Differences Between Driver Swing and Iron Swing (Driver Swing vs. Iron Swing Master Thread)

[jambalaya]

Hard to believe some of these comments. The best way to assess your swing plane is with a mirror. Because of the length of the driver shaft, you are further from the ball at address and the angle of the club is less upright than the angle that would be made by a short iron. To stay on the plane requires a flatter swing--which is not guaranteed by your set-up. Use the mirror to get a sense of how to take the club back to keep that same flatter angle.

This entire quote is right on. I bolded the one bit because it is really important with the woods especially the driver. A steep swing plane with a driver causes all kinds of problems from slicing to skying. Keep the same basic body geometry but stand more upright with the driver which flattens out the plane.

[jambalaya]

Attachment 1554

I Hope you can see this image. It pretty much explains what I was trying to say.

[mm6840]

Hi, I'm afraid I can't agree with that "

Upsss ...

For example Tiger woods : 2 plane for driver and 1 plane for irons .

[jambalaya]

Hi, I'm afraid I can't agree with that "

Well I would have to disagree with both of you. I don't know what you mean by the wrist cock but essentially when you take your backswing the wrist of the bottom hand (right for righties) should be cupped at the top while the left wrist of the left hand should be near flat. Holding the bend in the right wrist as one comes down in the downswing as long as possible creates lag. Most people don't like to call that a cock. They like to call the up and down motion of the wrist as a cock. Well the two wrists work together and the resulting position at the top should be what I describe. But, this is not the No. 1 generator of power in the swing. What it does is add that extra 10 to 25 yards to your distance that can set you apart from your playing partners. You can have little or no wrist cock or wrist action and still hit the ball over 200 yards proving that the "wrist cock" is by no means the No. 1 generator of power. That would be body core and arm levers. All of it adds up to give you distance.

[lynchjo]

Well I would have to disagree with both of you. I don't know what you mean by the wrist cock but essentially when you take your backswing the wrist of the bottom hand (right for righties) should be cupped at the top while the left wrist of the left hand should be near flat. Holding the bend in the right wrist as one comes down in the downswing as long as possible creates lag. Most people don't like to call that a cock. They like to call the up and down motion of the wrist as a cock. Well the two wrists work together and the resulting position at the top should be what I describe.

Theodore P. Jorgensen in his book "The Physics Of Golf" describes how power is generated in the golf swing as follows:

"The large muscles of the legs, thighs, and back supply energy to the left arm at least at the start of the downswing. The shoulder muscles start their action gradually at the same time and continue to supply energy to the left arm throughout the rest of the downswing. Later, the large muscles slow up the motion of the body, thereby giving an additional amount of energy to the system. The dynamics of the swing will transfer energy from the left arm into the club". Tommy Armour always said "You must not rush the start of the downswing for these forces to be applied" .

[jambalaya]

Theodore P. Jorgensen in his book "The Physics Of Golf" describes how power is generated in the golf swing as follows:

I would say Amen to the bolded part. It is one of my biggest faults.

[utube]

The driver swing is flatter, but this is only due to the length of the club. Short irons will swing on a steeper plane, woods and driver will be on a shallower plane. This does NOT mean that you swing differently. It's the same basic swing.

Thanks for image

[ebough]

Thanks for image

This may be semantics, but the swing plane is a key element of the swing. If you change the swing plane, you change the swing. Even if all the other elements remain the same, the swing is different. And, incidentally, both golfers in the diagrams are changing swing planes.

[SpringBokVol]

I wanted to get some thoughts around this as lately I have been really trying to solidify my iron swing.

I feel my contact is crisp and the launch angle is exactly where I need it to be.

The problem I am having is transitioning from iron to driver. I know there are parts of these swings that need to be different - sweeping vs. steep attack, etc.

But I wanted to hear from others on what the biggest difference is between these two swings for them. Do you have any tips or thoughts on how to be the most efficient with both?

[Zeph]

A mid iron should have an descending angle of attack some 3 degrees more than the driver, that's all really. Can be achieved by having slightly more forward push in the downswing and perhaps a bit more shallow backswing, but not the bottom of the arc a foot behind the ball. I want to hit the ball on the way down, -1 degree attack angle.

[delav]

A mid iron should have an descending angle of attack some 3 degrees more than the driver, that's all really. Can be achieved by having slightly more forward push in the downswing and perhaps a bit more shallow backswing, but not the bottom of the arc a foot behind the ball. I want to hit the ball on the way down, -1 degree attack angle.

How do you personally validate your angle of attack?

[Zeph]

I can't, but at the moment I'm hitting the drives sky high, so it is definitely on the upslope. With the irons, you can tell by the depth of the divot, which we obviously don't have with the driver. I usually look at the launch angle. The higher my launch angle is, the less forward leaning shaft I had at impact. Forward leaning shaft at impact means the ball was struck on the way down. I do use video camera to record my swing, which can reveal to some degree how I do.

I don't have the equipment to find my angle of attack, but knowing what angle I want is useful. Of course, anywhere from -2 to +2 degrees is fine, but I would rather be on the descending side, since I've always had problems with a high ball flight and swing bottom too far back.

[delav]

I can't, but at the moment I'm hitting the drives sky high, so it is definitely on the upslope. With the irons, you can tell by the depth of the divot, which we obviously don't have with the driver. I usually look at the launch angle. The higher my launch angle is, the less forward leaning shaft I had at impact. Forward leaning shaft at impact means the ball was struck on the way down. I do use video camera to record my swing, which can reveal to some degree how I do.

Right. But to be fair, you have no idea which interval (+/- 1, +/- 2, +/- more) you are actually in. To me the use of discrete values for impact angle seem like a mute point if the average player has no baseline or way to validate +/- anything. It's all theoretical unless we've got an easy way to map and validate the angle at which we impact the ball.

Similar to what Zeph was saying, each player needs a way to translate the different impact positions into swing thoughts. I know that I want to find roughly the same position at the top with my irons and my driver, although I'll think about getting there a bit differently. With the driver and 3W, I'll think about extending away from the ball slightly more than with my irons, slightly widening out my arc from the ball. Visualizing a "sweep" motion through the ball is helpful for me. Also, be mindful of your spine angle at setup, and how this may change depending on the club you are swinging and the shot you'd like to hit.

[SpringBokVol]

I went to the range today to toy with this and tried to make the exact same swing with both clubs...

Irons I was hitting very crisp and pure.

Driver was all over the place... low duck hook, push right, sky high 150 yards, low penetrating and straight.

My big issue is I can hit my driver 240 with a slight fade almost every time if I revert back to an old swing... but it is completely different to my iron swing - even the grip is different.

[CalBoomer]

I don't see how you can maintain your handicap if your driver is as bad as you say it is.

[wildcorndog]

i can either hit one or the other if i get my irons " witch is very rare" i lose my driver... its apparently something very different between the two swings..... cant ever get a clear answer as to what it is.

[shortstop20]

There's nothing different except for the setup, which changes the angle that you come into the ball.

I can't, but at the moment I'm hitting the drives sky high, so it is definitely on the upslope.

It doesn't mean that in the least bit.

It is possible to come into the ball steep with the driver and catch it very high on the face, making the ball go very high. Without any sky marks I might add.

[Zeph]

I've seen it on video, and I tee the ball very low, so I know that is the case. I know my swing bottom is too far back and that I don't hit that high on the face. Was at least 2 months ago, which was the last time I hit a driver. Working on weight forward lately has probably made it better, time will show.