Right elbow during back swing

[Hacker James]

One thing that has helped me with an in to out swing path is to maintain the relative position of my right elbow during the back swing. I try to keep my elbow in front of my torso at all times as opposed to allowing it to get behind me. I do this by keeping my elbow pits pointing skyward at address and then think “keep my elbow pointing at my belt buckle.” There will be some separation during the back swing, but in relation to the chest, the position remains fairly constant as I turn.  On the down swing, I have the feeling of a right arm underarm throw. I am sure others have said something similar. In any event it is working for me.

[StefanUrkel]

At the right hip the entire time.  The pit of elbow should be pointing straight up the whole time.  

[iacas]

1 hour ago, StefanUrkel said:

At the right hip the entire time.  The pit of elbow should be pointing straight up the whole time.  

While generally true there are many, many examples that make this a clear non-commonality.

[Hacker James]

and @iacas is another reason I try not to state absolutes but rather what it does (or what I feel it does) for ME. If others find themselves in agreement, fine, if not, that is also good, and if they add something to my perspectives, even better. Some forty years ago, I had a swing that was entirely different than what it is today, flying elbow et al.

[Hacker James]

Another aspect at what I was alluding to, albeit perhaps not as clearly as instructors more gifted than myself in terms of relating is the idea of moving limbs, shoulders, torso as a single unit. This concept has been explained in different ways by teachers such as Jim Waldron in Hawaii in his “Arm Swing Illusion”, by Quinton Martin in explaining rotational swing model where he even goes into the movement of specific bones by no more than 2 inches, the one commonality they all share is that from address to top of the swing, the arms are kept in basically the same relationship to the torso and move very little laterally or independently. One way that is sometimes used to demonstrate this is to take your club straight up as if you were going to bonk yourself in the forehead, then turn your shoulders as you normally do, and getting into a more or less perfect position at the top, turn your head and look in the direction of the clubhead and you would notice that your hands and arms are still more or less centered in the middle of your torso. There are small departures from this to be sure but usually in how they get there. Furyk, Couples, Fowler for examples. Even when comparing single plane and two plane, they also have a lot in common with this perception. As I have stated on multiple occasions, the best swing is the one that works (for you). Feel may not be real, but it can be YOUR reality at one spot in the space-time continuem. (sp).    

Edited September 8, 2016 by Hacker James

[StefanUrkel]

You are way too technical for a 20 handicap. I'm guessing you could take any decent athletic male and make him a 14 handicap if their setup, grip and short game was ok.

[Hacker James]

37 minutes ago, StefanUrkel said:

You are way too technical for a 20 handicap. I'm guessing you could take any decent athletic male and make him a 14 handicap if their setup, grip and short game was ok.

not sure what you mean. My handicap has been a bit lower. I am starting afresh after a year of not playing and  my computer crashing with spreadsheet data lost, but the indices are going down each round. Hogan stated in his book, that he saw no reason why any person with normal athletic ability could not break 80 with solid fundamentals as you point out.

Edited September 8, 2016 by Hacker James

[saevel25]

3 hours ago, StefanUrkel said:

You are way too technical for a 20 handicap. I'm guessing you could take any decent athletic male and make him a 14 handicap if their setup, grip and short game was ok.

I disagree. You have athletes like professional baseball and football players who down right suck at golf. 

Grip and set up do not equal a good swing. 

[natureboy]

2 hours ago, Hacker James said:

not sure what you mean. My handicap has been a bit lower. I am starting afresh after a year of not playing and  my computer crashing with spreadsheet data lost, but the indices are going down each round. Hogan stated in his book, that he saw no reason why any person with normal athletic ability could not break 80 with solid fundamentals as you point out.

But the caveat on that was that Hogan would be teaching them.

[Hacker James]

19 minutes ago, natureboy said:

But the caveat on that was that Hogan would be teaching them.

One could point to any number of caveats. In reviewing the book, I can not find where he said that "he would have to be the teacher", he did point out that the person ascribing to the fundamentals he was espousing could achieve ultimate success.  Then again, there is Charles Barkley. At one point, Hogan said something to the effect "I think I might have made a pretty good teacher", but apparently he did not personally teach anyone as far as I know other than maybe pointing out things he noticed from time to time. 

[natureboy]

1 minute ago, Hacker James said:

One could point to any number of caveats. In reviewing the book, I can not find where he said that "he would have to be the teacher", he did point out that the person ascribing to the fundamentals he was espousing could achieve ultimate success.  Then again, there is Charles Barkley. At one point, Hogan said something to the effect "I think I might have made a pretty good teacher", but apparently he did not personally teach anyone as far as I know other than maybe pointing out things he noticed from time to time. 

I thought I read somewhere that he actually did at one point. May mis-remember. Also thought he did say in one of his books that he could take someone of average ability and teach them to break 80. May have been 'Power Golf'. Not 100% sure on it.

[Hacker James]

10 minutes ago, natureboy said:

I thought I read somewhere that he actually did at one point. May mis-remember. Also thought he did say in one of his books that he could take someone of average ability and teach them to break 80. May have been 'Power Golf'. Not 100% sure on it.

That could very well be. It sounds like something he would have said. I just could not find it, but does not mean its not there. I am fairly certain, that if things keep going as they are, I will reach that milestone (again). I find it a bit interesting that the above poster made a reference to my being too technical for a 20 capper. I note in several threads, there are those who are way more technical if not verbose with a HC of 30+.  I really do not think the HC actually relates to knowledge or understanding. There could be any number of reasons why the person has that HC.  I try to discuss things as perceptions as they apply to me, then try to find examples to support what I am experiencing.  P.S. Verbose.....Yah, I do that also.

Edited September 8, 2016 by Hacker James

[mchepp]

1 hour ago, saevel25 said:

I disagree. You have athletes like professional baseball and football players who down right suck at golf. 

Grip and set up do not equal a good swing. 

 

[natureboy]

22 minutes ago, mchepp said:

 

Flat takeaway, way inside. Golf is hard. I feel for him given how much he enjoys golf.

[Hacker James]

HA HA, Barkley...Actually Hank Haney had him hitting not so bad for awhile there. Not sure if it lasted though.

[StefanUrkel]

4 hours ago, saevel25 said:

I disagree. You have athletes like professional baseball and football players who down right suck at golf. 

Grip and set up do not equal a good swing. 

Pretty sure they have bad grips and setups. Most people do.  

[saevel25]

4 minutes ago, StefanUrkel said:

Pretty sure they have bad grips and setups. Most people do.  

So you have no clue of they have bad grips or set ups then.