I did to these clubs was go to a jumbo grip size to stop me going left. It prevents me from rotating my hands and now I have pretty much eliminated the left hand side of the fairway. I am now always right of target. 

With this in mind I now want to minimize the right of the target to home in further.

The lengths of these Adams as standard were

3 iron	40.75
4 Iron	39.75
5 Iron	39
6 Iron	38.25
7 Iron	37.5
8 Iron	36.75
9 iron	36
PW	35.75
SW	35.25

 

After doing some GC2 work etc my figures in yards for being right of the target and my carry were as per below

3 iron	201
4 Iron	195
5 Iron	182
6 Iron	181
7 Iron	160
8 Iron	133
9 iron	129
PW	114
SW	84

 

Now the first thing I decided to do before amending the clubs was to change my release. Ive changed from a roll release to a stable release as suits the grip, and my back better. By doing this Ive lost ball speed, but I really dont carry about that. I am not concerned by distance, I am concerned by accuracy. As a result, ive now lost a club length, but my dispersion has tightened up, well except longer irons, but that is the back and not being able to control.

My carry and dispersion is now as follows

3 iron	189	16
4 Iron	180	12
5 Iron	167	10
6 Iron	158	8
7 Iron	143	6
8 Iron	135	4
9 iron	129	4
PW	106	2
SW	83	1

 

I should also point out that the clubs originally were swing weight D 0.5 to D 1.5, but the 25g extra from grips took them to C6 to C 7.5 ish.

My swing path is pretty much near neutral or slightly into out so making the butt heavier has helped the club head catch up a bit and I guess become a little more closed. I already play with a driver at C5 so I like having less weight in the head.

Assuming that 0.5 " of shaft equates to +1 degree and 1 degree equates to 4 yards I decided to make some changes. I cant amend the lie angle as cast and pretty much wont move much in this set.

By making the shafts shorter I should in theory increase the lie angle and probably go a little more into out to produce a draw and maybe a little more distance.

I have cut the shafts down to lengths as follows

3 iron	38.75
4 Iron	38.25
5 Iron	37.75
6 Iron	37.25
7 Iron	36.75
8 Iron	36.25
9 iron	35.5
PW	35.5
SW	35.25

 

This should, in theory, in very basic terms bring my dispersion a lot tighter back to centre, and hopefully be marginally right, or very marginally left. Of course golf isnt that simple and club building is a lot more complicated than this which is exactly why I want to do this as an experiment to see what happens.

Cutting down the shafts though has amended my swing weights and will roughly be as per below.

3 iron	C 0.5
4 Iron	C 1.25
5 Iron	C 1.25
6 Iron	C 3.5
7 Iron	C 3.5
8 Iron	C 5
9 iron	C 4.25
PW	C 5.85

 

This is just done on calculations at present but ill double check properly once I put the new grips on when they arrive.

I want to roughly put these at about C 5 so I will do some GC2 work as they are above to see where they are, and then use lead weighted tape strips to bring to around C5. See weather I need them on toe, heel etc etc

Looking forward to see how badly these have buggered up, or perhaps created a miracle :)

Still awaiting grips at the moment so at the moment my progress is that they are all cut down and ready to go.

I dont mind if I bugger them up, but you never know, this might turn out useful for someone as all I could really find on the web was about people cutting down there driver, so this may answer some questions.

I know what a club fitter would say, but I am one of those people you likes to have tested both ends of the spectrum to see what happens, not get fitted based on a 7 iron.

 

 

 

[ShotShySheriff]

I have also trimmed down an Adams Tight Lies 2 5 wood from 42" D 5 to a 39.25", which Ill also swing weight to C5, currently B 8.5 after all changes.

I know by doing this ill have a big gap at the top of the bag as my 5 Wood is around 210 prior to change, so probably 195 after. My driver is 265 carry, so massive gap between. I should condense my gapping lower end though as I also have a gap and lob wedge and I dont think the gap will be needed, so can replace with a 3 wood.

All very interesting playing around, and I look forward to the results and tinkering whilst I cant get on course.

[vangator]

I build all my own clubs.  I only build irons because I just never found a non OEM wood head that I thought was as good as the OEM.  There are too many good deals on slightly used woods.

I started building my own clubs over 30 years ago.  I would build irons for family and friends.  I don't have the proper equipment to adjust loft, so I just kept the lofts as they were.  Adjusting lie isn't as bad.  I just build for myself now and I'm a standard lie and length.  I don't adjust my lofts because once a cast iron is adjusted, it will try to go back to the original, so I adjust to the loft, not the other way around.  I Spine align and FLO my shafts.  I have a swing weight scale.  Pretty easy.  My divots are great, confirming that I do have a standard lie.

I would like to invest in a monitor so I could analyze my swing.  I have a set of irons I'm breaking in right now that I'm not happy with.  I really suspect it is the shafts.  I'm going to do some more tinkering, but I suspect I'll be going back to TT DG S300.

Get a good club building book and a swing scale.  Build up the shop as you go.  I have a pretty fully equipped wood shop, so that helps with lots of little things like vises, saws etc.

[Tee2Trees]

I think they are going to be way too light.  You can bring the SW back using lead tape on a driver, but with an iron it will need too much extra weight to get there with tape, and the flex will become noticeably stiffer.  Practice hitting the irons off a tee, where you should be able to flush them quite regularly.  I find that with irons having too little weight it is harder to find the center of the face, and the miss is usually heel-side and thin.

[ShotShySheriff]

11 hours ago, Tee2Trees said:

I think they are going to be way too light.  You can bring the SW back using lead tape on a driver, but with an iron it will need too much extra weight to get there with tape, and the flex will become noticeably stiffer.  Practice hitting the irons off a tee, where you should be able to flush them quite regularly.  I find that with irons having too little weight it is harder to find the center of the face, and the miss is usually heel-side and thin.

You might be right, however, the SW, which i am not amending further, is already at C6 and is my most accurate club, even over other gap and lob wedges I have. Generally, wedges are 1 SW more than other clubs in set anyway, so be interesting to see what C5 comes out like. C5 is pretty much around a ladies spec anyway isnt it.

With regards weight, i have some little ones which are 1 SW each, and they are thicker than standard tape. I will play around with the MOI with the weight also on different locations of the iron head. These clubs already have the sole speed slot in them so that should also help to a degree with forgiveness, as should be shorter in general. Im not fussed that will feel stiffer either to be honest, as have played stiff in different other clubs, and do so in my driver.

[RussUK]

Wouldnt trust myself building/fitting my own clubs. I can barely put a shelf up without causing total chaos!

[ShotShySheriff]

Decided to go with MOI for swing weights instead of same swing weights for all.

My 9 iron was the bench mark as this was the club I got most out of from changing from roll release to stable release. No distance loss at all, but every other club did, so used this to calculate MOI from for all club so that hopefully feel the same swing for all irons now.

9 iron swing weight was C 3.5 after changes, although I am not 100% that has calculated correctly, but it does not really matter as it has all been done as a ratio. I used http://www.leaderboard.com/SWINGWEIGHT

My final swing ratings then are

5 Wood	B 9.5
3 iron	C 0.5
4 Iron	C 1.5
5 Iron	C 2.5
6 Iron	C 3
7 Iron	C 3.5
8 Iron	C 4
9 iron	C 5
PW	C 5
SW	C 5.5

 

I have not swung these yet, but will do some GC2 data in the next couple of days if I can and then compare to see how drastically these have been affected.

[ShotShySheriff]

Made some further changes and calculations after using the MOI spreadsheet supplied by Tom Wishon.

These sets are hybrid sets, 3-6 are hybrid and 7-SW are different.

The two I hit the best were the 5 iron from the hybrids and the 9 irons from the non hybrid, so I have matched MOI for hybrids to the 5 iron and MOI matched the others to the 9 iron.

My final spec, still not tried yet is now

I have cut the shafts down to lengths as follows

3 iron	38.75
4 Iron	38.25
5 Iron	37.75
6 Iron	37.25
7 Iron	36.75
8 Iron	36.25
9 iron	35.5
PW	35.5
SW	35.25

 

MOI Matched

5 Wood	4,690
3 Iron	4,687
4 Iron	4,656
5 Iron	4,665
6 Iron	4,654
7 Iron	5,048
8 Iron	5,043
9 Iron	5,048
PW	5,049
SW	5,044

 

MOI matched to 99.31% for Wood an Hybrids

MOI matched to 99.89% for NON Wood an Hybrids

 

[ShotShySheriff]

Here are the GC2 stats of before "off the shelf" standard and "adjusted myself".

 

[SavvySwede]

@ShotShySheriff, these number look made up. You're listed as a 9 handicap but you're trying to tell me you average no more than six yards offline with your irons now? Or this this something where the software averages out all the left and right misses and the number doesn't really represent anything but tendency?

[ShotShySheriff]

Its the average of left to right, same as any trackman, flightscope summary etc. A + number means to the right of target and a - number equals to the left of target.

It was done with gc2 and foresight sports indoor sim.

It has definitely tightened up compared to off the shelf. That was the point of my test, as 6 iron to 3 iron were always too long for me and I lacked control.

Taking the furthest left and furthest right the figures before and after are this much tighter after : -

3 Iron - 23 yards tighter

4 Iron - 15 yards tighter

5 Iron - 18 yards tighter

6 Iron - 19 yards tighter

7 Iron - 6 Yards tighter

8 Iron - 5 Yards tighter

9 Iron - 4 Yards tighter

PW - 2 Yards tighter

SW - 4 Yards tighter

 

Not sure what difference my handicap makes as Ive always been someone who hits GIR or chips from the edge, I am just a rubbish putter, who very rarely ever 1 putts. I also play on quite a short course, which helps, as generally, apart from maybe 2 non par 3 holes, Im never any further than 7 iron for GIR shot.

I have only hit these change today indoors. I have not hit on course yet, and wont for a while as I cant carry due to bad back and we have trolley bans everywhere because of the bad weather.

Edited February 25, 2016 by ShotShySheriff

[ShotShySheriff]

The 5 Wood by the way is buggered :) If I threw my hands as fast as I could I just about manager to get a straight shot, but went no further than the 3 iron. Producing the stable release swing I could not keep it from flying way right as obviously cut down way too much.

The 8 iron, well, for some reason there just seems a complete lack of comparison compared to other clubs, both before and after adjustment. Actually, perhaps it that I just hit the 9 iron better and further.

I think ill cut the 9 iron down a further quarter inch also so that it increases the lie and brings back to center a bit more as I was leaving that marginally right on most of the shots and does now not match how most of the other clubs are acting, i.e slight draw.

What I have noticed is that the 3-6 irons are now slightly more inconsistent front to back in carry, which is not a good thing. They have gone from averaging around 7 yards front to back to 11, so a 50% increase. Something I need to see if I can get use to by improve my consistency of strike.

[SavvySwede]

15 minutes ago, ShotShySheriff said:

Its the average of left to right, same as any trackman, flightscope summary etc. A + number means to the right of target and a - number equals to the left of target.

It was done with gc2 and foresight sports indoor sim.

It has definitely tightened up compared to off the shelf. That was the point of my test, as 6 iron to 3 iron were always too long for me and I lacked control.

Taking the furthest left and furthest right the figures before and after are this much tighter after : -

3 Iron - 23 yards tighter

4 Iron - 15 yards tighter

5 Iron - 18 yards tighter

6 Iron - 19 yards tighter

7 Iron - 6 Yards tighter

8 Iron - 5 Yards tighter

9 Iron - 4 Yards tighter

PW - 2 Yards tighter

SW - 4 Yards tighter

Not sure what difference my handicap makes as Ive always been someone who hits GIR or chips from the edge, I am just a rubbish putter, who very rarely ever 1 putts. I also play on quite a short course, which helps, as generally, apart from maybe 2 non par 3 holes, Im never any further than 7 iron for GIR shot.

I have only hit these change today indoors. I have not hit on course yet, and wont for a while as I cant carry due to bad back and we have trolley bans everywhere because of the bad weather.

Ok, so before you were missing most of your shots wide right and now your misses are more evenly distributed in left/right frequency and without the bigger misses with the longer irons. That makes a lot more sense.

[ShotShySheriff]

Yep, correct. 

[vangator]

I question those swing weights.  Did you get them from a scale?  I've been building clubs for a long time and never get swing weights that low.