My Swing (Slim_Pivot)

[mvmac 2,329]

17 hours ago, Slim_Pivot said:

On 4-30-18 your post showed taking the club away right palm down. Is that a better position to be in (and why, if you dont mind)?

It's a better position for me. My tendency is to lower my hands on the takeaway which leads me to set my right wrist too early, club head gets in and then the shaft gets shallow/narrow on the backswing. If I get shallow/narrow, sweet spot gets too low and behind me which causes me to stall my pivot and lift my arms. So for me feeling more "Nicklaus" helps me get the hands to ascend "up", keeps the sweet spot higher on the backswing and keep cranking the rotation of the torso. I also just like the way it feels. Gives me a good sense of where the face and mass of the club are. I don't have to "fight" the momentum of the club.

I think your takeaway/backswing is ok. Would prefer to see a face-on view.

Your club head is basically toe up at first parallel (A2), a little low/in but the shaft does load up your right forearm and by left arm parallel the shaft is pointing inside the ball line, which is good. The thing that stands out to me with your takeaway is that we start to see some space between your knees at A2, which might mean the sequencing of the lower body is happening too soon.

If you want to experiment with more of a  "right palm down" feel to see how it changes the picture, go for it. Especially since your swing starts by your head moving down, maybe a reaction to what I mentioned with the knees/lower body. The more "toe down" feel might help and the "domino" effect could facilitate the transition piece with the hands moving down and out. 

Something like this.

17 hours ago, Slim_Pivot said:

Do you still get your thumb under the shaft for support at the top, or is more “closed clubface swing type” with thumb on the side.

Which thumb? 

My left thumb is "under" the grip at the top but not sure what the right is doing, I don't think it supports much at the top. I honestly haven't given it much thought but to me the right thumb is just along for the right. My club face is "closed" at the top but it's a bit by design, stronger grip works better for me.

17 hours ago, Slim_Pivot said:

I’ve messed with doing this takeaway before, but get worried that my ideas will send my swing off on crazy tangents where I will become (more) lost. 

I gotcha. I think it's fine to experiment with feels/motions as long as it connects to a priority piece. If it doesn't change the picture the way you want, then ditch it. Just part of learning and owning your swing. Just don't get caught in the vicious cycle of "trying" swing theories or trying to make your swing look like a certain pro because you like their swing (been there done that). Has to always come back to your move. I want to highlight that I said picture, not ball contact, sometimes that can take a little while to catch up with the better motion (depending on the piece).

And obviously I would highly recommend making a trip to see @iacas, especially as the season is winding down. They have a great indoor academy in Erie.

[RST Rebuild 3]

So if I understand you; keep hitting balls at full speed and let an instructor tell you how to correct while the student is at full speed?  I'm living proof that doesn't work and have had coaching just like Slim, which is why I'm interested in the young man.  I was also told my swing looked just like the pros. Nothing of the sort, across the line and vertical coming down with a flip. I never improved. Once I saw it on camera after I ingrained it.  I was furious.  It can be unwound at slower speeds and properly ingraining by repping it in big time and learning left side dominance.  It takes months and I'm seeing it for myself after thousands of reps. I've seen the results of doing it this way with RST for myself.  So, not a fan of that because I have suffered from that approach tremendously.  I'm laying low until I see a post from Slim_Pivot.    

[iacas 7,356]

Just now, RST Rebuild said:

So if I understand you; keep hitting balls at full speed and let an instructor tell you how to correct while the student is at full speed?

Huh?????

No. You don’t understand.

[mvmac 2,329]

9 minutes ago, RST Rebuild said:

So if I understand you; keep hitting balls at full speed and let an instructor tell you how to correct while the student is at full speed?  

Not what @iacas is saying at all.

Swings without a ball and swings with a ball can be very different.

[RST Rebuild 3]

I'll bite one last time.  I agree 100% with you mate and thank you for that. That's why he needed the ball to get out of his way so he can improve and get his brain to process the correct moves and be able to replicate it, after many reps, with a golf ball out of the way.  When he saw that change, I suspect he got super excited that hope is still alive and "what do I do next?.The golf club is stupid.  It does what your body tells it to do.  The more you machine gun those balls with a bad swing, the harder it is to unwind it. I totally agree with what you just posted.

I'm hanging in your home town man on business man.  Super jealous....impeccable weather. I'm gonna try that scooter rental. 

[iacas 7,356]

It’s quite unlikely that he’s going to be able to do those moves any time soon (years) at any good speed with a ball.

Please stop biting.

@Slim_Pivot, please, a pair of 6I videos from two good angles. FO and DtL.

[Slim_Pivot 40]

Here are two 6i videos. I “felt” like a DJ, Koepka backswing where the face is closed. I hit it farther this way. With shortening my swing...I think this is the best route for me. Also, the face not feeling open helps me pivot my body better ( I think)

https://youtu.be/G51PqijpjFE

I also (successfully?) implemented the posture recommended by @mvmac 

[RST Rebuild 3]

I can see that you are releasing the club and rotating it through impact really well.  Looks like you took the turf after the strike.  Did you feel like you compressed the ball pretty good?

[Slim_Pivot 40]

8 minutes ago, RST Rebuild said:

I can see that you are releasing the club and rotating it through impact really well.  Looks like you took the turf after the strike.  Did you feel like you compressed the ball pretty good?

Yes. Def hit down on it, always do when I use that “closed” feel. It’s normally my emergency swing but it works. Release was natural consequence, no thought of release or hold off.

[RST Rebuild 3]

That's great man!  And that's how it should happen.  When you post up on that lead leg it will turn it loose without any conscious effort for effortless distance.  Much shorter takeaway.  You're a hard working dude.  I wish I could hit full shots but I'm still on my Step 4. 

[Slim_Pivot 40]

I started in March lol

[RST Rebuild 3]

Sorry to hear that mate. Wow.  Well, like you said, you had some bad coaching that held you back. I had the same thing happen to me and it sucks. I'm at 2 months in now with my RST rebuild.  My goal is to be hitting short shots at 4 months and then full at 6 months with a tour caliber swing. The coolest thing was I got five free online reviews when I signed up.  I just purchase three at a time as I need them.  Good luck with the changes and looking forward to seeing you're progress.

[iacas 7,356]

1 hour ago, RST Rebuild said:

That's great man!  And that's how it should happen.

God no.

No.

This isn't a highly functional swing at this point. There's a lot going on, and it starts to go awry at transition.

---

This stuff is off topic, so…

Spoiler

@RST Rebuild, look, you mean well, but you're a seven handicapper who is two months away from "hitting short shots" and four months from hitting full swings… and you've fully bought in to one swing pattern. So again, I know you're trying to help, but please stop, because you're way off base. Maybe do more listening or learning, maybe do more theory/discussion, and less pushing what you think is the way to swing a golf club.

[Slim_Pivot 40]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

God no.

No.

This isn't a highly functional swing at this point. There's a lot going on, and it starts to go awry at transition.

---

This stuff is off topic, so…

  Reveal hidden contents

@RST Rebuild, look, you mean well, but you're a seven handicapper who is two months away from "hitting short shots" and four months from hitting full swings… and you've fully bought in to one swing pattern. So again, I know you're trying to help, but please stop, because you're way off base. Maybe do more listening or learning, maybe do more theory/discussion, and less pushing what you think is the way to swing a golf club.

I know it’s bad...I honestly don’t even worry about it because of how steep I am coming down. I’m ignoring it until I can get the club bisecting my lower forearm  (I don’t know a lot of fundamentals, so it’s best to assume I know none)

I worked on hitting balls with the shortened backswing today Secondly I worked on my transition as always. I try to change direction/bump hips and then sort of “fall in a weightless manner” before my backswing is complete -so the club can shallow...but it does not. I have an upcoming lesson on Saturday to help me out. 

I post my feels in case  anyone has been here before and may have any insight into how they solved the same issue.

I Post my intention in case it’s wrong, so ppl with more knowledge can stop me before I get started.

[RST Rebuild 3]

Are you trying to bisect your lower forearm? ( not sure how that's even possible by coming down your elbow plane)  it should be your right bicep. Maybe I'm just not understanding you correctly.  In the model swing you did bisect your bicep ( upper half of the arm) and it was on plane. Now with a ball in the way I can tell you why it gets steeper.  You are trying to hit a ball and your right arm is firing to soon and wanting to take over for power but you don't need to do that. The right arm needs to stay passive until you post and release.  It will only steepen the shaft if you don't wait.  Your left arm needs to be the dominant player up until the last moment then you can use your right side to generate more speed by releasing the snot out of the golf club.  If you want to try something, hit some at a little slower speed and keep your right arm quiet and see if you have improvement. One drill would be to hit some easy ones with just your right finger tips touching the grip. The challenge is to break through with a ball in the way.  It takes time, stay patient with it.  But right arm dominance early in the swing causes the shaft to get steep. 

[Slim_Pivot 40]

17 minutes ago, RST Rebuild said:

Are you trying to bisect your lower forearm? ( not sure how that's even possible by coming down your elbow plane) 

Yes I’m trying. And ya, no kidding, it’s not like waving a wand. In my old/bad swing I got to this position with over the top and hit impulse and pulling the handle.

[Slim_Pivot 40]

30 minutes ago, RST Rebuild said:

Now with a ball in the way I can tell you why it gets steeper.  You are trying to hit a ball and your right arm is firing to soon. 

 I’m honestly really using my legs to start and feel like I’m squaring it up by turning my body around...kind of like I’m inside out...not in the golf sense but like I’m some kind of rubber ball with a cut in it being turned or squeezed inside out. It’s a hard feeling to explain. I think these are the correct motions. But the club isn’t behaving on video...yet. As for the hands, I really can’t feel either one during the swing I think they are working as a unit. And there might be a hit impulse but it honestly does feel like a swing. I can feel loading going back, I change direction with the hips that bumps them...at that time I feel like the club and everything is falling...and then I get that twisting inside out feeling I tried to describe. Now my hands are saving it at the end because they must. From everything I’ve heard good players talk about, I think these are correct feels. I’m either sending some forces wrong...or I don’t even know....but hey I can hit good shots lol. The goal is to get to scratch tho...all that and didn’t even mention that right leg in the downswing. But one mission at a time

[RST Rebuild 3]

Thanks for posting that.  Now I know what you're trying to do.  The club is running parallel and you're using bisecting to describe that position. You're working on swing plane so I can tell you how to check for a good swing plane with confidence. Place the camera behind your hands and point it straight down the target line.  Draw a line with a swing app, I use V1 golf, from the hosel of the club and extend it to you're lower right elbow and stretch the line all the way up.  That's your elbow plane and the closer you can stay on that line coming down the better.  It may shallow below it during your transition which is fine, depending on your unique swing or above it if you are casting the club. So to be clear , hosel to right elbow and draw a nice straight line across those two spots from DTL. Can't tell but you may be trying to get under plane and getting too shallow.  That line is your guide to good swing plane.  Every swing is unique but that shaft needs to be getting near that line when the plane is coming down at some point. If you get dead on it when your hands are approaching your right hip, you're good.