Who uses 4 wedges with 1/4 and 1/2 swings?

[hamletsdead]

Okay, here's the deal. I've mainly been a feel player with my short game, and tend to use my lob wedge for everything 60 yards and in -- pitches, sand, chips from the fringe, etc. Some days I put a lot of shots within 8 feet of the cup, put a couple real close, and chip one in; other days I have a handful of easy chips that I manage to leave 16 feet from the cup. The inconsistency is killing me.

So today I took all my wedges out to the course, dropped a bunch of balls and tried to dial in my 1/4 and 1/2 swings like Pelz recommends. I realize one day's effort is woefully insufficient to both get average distances with all my wedges with these swings and groove them, but I wasn't feeling any love out there. It felt really wierd and mechanical to think to myself "Okay, I'm 10 yards off the green, 34 yards to the flag, so let's see . . . that's a 1/4 swing with my SW." I hit some nice shots when I did it that way, but I also ran some across the green into the fringe on the other side, and found it really difficult to make the exact same effort with every swing instead of adding a little extra oomph when it seemed to call for it.

So the question is, who out there has switched to the Pelz method, and how long did it take you to get comfortable doing it? A season? Longer? I'm used to just looking at a spot and thinking "Okay, I'll land it there" and then I swing and land it there (mostly) without thinking about my swing at all, so consciously going 1/4 swing and 1/2 swing feels uncomfortable.

[Gilles]

Don't know the Pelz Method, but since controllling pitching distance by controlling your backswing and release seems to be a universal golf rule, I guess it's quite similar to the instructions I use, which can be found on this site (please let me know if this is against forum rules on advertising) .

By training on this consciously, I've been able to discover the backswing and release I need for every 10-yard increment (e.g. 20 yards = 8 to 4, etc) up to the distance I cover with a full SW swing.

And as all things in Golf, I guess the conscious drills will suddenly transform in unconscious feel...

My 2 cents.


G.

[iacas]

I switched to that method. I even printed labels and stuck them to the underside of my shafts. It took one day, but then again, I'm fairly consistent...

1/4 swing is when the shaft gets parallel to the ground.
1/2 swing is when the shaft gets vertical or my arms get almost horizontal.
3/4 is when my shoulder just about touches my chin.
Full swing is full swing.

I use only three wedges.

It's not mechanical at all for me - it still leaves room for feel - and yet it also improves confidence. If I have 108 and my 3/4 PW goes 110, I grip down ever so slightly and I'm confident that I've got the perfect club and I know exactly how far back to swing it to hole out.

Nearly every shot still requires feel - there's wind, elevation, etc. I write down my carry yardages, so for a 50-yard shot, for example, I also have to figure out how much spin to put on it and how firm the greens are, etc.

There's still plenty of room for feel.

P.S. I also recommend that you only write down carry yardages. That's typically the important stuff - you'll get a feel for how far the ball will release for the 1/4 and 1/2 swings anyway.

[Shindig]

This concept came up on another thread about 18 months ago (it wasn't the focus of that thread, I think, and this isn't one of those "why didn't you search?" posts, by the way). I think I had just suggested to someone to always lay up to a full wedge distance (something I no longer stand by), and several people pointed out to me the advantages of knowing your 1/4 and 1/2 swing distances.

I went out and learned my 1/4 and 1/2 swing distances. I still haven't learned my 3/4 distances, but then again, the only field where I can hit the ball far enough to measure those is rarely open - I've been measuring using the balls I play with and thus am limited to the short game areas.

Ever since learning these distances - pretty much exactly what Erik is saying above - I've found my short game to improve. When I have a good lie and green to work with, I've been getting up and down with some amazing regularity (relative to the handicap).

I only have 3 wedges, and only 3 swings with each, but there isn't a significant gap in there: a full sand wedge only gets me about 85 yards, and a half pitching wedge nets me 60. So, 60-85 is a semi-dead zone, and 3/4 wedges are probably in there for me, but I'm so rarely in that gap it doesn't seem to matter to me.

[lumpuckeroo]

I also following in line with the previous posts, but I really only play 2 wedges, a GW and a SW, but the majority of all my shots are will the GW.

I play a full GW to 100 yards,
1/4 swing is waist high and a 25 yard shot.
1/2 swing is chest high and a 50 yard shot.
3/4 swing is shoulder high and a 75 yard shot.

So for the 35 yard shot, just a little above waist high and I have a 35 yard swing. I have found it a little more simple to just use one club and dial in a variety of distances instead of mulitiple clubs, I'm sure there are pro's and con's to both methods.

[flanagan]

I play 4, but my "P" isn't really a wedge in my mind, so I feel like I'm just playing 3, starting with my 52 degree, which is my 100 yard club. I vow every year to do the measuring distance, taping the yardages to my club thing and blow it off every year just like I have this year. I pretty much know my full swing and half swing distances with my 52/56/60 and work with those. Our range is elevated (hitting everything to the landing area below)and the area where you can pitch to a hole and practice short game is uphill, so I don't really have access to a flat 100 yard spot to do this. Thinking of going out to the far end of the range late this fall when it's mowed down and no one's around to hit me, and putting out some markers and working on it that way. I know it would be good to do, just have to do it. Distance control is key, and I know my chances of achieving it are better with my wedges than any other clubs.

[denver_nuggs_15]

I feel the same way as the OP. I find Pelz's method of 1/4 and 1/2 swings to be a bit mechanical. I'd much rather just base my short game and very short approaches on feel. I remember once I had 72 to the stick for my 3rd shot on a par 5. I just took a couple practice swings with my 55* (full swing carries 95-97) until I felt comfortable that the swing would be the right distance. I hit it and ended up 3 feet and knocked in the bird. It's just more natural for me to "feel" the shots.

[brgolf]

Establishing the exact distance for all of my clubs and then for 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 wedges is one of the ways I am trying to improve at present.

There is no point in hitting on line shots only for them to go beyond the green or come up short.

If you are an average player you don't want to be punished on a good shot for lack of precision regarding distance.

[coach_rambo]

I think that all "feel" pitchers unconciously control their backswing dialing it down for shorter pitches and amping it up a little for longer pitches. We just dont say "okay I have a 50 yard pitch so I need to make this a half swing". I know I play by feel and my short game is by far the best part of my game. I guess you can do putting the same way thinking "this is a 50 foot putt so I have to take the putter back X far".

Although the Peltz method is a litte intriguig to guys that wanna really dial it in when you are having that off day and things just dont feel right.

[Phil McGleno]

I'd much rather just base my short game and very short approaches on feel.

You're probably costing yourself strokes. Just because you know you have 55 yards and your 1/2 sand wedge goes 60 doesn't mean it's completely mechanical. It's still 99% feel. Someone up above said it so I'm not gonna repeat it all: firmness, bounce, spin, wind, etc.

Besides, haven't you ever heard the phrase "don't knock it until you've tried it"?

I remember once I had 72 to the stick for my 3rd shot on a par 5. I just took a couple practice swings with my 55* (full swing carries 95-97) until I felt comfortable that the swing would be the right distance. I hit it and ended up 3 feet and knocked in the bird. It's just more natural for me to "feel" the shots.

I know my yardages and hit a good shot nearly every time. You hit one once. I'll take my way, thank you very much.

[brgolf]

I have to agree with Butch here. I simply fail to see how knowing exact distances and playing 1/4 or 1/2 swings is in any way more mechanical, than any other type of golf shot. It may feel alien at the start but then again you are adding a new shot to your armory. This is no different to when you first tried to learn to hit a 7i full swing. You get used to it.

So when you go to the practice range and you place your ball 60 yards from the green and 70 from the flag you should be able to take the exact club and after hitting a number of balls get a distribution of shots which average out pin high.

[sean_miller]

I guess I'll vote "no". If someone was to stand back (way back) and watch me hit chips, pitches, lobs, knockdowns, full and "3/4" wedges (PW, Gap wedge, sand wedges 52/56/60), or anything up to long chips with a 4-iron, they may get the impression that I start with my full shot, then work on fractions thereoffor all shots <100 yards. If I had to describe to a newcomer what type of swingthought was going on, I may even resort to describing 1/2, 3/4, and full, but that just isn't how my mind works - when I'm on the course facing the actual shot or when I'm practicing.

I don't conciously think about fractions or percentages. I visualize the spot I want to the ball to land, the amount of roll I want/need and the trajectory I'd like the ball to have on the way there. Then I take the lie and wind into consideration and decide which club gives me the best chance to create that particular shot. SometimesI take the safe route and other times (when my ball striking is quite solid) I focus on spot and try to dial in the exact stroke required. Of course this takes craploads of practice and experience.

[jfrain2004]

knowing how far you hit a 1/2 ,3/4 pw lw gw is very important and this feel that a lot of people talk can and will abandon you 55 yrds from the pin on the 18th when you need to be up close for a 1 putt to win the captains prize I know cause it happened me last year. I used to be a pure feel but had no game when the pressure was on. So now I know with no wind my 3/4 lob wedge goes 45 yrds give or take 1 yrd and yes, I have it down to that kind of accuracy because when I practice that is the one shot I practice most of the time. So if i'm 55 from the pin I know that shot will leave me no more than 10 from the pin, gw, pw will give me an extra 5 or 6 yards each. What is the point in practicing all sorts of distances when if I ask you here and now what club & shot will send the ball 65 yards? I know for me that a 3/4 pw goes 60 so even that will leave me only 5 yrds from the hole, or I could say to myself slightly past 3/4 will give me the extra 5 yrds I need.

[Leftygolfer]

When I was playing alot more a couple of years ago I worked on this method and was pretty darn good with my wedges for my skill level. The issue for me is time and money. You just can't good at wedge shots on the driving range. You have to go out and work on this on the course. It is really hard to tell exactly how far you flew it on most ranges. On the course, I will get the actual yardage and hit a few from that distance focussing on the length of my swing and feeling the distance.

I need to get back to this method. I don't think I am as good as wedge player since I have gotten away from it and play more wedge shots with a full swing.

If you got time there is no better way to play from 100 yards and in.

[jfrain2004]

I agree Lefty,
When I want to callibrate my distances I don't go out 50 yrds from the pin and see what club/shot I need from that distance, instead from out the fairway I take 3/4 LW for example and move closer/further from the pin until I'm dropping them consistently within a few feet of it. Then and only then do I actually measure off the distance which might turn out to be 48 or 58 yrds. If you go out 50 yrds from the pin you end up with a forced shot to get it close to the pin and mis read your true 3/4 wedge distance. The key is to know EXACTLY what distance a natural unforced 3/4 wedge shot goes for you and practice that shot. Better still, hit a bucket of balls with a 3/4 swing and don't even look to see where any of them landed until you have the last one hit. That then is your true 3/4 shot distance for that club

[Zeph]

Don't have a range finder or GPS, so I don't know the distances within 100 meters. I can of course pace it up, but inside 90 meters I go by feel. I can see that knowing your distances somewhat with different backswing length is useful. When I get good contact I'm usually good at these kind of shots, so I haven't felt the need to try this. If I ever get a range finder I might give it a go.

[CalBoomer]

In the Pelz method, one leaves the hands and any extra "muscle" out of the swing. He calls it a "dead hands" swing. It takes a lot of practice to get it down consistently. Then distance comes from the choice of wedge and length of backswing. Like one poster above, I have several swings for each wedge and know how far the ball goes. For in-between distances, I will sometimes grip down on a particular wedge to shorten the distance. Or I will slightly lengthen the backswing to increase distance. Any distance is a combination of wedge choice, backswing length, and force of swing. No matter what "feel" players think (or don't think!) they are doing, they are in reality using some combination of these factors. I personally prefer to think about what I am actually doing.

[sean_miller]

In the Pelz method, one leaves the hands and any extra "muscle" out of the swing. He calls it a "dead hands" swing. It takes a lot of practice to get it down consistently. Then distance comes from the choice of wedge and length of backswing. Like one poster above, I have several swings for each wedge and know how far the ball goes. For in-between distances, I will sometimes grip down on a particular wedge to shorten the distance. Or I will slightly lengthen the backswing to increase distance. Any distance is a combination of wedge choice, backswing length, and force of swing. No matter what

Duh. Of course we are - and we also include other irons in the equation. The difference is in the mental approach - we may not use actual numbers in the equation and we don't dwell on yardages while setting up over the ball. Does a centre fielder think about how many feet away the cutoff man is, or does he look at him and fire the ball?