Jump to content
IGNORED

My first weird shopping experience and some questions


Note: This thread is 5079 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 86
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Consider 3 irons from Titleist or Mizuno.

You sure do see a lot of DCI's out there. When I was struggling with my Macgregor MB's last year, I wished I still had my DCI's.

Just because an iron is more sought after than another, it doesn't mean the other is obsolete. For Callaway and Ping the new offerings have more garish decals, badging, and color scheme's than the old ones. Does that make the X-24's obsolete compared to the x-20? Just because a clubs "life cycle" ends, doesn't make it obsolete. Most people on these types of boards love to have the latest and greatest in thier bags because they are enthusiasts. They 1996 DCI's will work just as good as their 2010 ap1's.
Link to comment
Share on other sites


thanks a lot, thwak/ very useful link.

I'm no guru, but my understanding is it's subjective, as the manufacturers define the club for their target market, while the MPR is an independant study. Certainly Titleist would never define their club as "super game improvement" !!!

There are basically 2 types of irons - game improvement (normally cavity backs and larger clubs) and player clubs (smaller cavity and blades). Considering you are starting you should be looking in the game improvement category, otherwise you will have difficulty improving at the beginning and lose interest. Golf is hard...at first!

A) You need to hit alot of different clubs.
B) Whatever works for you.
C) It's the indian, not the arrow.
D) A 5 wood, 19* hybrid or a lob wedge.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


OP, take this with a grain of salt, because I am not a scratch golfer nor do I know very much about the clubs you are looking at.

This situation reminds me of someone who is new to driving or motorcycling. You would not want to just right on a 1000cc sport bike or hop behind the wheel of a Corvette. These machine will do everything you ask them to if you know HOW to ask them. They will also bite you quick if you are not speaking the same language and tell them to do something stupid.

I would look into something like a game improvement iron set pre owned and put in some serious play/practice time. Once you are comfortable with your ball striking, then look to get something with a more traditional look and sell your game improvement irons to someone else looking to take up the game!

Good luck either way!

ETA: I went with my Zings because of what I had read about them online. I was able to get a used set and have been enjoying them very much!

Driver G2
Hybrid 22 degree
Irons Zing
Wedge 60.07 RAC Chrome
Putter Karsten Zing

Link to comment
Share on other sites


You sure do see a lot of DCI's out there. When I was struggling with my Macgregor MB's last year, I wished I still had my DCI's.

Obsolete in the sense that the purchaser will feel goaded into buying a newer version of the same sh** w/ new decals.

The Titleist DCI is one of the best iron designs in the history of the game - wish I had a set. I picked up a set of Lynx Parallax irons for my brother for $2.99 at Value Village (the set was missing the 3 and 5 iron - he didn't care about the missing irons or the fact they might be obsolete). I hit them at the range and they totally blew me away - if they didn't throw the ball so high, I'd have kept them for myself. My point is that the OP was already not crazy about looks of the current Titleist AP1 and hinted the same for some of the Mizuno offerings. Would he in time grow to love one of their SGI iron sets? Possibly, but since the OP is including aesthetics in his decision, then less is quite often more.

Mizuno MP600 driver, Cleveland '09 Launcher 3-wood, Callaway FTiz 18 degree hybrid, Cleveland TA1 3-9, Scratch SS8620 47, 53, 58, Cleveland Classic 2 mid-mallet, Bridgestone B330S, Sun Mountain four5.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


If you haven't looked at the Titleist and Mizuno websites have a look at who they market their irons to. You know your level, see what clubs they recommend.

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/irons/ (click the HCP tab)

http://www.titleist.com/golfclubs/irons/default.asp

A) You need to hit alot of different clubs.
B) Whatever works for you.
C) It's the indian, not the arrow.
D) A 5 wood, 19* hybrid or a lob wedge.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


They 1996 DCI's will work just as good as their 2010 ap1's.

Really? Is that why the majority of pros switch to the latest company offering? It's not because of their contracts but because they see performance gains in using the newer model. How many Titleist staff members still play the ZM or ZB? I can guarantee that the majority switched to the 710 CB or MB. Of all the Titleist staffers, one of the few I can think of who still plays old irons is Steve Stricker. Most of the others have upgraded to the latest Titleist offerings.

A reason why you see a lot of old irons is that some golfers don't see enough of a performance gain to shell out 800$ or because they have convinced themselves that the latest clubs have the same technology. The truth is that the majority of golfers does not have enough disposable income to upgrade to the latest equipment. Does this mean that I will upgrade to the next AP2s when they come out just because I have the money to purchase the newer clubs? Until I feel that I can't do what I want with these they'll stay in the bag. Now going back to the OP's post, as many have suggested the least forgiving end of the spectrum of MP clubs would be a lot of club for a beginner. Trying the MX 300 or MP 52s would be good if you're looking for a forgiving "players" iron, however I wouldn't give up on the Titleists.
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Last bit of advice - the best place to start when looking for new clubs is the latest (and previous years for that matter) Golf Digest HOT LIST.

Super Game Improvement
http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-equip...list_sgi_irons

Game Improvement
http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-equip...?currentPage=1

Players
http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-equip..._players_irons

A) You need to hit alot of different clubs.
B) Whatever works for you.
C) It's the indian, not the arrow.
D) A 5 wood, 19* hybrid or a lob wedge.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Really? Is that why the majority of pros switch to the latest company offering? It's not because of their contracts but because they see performance gains in using the newer model. How many Titleist staff members still play the ZM or ZB? I can guarantee that the majority switched to the 710 CB or MB. Of all the Titleist staffers, one of the few I can think of who still plays old irons is Steve Stricker. Most of the others have upgraded to the latest Titleist offerings.

For the general public, 99% of golfers, whether hitting DCI's or AP2's won't make a difference. For pro's there may be technological advancements that can enable them to control and shape their shots but for the most part, give me my old set of TZoid Pro II's in my hands and I'll play just as well.

and just to clarify, it IS heavily due to their endorsement contract. Brands want to sell their latest and greatest. What better way to market it then to get them in the hands of a pro? With that said, the clubs pro use aren't the same as the ones they sell. They are heavily customized to fit the exact needs of the player. How much technological advancements do you think there can be with blades...? Classic blades (which is what most pro's play) haven't drastically changed in decades.

DST Tour 9.5 Diamana Whiteboard
909F3 15* 3 FW stock Aldila Voodoo
909F3 18* 5 FW stock Aldila Voodoo
'09 X-Forged 3-PW Project-X 6.0 Flighted
CG15 56* X-Tour 60* Abaco

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Given the language barriers and his new intro the golf I think the "debate" going on in this thread may be diluting any information the OP needs.

benchan1, you should try to find a set of Game Improvement irons that suit your eye, you will learn the game much faster.
In my bag

Superstrong 12*
- Firepower Hyper Ti 15*
- Launcher 18* Hybrid - 21* Hybrid - S2 Max 5i - SW - MP T-Series 47* - 60* LW - White Hot XG #1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Understandable. I'm personally not a fan of the AP1/AP2 look either but they are some of the best irons on the market right now.

+1 on the AP1

Listen, there are many, many options out there for you. I would recommend not to settle on one or two brands without really understanding the options you have. AP1 you didn't like, fine, look at big berthas, taylormade has great deals on last year's sets... Stay away from "Players" clubs, as they will only frustrate you alot, but if you think that you will be disciplined enough to practice alot to improve you mechanics rapidly, then they may not be too bad. If you wan to listen to someone...spend a little money in getting fitted by a teaching pro and not the dumbass sales folks, findout what you need and what will give your best results and start from there. There are many types (grades) of clubs: classic >> conventional >> game improvement >> super game improvement these farther right in that sequence, the easier they are to hit for a beginner. When I started playing I got a set of used Titleist AP1 with graphite shafts (reg) for $200. I got them from a relative that had used them from 6 months..they were (and are) in great shape. When was shopping around for the other clubs (driver, 3w, 3h, wedges,putter) the salesman at the Golf Galaxy told me that those clubs were too much for me...that it would take me a few years to really be able to play them. I tried to convince me to trade them in for something more suited for me. I refused to think he was right, and kept them....My first few round scores were 146, 123, 113. 106, 101, 105 which proves that I could handle the clubs just fine. So my advice...shop around try a few clubs and buy what you like and feel most comfortable with, independent of what the salesman is pushing on you...
It's the indian, not the arrow! But it sure is nice to have good arrows!!!!!

Driver : r7 Limited 9.5* Matrix Ozik X-Con 5.5 (Reg) | Fairway: 906F4 15.5* (Reg) | Hybrids: DWS Baffler 3/R 20* (Reg) & Baffler Rail H 4-H 22* (Reg) | Irons: AP1 5-G (Reg) | Wedges: SW - SM56-10 & LW - SM60-04 | Putter:.....
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Dear all,

Yes, you overestimate yourself. One of the biggest mistakes beginners make is to overestimate their skills. Golf looks easy, but it's not. You can hit a club great in a shop's simulator and think it's the one for you, but the real test comes on the back 9, when you're hot, tired, and frustrated. See how much you like the super hard to hit clubs then.

One of the biggest reasons people give up golf is that it's too hard, and here you are wanting to buy irons that force you to hit them right on the center. I, like many people here, learned to play the game on blades, and it was a painful experience. I spent years off during my childhood and early 20s. When I was 24, I finally tried cavity back clubs, and I've been playing nearly daily since then. On the back 9, when you're running low on energy, when you're frustrated, they give you some room for error. I even bagged a hybrid 3 iron for a while. Forgiveness is a great thing to have. Always remember that clubs, like women, look great under the hot lights of the store, and when you're not thinking clearly. The next morning, when you wake up and face reality, it's not so easy to swallow that you've now got a club that you just cannot hit with any consistency.
(3) I know the MP58 is the newer version of MP52, likewise for MP68. If I really like the MP series, which among the 4 models I should target for? What are the difference? I tried looking up the info from mizuno website but seems they are really similar, can you share the key difference? Appreciate you help.

MP = Mizuno Professional. They are not for you. Wait till you've played for at least a few months at least, or maybe have something around a 20 handicap. For now, check out offerings by Callaway, Ping, TaylorMade, Adams, and other manufacturers. Find a club that's forgiving, but that you like the look of.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


He would be right in warning you, but he was dead wrong on not even giving you a price. Buy what you feel comfortable with.

"I play in the low 80's. If it is an hotter than that, I don't play"

Joe E. Lewis

Link to comment
Share on other sites


My 2 cents worth:

The salesman crossed the line from being helpful to being a jerk. It is his job to advise you, not to dictate to you. Bottom line: it's your life, your money, and you're the one that has to live the the consequences. The final decision (right or wrong) is yours, not his.

What club to buy? When I first started (which wasn't that long ago) I went to Goodwill and mixed-and-matched a set from what they had. It was a full set of irons, wedges, and a putter, but they weren't all the same (different brands, but mostly Wilsons, and different types--from forged muscle-backs to cavity backs; even got a 1 & 2 iron). $1.25 per club. Also bought a bagthere ($8). That's really enough to get you started playing. You'll get a feel for what type of club you like and don't like to play. The in a few months (with a little experience under your belt) you can pop for a more expensive & make an intelligent decision.

Remember, golf clubs (like air conditioners) go on sale in the fall. You'll get a better deal if you can wait till the fall to purchase.

Instight XTD A30S Driver 10.5° ($69 new ebay)
Instight XTD A3OS Fairway Wood 15° ($45 new ebay)
Fybrid 19.5° ($35 new ebay)
Ci7 4-GW ($175 new Rock Bottom Golf via ebay)
53° & 58° 8620 DD wedges ($75 each new PGA Superstore) C2-DF ($35 new Rock Bottom Golf) Riley TT stand bag ($7 n...

Link to comment
Share on other sites


My 2 cents worth:

The salesman crossed the line from being helpful to being a jerk. It is his job to advise you, not to dictate to you. Bottom line: it's your life, your money, and you're the one that has to live the the consequences. The final decision (right or wrong) is yours, not his.

What club to buy? When I first started (which wasn't that long ago) I went to Goodwill and mixed-and-matched a set from what they had. It was a full set of irons, wedges, and a putter, but they weren't all the same (different brands, but mostly Wilsons, and different types--from forged muscle-backs to cavity backs; even got a 1 & 2 iron). $1.25 per club. Also bought a bagthere ($8). That's really enough to get you started playing. You'll get a feel for what type of club you like and don't like to play. The in a few months (with a little experience under your belt) you can pop for a more expensive & make an intelligent decision.

Remember, golf clubs (like air conditioners) go on sale in the fall. You'll get a better deal if you can wait till the fall to purchase.

Instight XTD A30S Driver 10.5° ($69 new ebay)
Instight XTD A3OS Fairway Wood 15° ($45 new ebay)
Fybrid 19.5° ($35 new ebay)
Ci7 4-GW ($175 new Rock Bottom Golf via ebay)
53° & 58° 8620 DD wedges ($75 each new PGA Superstore) C2-DF ($35 new Rock Bottom Golf) Riley TT stand bag ($7 n...

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I'm no guru, but my understanding is it's subjective, as the manufacturers define the club for their target market, while the MPR is an independant study. Certainly Titleist would never define their club as "super game improvement" !!!

got it, thanks thwak

finding my lifelong sportssss

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I'm no guru, but my understanding is it's subjective, as the manufacturers define the club for their target market, while the MPR is an independant study. Certainly Titleist would never define their club as "super game improvement" !!!

MPF is completely objective, so it's a better number. It's also highly accurate. Maltby's numbers seem to almost always reflect reality in my experience, as they're based solely on science, not marketing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Given the language barriers and his new intro the golf I think the "debate" going on in this thread may be diluting any information the OP needs.

Yes, that is what i am doing now.

No, the debate is very constructive one. I can understand most of the argument. Now I am thinking whether I should but the newer models (MX1000 or MP52) of the older ones (T Zoid?) as it will make no difference to me. A second thought is i am going to play golf for a long time, buying a newer model (used clubs) with more technology advance and better condition will serve me a longer period

finding my lifelong sportssss

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Note: This thread is 5079 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • TST Partners

    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    ShotScope
    The Stack System
    FlightScope Mevo
    Direct: Mevo, Mevo+, and Pro Package.

    Coupon Codes (save 10-15%): "IACAS" for Mevo/Stack, "IACASPLUS" for Mevo+/Pro Package, and "THESANDTRAP" for ShotScope.
  • Posts

    • Did LIV pros cross ‘etiquette’ line at Masters? 3-time major winner has thought Did LIV Golf pros cross an “etiquette” line last month at the Masters? Three-time major winner Padraig Harrington has a thought. I do not mind cursing. I rather see some emotion on the course and honest reactions to bad shots or what not. I didn't catch it being a TON of cursing in this Masters. It was not noticeable. 
    • I had to think about this topic for a while. I don't tend to remember specific details about my putts, but a few do stand out in my mind so I guess they're worth noting. I don't know that I'd call them my favorite but it's close enough. #18 at Spooky Brook Might be the hardest 4' putt I've ever had. Pin was back right and I hit my third shot just to the right of it. The green slopes fairly severely back to front. I read the green but I knew the putt anyway as I've seen it before. I told the guys I was playing with that the putt was it was going to break almost 3' and if it doesn't go in I'd have a longer coming back up for par than I was looking at. It went in. #12 at Quail Brook I'm not even sure how to describe this green properly. It's not quite a two-tiered green, but the back and front are separated by a ridge that goes across the middle of it, with the green sloping harder off the front than the back. You can generally putt from the front to a back hole location but good luck keeping the ball on the green if you putt from back to front. On this particular day, I was looking at the latter. I had to putt up into the apron due to how the ball was going to break and that helped slow the ball down enough to hit the hole at the perfect speed. One of the rare birdies I've seen on that hole. #2 at Hyatt Hills Short par 5. This makes the list because it's the first eagle putt I've ever made, which funny enough happened the day after the first eagle I've ever made. I've made two eagles in all my life and they came on back to back days. I wasn't even planning on playing golf - it was a Monday - but I was doing some work at the place I used to work at when I was younger and catching up with some of the guys I've known for years. They were going out to play in the afternoon and had a spot available. I used to see these guys every day for years but we've never played together, so I said I'm in. I hit a really good approach shot into slope that separated the two tiers on the green and spun the ball closer to the hole. Had roughly 8' left to the hole, a downhill right to left breaker. One of the guys said, "You've got to make this, I've never seen an eagle before," and I said, "I've never made an eagle putt before." And then I made it. #17 at Stoneleigh @GolfLug's post reminded me of my own heroics on #17 a couple of years ago. The hole was back left, in the bottom tier. I hit my approach short of the green and flubbed my chip so it stayed on the top tier. I read how the putt was going to break after the ramp (is that what you call it?), then read my putt up to that point. It needed to basically die at that point because if it hit the slope with any kind of speed, it would long past the hole and possibly off the green. I hit the putt perfectly and holed the 40-footer center cup. #6 at Meadow at Neshanic Valley, #15 in the Round This was during the stroke play qualifier of my tournament. It might be a little bit of recency bias and I hit some really good long putts in the four rounds I played, but this 7-footer was my favorite putt of the entire tournament. The hole was cut on the top of a ridge. I hit my tee shot short right but hit a pretty good chip just long and below the hole. Play had backed up at this point, with the ladies waiting on the tee while we were finishing up. I hit the putt just a hair on the high side and it curled around the hole, fell back a couple of inches and stopped on lip. We all looked at it incredulously, "How does that not fall in?" Before I took my first step towards the hole, the ball must have thought the same thing and decided to drop.
    • I don't remember a ton of putts, but I've thought about this a bit and came up with 2 good ones. #5 at Mid-South: 2017 Newport Cup I remember the putt pretty well, but the surrounding details are a little hazy. I believe this was in my singles match against @cipher, and it was a hole he was stroking on. I had hit a mediocre approach to the front of the green and had what must have been a 50 foot putt to a back pin. If I remember correctly, @cipher was pretty close for an easy par at worst. I had @mvmac help me out with a read, which ended up being a great read by him. Hit the putt and jarred it for birdie. It was perfect speed, too, would have been an easy 2 putt if it hadn't gone in. I think we ended up tying for the hole. But I rarely make putts that long, and doing it to steal half a hole was really nice. #3 Fox Hollow (Links): 2023 Match Play This was on the third extra hole of a scratch match against a legitimate 0 handicapper. We had tied after 18 holes and traded pars on the first two extra holes. On the third extra hole, he had about 30 feet for birdie; I had about 25. We were on pretty much the exact same line. He missed his putt just on the low side, and I conceded the par. I felt good over this putt - I knew the break well and just needed good speed. I hit a great (not perfect) putt, and BAM, back of the cup for the victory on the 21st hole. I will say that the speed wasn't great, as it would have been a few feet past if it didn't hit the cup. But I wanted to give the ball a chance and take a bit of break out of it. I went on to win the match play tournament, which is my only tournament victory in a scratch event.
    • there will be lots of changes.  i mean, look at newey past, each team fell off a cliff when he moved on i think max is the magic bullet   if red bull loses him then whee are they going for drivers?   lots of young talent but he is a proven winner and i’m sure top engineers love to work with him  
    • I too, like @GolfLug, remember great wedge, iron shots, or my missed putts, more than my made putts. My most memorable recently, would be: #17 Old Course St. Andrews (last year) I had been putting awful all day (I started 3 putt, 4 putt, 3 putt, 3 putt), but found a putting stroke on the back 9 and was 1 under on the back going into 16 and of course I 3-putted it for a bogey. Got to 17 and my playing partner just hit it into the hotel, so I went a little more left and decided to not try and hit it over the hotel.  And as soon as my ball was in the air, I heard one of the other caddies do the chicken noise.  LOL My shot was a little more left than I wanted, about 185 yards, I hit a 6-iron and it was drawing right at the flag.  The pin was just to the right of he bunker and towards the front of the green. My ball hit short (and just missed going into said bunker) and stopped about 15 feet left of the hole. Had a little left to right break and as soon as I hit it, I knew it was in.  Birdie on the road hole, looked at the caddie and said not bad for a Chicken.  Parred 18 (missed 10 foot birdie putt) for a 35 on the back 9 at the Old Course. #18 Springfield G&CC Last year while playing in our season long match play event, my partner and I get the 18th hole needing to win the match to move on into the knockout round.  We are tied going into 18.  A tie and we lose on overall points by .5.  Our teaching pro is on the other team (very good golfer), so we were pretty sure we needed a birdie to have a chance to win the match, I hit on of the best drives I hit all day and had about 135 yards to the pin, but it was in a place where you didn't really want to be long.  So I hit a PW and it landed just short of the flag but released about 12 feet past the hole, so have a devilish putt coming back down the hill.  Our competitors were away and the pro missed his birdie putt by inches, I thought it was in when he hit it.  So after reading the putt, which probably had a 2 cup left to right break, I made the putt to win the match.   #15 Springfield G&CC A few years back, was playing in the first round of the Club Championship (against the previous years runner-up) and my putter was balky all day.  Got to the 15 hole, 2nd Par 5 on back, and was 3-down with 4 to play.  We both hit good drives, both hit good second shots and we both hit decent 3rd shots.  I was about 15 feet and he was just a hair longer.  He missed his putt, I had another slider putt down the hill, with about a foot of right to left break and made the putt.  I birded the next hole, to go 1 down, but not a memorable putt as I only needed a bogey to beat him on that hole, he had all kinds of issues going on.  Lost on 17, as he birdied it, right after I missed mine to lose 2&1.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...