Questions For + Handicappers

I am currently a 5 handicap and want to get to the next level...

I was wondering if you could recollect and report what were the factors that allowed you to go from the mid single digit hdcp level to your current level.

A few questions:

1- How much time practicing did you put in during this time? What % of this time went to working on which areas of your game?

2 - Did your distance increase, decrease, stay the same? What about the length of your swing.

3 - How often did you take lessons? ( If any) How did you find the "right" teacher?

4 - How long did it take you to get from lets say a 5 to where you are now?

5 - What do you do now to maintain where you are , how much time do you put into what ever activities you do now?

6 - What was the MOST important factor in allowing you to make this improvement?

7 - What would you say is the least important factor which gets passed on as "a must to improve to scratch or better", but u found wasn't actually that important.

My guess is that + handicaps arent really that much better ballstrikers than we are, its just they're more consistant with their total games. They save more pars with short game than we do as well. Im assuming those are the real differences between us and them.

It's been quite a few years since I was giving strokes back to the course, but...

1. I practiced daily- usually an early am 9 before work, large bucket at lunch and then 2+ hours of range time in the evenings 3-4 days a week.

2. Distance was never the objective.

3. I had a swing coach that I saw for a lesson once a month although he taught at the course near my office and we'd do quick checks on things probably once a week.

4. Took me about a year of dedicated work to get from single digits to a +.

5. I don't maintain that kind of number. Takes time and dedication that I don't put into the game anymore. Now I play for fun and am happy getting around in the 70's.

6. Biggest change in my game during that time was my short game. The objective was always to get down in 2 from 120 yards and hole out anything greenside.

7. Least important for me was distance. Didn't care then and don't now. Controlling distance is way more critical than how far IME.

Good luck-

Just a side FWIW... during that time I played golf with some guys that were banging around on the Nike tour and the Q-school tour. They didn't hit the ball any better than a 5 hcpr, but they got up & down from anywhere! I asked Eteban Toledo once what was the difference between the Nike tour and PGA and he said "one putt every day".

Two years ago I got to play a round with Matt Kucher in Monterey. I was with him all day tee to green. He shot a 67, I shot a 77. I don't think he missed a putt inside of 7 feet all day.

Hi , thanks for the reply.

Well , if u can hang with Matt Kuchar , I wouldn't be worried about distance either ;) ( I could too and have plenty of max swing speed if needed ~120mph, but have been working on reigning it in and try to swing around 110mph on the course and in practice) I really like to swing for distance , but just have never been able to shoot my best scores swinging for the fences and never been able to practice enough to make that all out swing consistent enough to score... Everytime I spend a few weeks practicing taking my hands out of the swing and swinging 3/4 on the range, my scores come down in a hurry. It's just so boring What were your practice sessions like? Did u have a short game practice plan? Something that won't make me want to slit my wrists from boredom??

FWIW- I'm not a big hitter (probably 260-270 avg off the tee). The point was that neither is Matt Kucher and he's got a tour card and a couple of top 10's this year. Goes back to my comments about improvements from 120 yards and in.

To keep my short game practice from being tedious, I'd create games. Picking different targets, hittings different clubs, controlling trajectory. One of the biggest things was just playing up & down at the practice green. One ball, a couple of clubs & a putter- everything was a par 2. The practice area had room to go back up to 30 yards and we'd play for hours at a time.

I know, I was just trying to be funny :)

I'm firmly convinced that distance is not my problem... for the reasons i've listed and when I tried out for my college golf team the guys werent much more than 230 yards off the tee but got around in close to even par. Could you go into further detail on how you went about "making sure u get down in 2 from 120 and in"? Thanks!

Here is how to score:

Keep the ball in play.

Once you can do that work 90% on your wedges and 10% on putting from inside 10 feet.

The closer you hit your wedges the more birdies/par saves you'll make.

It's not that I "made sure" to get down in 2 from 120, but that was always the goal.

If you explain golf to a little kid, you'd describe it as a game where the object is to get the ball in the hole in the fewest amount of strokes. He wouldn't ask how or why, but probably say "OK" and just start firing at the hole right away. I just adopted the same approach. I hit a full SW 102 yards. I decided that anything from that distance and in, I was going to try and jar it. It doesn't mean I made a lot of 100 yard shots, but I did start leaving myself shorter putts.

great thread
i am trying to get down to a 2hcp by July of next year
i want to try and qualify for the SK open, to even try out you need an index of 2

this is the plan..keep the comments coming, great info

I am not a + Handicape but I play with a few and by far it is the short game and putting in particular. I am working hard on both becuase I can hit it farther than most of them and usually get on the green in regulation but they chip and putt like nobody's business. These guys simply get up and down with ease and nail putts all day from 5 feet and in and almost never ever 3 putt!

My goal to get lower is to average 1 putt per missed green If you can do that scratch or better should be right there for you!

Basically the biggest thing I've noticed when I've played with + handicaps is once the get a 7i or less in their hands 95% of the time they are inside 15 feet. Their short game is usually amazing and they practice a lot. I'm trying to get to a scratch and I've been stuck at a 2 for about a year now. Its just hard to find the amount of time needed to practice.

Right, I knew what u meant there...

btw, what was ur attitude towards shots with your PW, 9 , 8, 7 etc... in terms of where u aimed. For me, anything longer than my 52 degree wedge and i'm aiming to the fat part of hte green. 52 degree and in and I take dead aim, unless there is a lot of trouble to one side. PW, 9, 8 I aim about 10 feet to the safe side of the pin. 7, 6, 5 and I aim about 20 feet to the safe side 4 and below way to the safe side :)

Here is something else that I always wondered.....

In pitching, chipping and lag putting.... I wondered whether the best guys had some kind of system or whether it was all based on feel. What do I mean? Well for instance lets say you have a 20 foot putt, do you try to take the putter back 6" and if you have a 30 foot putt do you try to take it back 9" for example... conciously trying to control the distance you take it back OR is it purely feel? Same question for chipping/pitching. Another question i've wondered is if there are SAFER ways of playing certain types of short game shots.... My experience has been yes, ones that increase ur margin of error.... For instance I used to chip with the ball off my back foot with a square club face. I would always end up hitting a few fat.... I have since started playing the chips towards the middle/front of my stance with my wedge face open.... this allows me to either hit the chip perfect and it flies higher and farther , but doesnt roll as much, while if I hit it a little fat the open face still gets through/or on top of the turf but the face closes a bit, the ball doesnt fly as far but now rolls out more. Are there other SIMPLER/SAFER ways of playing certain short game shots ?

Good thread.

My goal by the end of this year is to be inside a 5.

When I go to practice, I only practice wedges and putting. Every once in a while I will get a bucket and work on the full swing. But if you are a single handicapper by now you have a swing you can trust. Sure, there are still things to work on, but to lower your scores the swing isn't the issue anymore.

It is getting the ball in the hole in fewer shots. Whether that is making more putts from 10 feet, chipping it in or close for a tap in, laying up on a par 5 and having a wedge you put inside of 10 feet, sand play, long two putts (over 40 feet).

Just my two cents...

When I played to a + handicap I practiced almost all the time, or at least it felt like it. During the school year (I was in college at the time) if I wasn't working or in class I was either at the driving range (or golf dome, it's cold in Duluth, MN), on a putting green or even putting around my apartment. I'd say that I spent a good 2 hours putting one way or another every day. Often times this practice took place indoors, either at the golf dome or in my apartment. Like I said, it can get very cold in Duluth and indoor practice is the only way to stay sharp over the winter months. Obviously during summer, I'd spend my time outside.

My time on the range was focused on hitting specific shots. I was working on hitting specific spots with my irons and shaping the ball in a specific way. I would spend my time on each and every shot just like if I were on the course. It would take me over an hour to hit a medium bucket of balls. I'd see at least 2 people come and go on both sides of me every time I went to the range (or dome). Many times on the range I'd play a round in my head going through each shot as I played this imaginary round. I "played" this round on my home course since I knew it well enough to know exactly where each shot would end up and what club I'd need next. This helped me focus on each and every shot. Obviously I'd "play" this round tee to green. My goal was to "hit every fairway and every green."

To address each of your questions....

1- How much time practicing did you put in during this time? What % of this time went to working on which areas of your game?

Easily 4 hours a day not including time actually playing golf. I spent at least 2 hours a day with a putter in my hand, an hour with my wedges and around the green and another hour on the range. On a good day, I'd get to the range twice, especially if there was something specific that I needed work on.

Once I reached a + handicap, I'd learned enough about myself that I was able to maintain this level with significantly less practice. I'm nearly scratch now and only get about 1 hour per day of combined range, wedge and putting work. The kicker here is that it takes a lot more time to fix glitches, I've lost some of my consistency and don't have all the "shots" that I used to have.

2 - Did your distance increase, decrease, stay the same? What about the length of your swing.

My distance didn't increase or decrease but it became more consistent. Before I practiced like this I knew that I hit my 9 iron 145-150 yards. With this practice under my belt, I knew that I hit my 9 iron 146-148 yards, I also knew exactly how the wind would affect the ball flight and distance. It became a feel thing more than anything else. I could feel the conditions and know exactly how it was going to affect the ball flight. This led to increased confidence which led to better shots, which led to increased confidence, etc, etc.

I'm not sure what you mean by "the length of my swing". I'm very a bare bones fundamentalist though and always have been. If anything I swing to just a hair short of parallel, I retained this swing at that time and still do.

3 - How often did you take lessons? ( If any) How did you find the "right" teacher?

Very seldom. Yep, exactly the opposite of what you'd expect. I had daily instruction through highschool and had a very good feel for how my golf swing should be. I was also a student of the game, specifically the fundamentals so I had a deep understanding for what problems resulted in what and how to fix my own game. When things did go wrong, as they always will, I'd pay a quick visit to my old golf coach. Usually we'd get things fixed in a quick hour or so.

I'm a big believer in knowing your own swing, knowing what can go wrong and how to fix it. Be a student of the game, of the fundamentals and understand what faults cause what results. Using a video camera can be a big help here (although I was never able to do that, still haven't). Finding an instructor who knows your game, your swing, is a huge benefit. My one who's game and who's faults are very similar to your own. Since my former coach is long since retired and 120+ miles away, I've been working to find a good instructor myself. I hit the jackpot a few months ago in finding somebody who was almost a mirror image of myself, now he headed back to school so the search is on, again.

4 - How long did it take you to get from lets say a 5 to where you are now?

I bounced back and forth between a 2 and a 5 through out highschool. I went from a 2.4 to +2.2 in a single summer. Most of this was due to consistent practice and course management. I started playing smarter, not necessarily better.

5 - What do you do now to maintain where you are , how much time do you put into what ever activities you do now?

I'm very frustrated with where I'm at now. I just can't spend the time practicing like I used to. Faults have crept into my swing and take longer to lose due to minimal practice time. I still hit range balls almost daily and practice with my putter quite a bit, especially around the house. I've got 2 small kids so it's tough to spend time on golf. It's worth it though.

6 - What was the MOST important factor in allowing you to make this improvement?

For me it was the mental game. I always played with an ego in highschool. Always had something to prove. When I was able to set that aside and just play golf, my scores really fell. Consistency is also huge. When I became more consistent, I had a lot more control over how I played the golf course. I started to make decisions on how I wanted to attack a given green or even pin. Golf becomes a lot of fun when you can attack a course in this way yet still play smart and conservative. Fairways and greens, fairways and greens, the birdies will come.

7 - What would you say is the least important factor which gets passed on as "a must to improve to scratch or better", but u found wasn't actually that important.

Distance. I hit the ball a long ways compared to a lot of people but on the vast majority of courses, you really don't need a long ball. I found that I hit a 2 iron off the tee more than any other club. I had no need to hit a driver on most holes. When you think about the best way to approach a given green or attack a given pin, a lot of times it has more to do with the angle of your approach than it does with swinging a 9 iron opposed to a smooth 7.

Consistency from the tee through the green at this level is HUGE. Focus on this and you'll be well on your way. Start with the part of the game that needs the most work (shameless plug for Scorecard here, it's simplified tracking stats that I've payed attention to for years) and go from there.

I dont know about you , but the difference between my average shot from 150 and the PGA Tour guys aren't even close. They drop it in there within 15 feet with regularity, i'm happy to hit the green. While their short games are MUCH MUCH MUCH better than mine, their long game is also better, but only MUCH better I guess.

For me the biggest factor in becoming a + handicap is...1) my over all understanding of my swing and how to control distance by controlling trajectory. 2) Vast improvement in course management... understanding when to hit what kind of shot and what gives me the best chance to recover from a bad swing or a bad bounce. Sometimes it's a bump and run and others it is a high soft shot. 3) Vast improvement course management... decision making with iron distances. I stopped trying to max out clubs all the time and have gone to 85 - 90% of a distance of a club. I know I can hit a 7 170-175, but I only try to hit it 165 most of the time. I get a lot more shots close to the pin. 4) speed on chipping and putting. Line is very important, but unless you are withing 5 feet, speed is a more important factor in putting.


I know I put course management twice, but that was the biggest difference.