Johnny Miller: "Tiger is a very good putter, but not a great putter."

[CG031]

I am currently reading Johnny Miller: I call the shots. So far, a pretty good read midway through the book...however, one thing that I read REALLY bothered me in the book, so I had to share it and I think it's a great topic to put out there and see peoples opinions.

Now, I've only been playing golf for three years, but having golf be part of my family for the past 50, I know a lot about the old greats like Jack, Arnie, Lee Trevino, etc. just from stories from my Uncles and Dad.

This part really bugged me in the book, Miller states : Tiger is a very good putter, but not a great putter. He's not a natural, feel-oriented putter along the lines of Ben Crenshaw, Phil Mickelson, or Bob Charles. If there's a weakness in his game, putting it is. Like Norman, Tiger has became an extremely good putter through hard practice and mastery of sound technique. But it's a stroke that is more prone to difficulty in middle age, and will take a lot of maintenance to keep sharp.

Now I never saw Bob Charles or Crenshaw (whom I have heard was an awesome putter) but I would certainly take Tiger's putting over Phil's putting. I think, although I have NOT seen all the players over the years, Tiger is the greatest putter of all time.

Certainly Johnny Miller thinks not.

So, overall this thread is not so much about his book as it is about this particular part.

What are your thoughts on Tiger's putting and how it stacks up all time?

[iacas]

I think he is technically sound. He works at it. He sometimes doesn't release the toe, and that's when he'll miss, but he's great at reading the greens, his speed is usually great, and he starts the ball on line more often than anyone else I can think of.

Tiger's putting stroke is probably technically more perfect than Ben's or Phil's. Johnny's knocking him because his putting stroke lacks "artistry," but to me the artistry is more internal: it's about reading greens and reacting (getting the feel/distance) to the putt.

The PGA Tour is a putting contest, and Tiger has more wins than anyone out there.

In the words of others, "that's just Johnny being Johnny." I don't see Tiger having difficulty putting when he gets into his upper 30s (if he's still playing much). Even if his stroke did slip a little he'd work harder to get it back. Heck, a technically proficient stroke probably has the chance to last longer than an "artistic" one - how do you re-groove an "artistic" stroke? Not by measuring things about it or something - that's getting technical.

[CG031]

I think he is technically sound. He works at it. He sometimes doesn't release the toe, and that's when he'll miss, but he's great at reading the greens, his speed is usually great, and he starts the ball on line more often than anyone else I can think of.

Yeah, exactly. Similar to what you said, wouldn't it be easier for a feel player to lose their putting as they get older than a player who is more 'technical', and I guess you could say 'mechanical' in his approach?

I like Johnny Miller I just feel his opinion is really far off on this topic, but I guess thats why it's mostly opinion.

[songwriter]

That's a surprising comment but Miller is no dummy. Hmmm... to me, Tiger seems to be an excellent putter. Maybe not one of the best of all time but to me, I equate him to Nicklaus... when the dough is on the line, I'm betting on him. And that counts in a very big way!

[BallStriker]

Johnny Miller is qualified to differentiate among the greatest putters ever, why?

[kris]

Tiger is a very good putter and makes clutch putts.

Phil should be, but (as much as I love him) misses puts he shouldn't miss down the stretch.

therefore, tiger is a better putter than Phil.

[CG031]

Johnny Miller is qualified to differentiate among the greatest putters ever, why?

Well his opinion is pretty valuable considering he was a great player at one point on the PGA Tour.

I brought it up because it was just something I stumbled on while reading the book.

[flanagan]

It's been a few years since his ideas for the book were formulated, so it would be interesting to know now what his thoughts are. Saw an interesting article comparing some of Tiger's putting stats to tour averages, etc. a few months ago and aside from what we all see, the numbers would certainly suggest he is a great putter compared to the rest of the tour.

[chad1043]

I'm just a novice, but if I was rating Tiger, I would put his short game #1, his putting second and his driving accuracy last. But that is my opinion and I'm not writing a book... Yet...

[aschaefer]

Tiger is a very good putter and makes clutch putts.

i think that has more to do with phil's love of choke artistry, and less to do with his putting skill.

[uppi]

Miller is an idiot. Whoever said that Johny Miller knows what hes talking about, have you ever heard him over the weekend at tournaments? He says so many idiotic things it rattles my brain that they havent fired him yet. One of my favorite things ever from him was back in 2007 when the US Open was at Oakmont and everyone was talking about how rediculous the setup was (Tiger included, I believe this is what started the US open challenge with golf digest) and Johnny Miller kept saying that all the players were being babies and that the course was not that hard. Sorry Johnny but Oakmont in 2007 was not the same "soft" Oakmont you shot 63 at or whatever it was to win. Johnny would have been lucky to break 75 with 2007's setup. He was a "slightly above average" PGA tour player in his day and acts like he has the credentials to criticise any player he wants to on tour, Tiger and Phil included.

[senorchipotle]

johnny miller is an ass, he talks way too much crap. i think he just likes to hear his own voice, quite honestly. he's got no class, and no consideration for the feelings of others. i take his words with less than a grain of salt.

[CG031]

Miller is an idiot. Whoever said that Johny Miller knows what hes talking about, have you ever heard him over the weekend at tournaments? He says so many idiotic things it rattles my brain that they havent fired him yet. One of my favorite things ever from him was back in 2007 when the US Open was at Oakmont and everyone was talking about how rediculous the setup was (Tiger included, I believe this is what started the US open challenge with golf digest) and Johnny Miller kept saying that all the players were being babies and that the course was not that hard. Sorry Johnny but Oakmont in 2007 was not the same "soft" Oakmont you shot 63 at or whatever it was to win. Johnny would have been lucky to break 75 with 2007's setup. He was a "slightly above average" PGA tour player in his day and acts like he has the credentials to criticise any player he wants to on tour, Tiger and Phil included.

Yeah, although I like him and think overall he is a good announcer (many people are way too critical of announcers; if you listen to them all they say some foolish things) but he does make some bad mistakes on his calls sometimes. But one thing I will say is I've learned a lot of golf through him so I don't think he's as bad as people claim.

IMO he was far better than 'slightly above average.' He was one of the best tour players back in his prime.

[zeg]

i think that has more to do with phil's love of choke artistry, and less to do with his putting skill.

I always thought Phil was more of a technical choker. His artistry is in his short game, but he chokes with such unbelievable precision...

[aschaefer]

I always thought Phil was more of a technical choker. His artistry is in his short game, but he chokes with such unbelievable precision...

hahaha, i think you might be right.

[Divot Tool]

Miller's book is actually an entertaining read. If I remember correctly, Miller called 'Phil' a quirky putter. . . but don't quote me on that.

With regards to short putts, I recall Phil missing a lot more than Tiger. Tiger makes more clutch putts. So according to Johnny Miller, it is better to have an inconsistent but pretty stroke, than a technically sound stroke which ticks like a Rolex. That's purely subjective.

Tiger employs his 'Putt to the Picture' pre-putt routine, which is pure feel. One of Tiger's putting keys-as documented in various golf publications- is to allow the left wrist to break on the follow through as it allows the putter head to release. That technique is predicated on feel.

While for a period of 2 years, Johnny Miller may have been the best golfer on the tour and possibly one of the tours best ball strikers, however he is no authority on putting. It is well known that his putting yips were detrimental to his demise on the tour. I find that quite ironic.

[ioaz81]

I hate to say this, but Johnny Miller drops my IQ whenever I listen to him. He is the Billy Packer of annoucing, just instead of basketball, it is golf. He says stuff that is always controversial and thats his only way to get people to listen. Sometimes I feel sorry for Jim Nantz who has to sit by him. I think that if I was stuck on an island with Johnny Miller, I would probably stick my head in the water and let the sharks eat me. Sorry, he just annoys me and makes annoucing awful.

[Shorty]

johnny miller is an ass,

Johnny Miller is far from an ass.

And if you ever saw Crenshaw or Bob Charles putting at their peak (Charles even now), you'd understand what Miller meant. They are natural putters whose putting was a mile better than anyone else. It's just that Tiger makes his great putts to win and Crenshaw and Charles putted great most of the time. They were infinitely better putters than Tiger is. And before someone gives me negative rep. and claims a contradiction here, the fact that Tiger makes great putts all the time to win does not automatically make him the greatest putter ever. He is almost certainly the greatest player and is a fantastic, great, brilliant, awesome putter, but Crenshaw and Charles were better. I eagerly await the disapproving comments from those who never saw Charles or Crenshaw.