Par for the course inflates newer golfers scores.

[trackster]

  sacm3bill said:

Originally Posted by sacm3bill

Course management has been redefined to "whatever Trackster says it is". Didn't you get the memo?

You have some issues man.  Some real issues.

  FowlPlay said:

Originally Posted by FowlPlay

I will be doing this from now on. Considering I'm a terrible golfer right now, and my most embarrassing shots are with the driver, I really think this will help me. Although it is apparently an old strategy, thanks for the tip.

I think it will too.  Anyone can tell you not to hit driver off the tee.  But if you really know you own game and you pick out three clubs that have a high chance of getting you on the green in 3, your scores will drop.  Say you have a 385 par 4.  Play a 170 yard shot off the tee a 150 yard shot and then you are left with a nice little 60-70 yard shot to the green.  The thing with irons are there slices are less severe then the driver.  So unless you have an absolute shank you should be alright.  The thing new golfers do is hit driver off the tee.  Then hit 3 wood after 3 wood until they are close enough for a short shot.  Those 3 wood shots can add up when hitting it fat.  Say you have a 180 yard par 3.  For most new golfers this could mean 3 wood off the tee.  If you aren't confident in this shot.  Play a shot 130-140 yards up the fairway (assuming there is a fairway) and now you have a short chip.  The thing that I think is most forgotten is even if you are on in 3 you still can putt for par.

[Paradox]

Dude, its this simple.  Say that "new golfer" hits a bad driver somewhere...theres no difference in your "idea" and him deciding to play smart(use course management) to get himself back in play and then go for the green and try to salvage a bogey.

Nevermind that by your very own line of thinking, you'll be inflating scores.  Courses have a par because that is what you shoot for.  You're still going to walk off the course knowing that you didn't par any holes.

[sacm3bill]

  trackster said:

Originally Posted by trackster

You have some issues man.  Some real issues.

Heh, guilty as charged... But at least one of them is not "Completely ignores what dozens of other people are telling him 'course management' is".

[trackster]

  Paradox said:

Originally Posted by Paradox

Dude, its this simple.  Say that "new golfer" hits a bad driver somewhere...theres no difference in your "idea" and him deciding to play smart(use course management) to get himself back in play and then go for the green and try to salvage a bogey.

Nevermind that by your very own line of thinking, you'll be inflating scores.  Courses have a par because that is what you shoot for.  You're still going to walk off the course knowing that you didn't par any holes.

So you think its better for a new golfer to shot par on 4 holes and 8-10s on the other 14.  Then to say shoot 5 or 6 every hole.

And with your idea that chip back to the fairway is a "wasted shot".  With the strategy i presented its kind of a slow and steady wins the race approach.  Keep cutting into the distance little by little.  Say you drive one 250 under a tree have to chip out and are now left with a 150 plus shot to try to get one on the green.  With the other strategy play a 170 yard shot and then play a 150 yard shot and now you have a much shorter shot to the  green.

[LankyLefty]

I personally play aggressive and It makes for wild scores, indeed. Back when I was playing on a regular basis 3-5 times per week, my scores ranged from 112 to 79.

I could be more consistent by playing for the middle road, but I think my average score might remain the same.

[Paradox]

  trackster said:

Originally Posted by trackster

So you think its better for a new golfer to shot par on 4 holes and 8-10s on the other 14.  Then to say shoot 5 or 6 every hole.

And with your idea that chip back to the fairway is a "wasted shot".  With the strategy i presented its kind of a slow and steady wins the race approach.  Keep cutting into the distance little by little.  Say you drive one 250 under a tree have to chip out and are now left with a 150 plus shot to try to get one on the green.  With the other strategy play a 170 yard shot and then play a 150 yard shot and now you have a much shorter shot to the  green.

I don't know any new golfer who can shoot 5 or 6 on every hole regardless of how they play it.  they top shots, hit fat shots, blade chips, smash putts well past the hole, so on and so forth.

I never said a "chip back to the fairway" I said getting himself back in play.  Meaning.. you aren't going to shoot for the green on your second shot but you're going to find the best possible spot as close to the green as you can get.

Even still, you said again that this golfer can hit a good 150 yard shot so what if he's left with 150 into the green?  He's able to hit that shot, isn't he?  He didn't waste any strokes even if he did have to chip out.  He's at the same place you want him to be at in 3..on the green.

I don't understand why you would even play a lesser distance shot onto the green if you can already hit a club 170..why not hit 170, 170?  Your theory is just full of holes and doesn't solve anything on the course.  If a player is able to make bogey on every hole, they shouldn't struggle to be making par.

[jshots]

You are right I think. I bet if a golfer wasn't thinking about par when first learning he might be able to score lower but that doesn't really matter if he is trying to improve. If the goal is to eventually be able to play the holes correctly then why even bother putting off learning how to hit your driver straight, you might as well just try to play the whole correctly and that will show you where your game needs work.

[funkyfred72]

  Paradox said:

Originally Posted by Paradox

I don't know any new golfer who can shoot 5 or 6 on every hole regardless of how they play it.  they top shots, hit fat shots, blade chips, smash putts well past the hole, so on and so forth.

Bingo.  From what the OP has been saying he makes it sound like the "new" golfer hits every shot pretty well except with woods.  If I were a new golfer I would rather hit a huge slice 230 yards than top a 6 iron off the tee.

[Gresh24]

I agree that beginners will struggle just as much hitting any and all clubs.  This is simply an issue of course management, as many have pointed out as well.

I am not a beginner, but a higher handicapper.  I strike my irons pretty well, with drives that get me into the most trouble.  I would benefit from better course management in terms of lowering my score.  But I want to work on what will eventually lower my score more - being able to hit a driver.  I don't get out and practice as much as I should to get better, and I realize that.  So, a lot of my work and practice is during my 1 or 2 rounds per week.

[NorthShoreGolf]

  trackster said:

Originally Posted by trackster

Say you have a 385 par 4.  Play a 170 yard shot off the tee a 150 yard shot and then you are left with a nice little 60-70 yard shot to the green.

Because the easiest shot for a beginner to hit is a half or three quarter sand wedge or a full 60*. If you could take 220-230 off the tee with an easy driver or full 3w you'd have a better chance with a 7/8/9 as a beginner. That's how I'd advice most newbies anyways. Just because you're shooting for bogey golf doesn't mean you should play every hole to +1.

[Gresh24]

  NorthShoreGolf said:

Originally Posted by NorthShoreGolf

Just because you're shooting for bogey golf doesn't mean you should play every hole to +1.

Great point.

[Ignorant]

  NorthShoreGolf said:

Originally Posted by NorthShoreGolf

Because the easiest shot for a beginner to hit is a half or three quarter sand wedge or a full 60*.

Any shot less than a full swing is extremely difficult for a beginner, even for most of the golfers playing for fun.

[sacm3bill]

  Ignorant said:

Originally Posted by Ignorant

Any shot less than a full swing is extremely difficult for a beginner, even for most of the golfers playing for fun.

Hence the sarcasm in NorthShoreGolf's statement.

[FowlPlay]

  jshots said:

Originally Posted by jshots

You are right I think. I bet if a golfer wasn't thinking about par when first learning he might be able to score lower but that doesn't really matter if he is trying to improve. If the goal is to eventually be able to play the holes correctly then why even bother putting off learning how to hit your driver straight, you might as well just try to play the whole correctly and that will show you where your game needs work.

If you clearly can't hit a driver anywhere near the fairway, you might as well go with a club you are better with, right?

For me, I struggle BADLY with the driver. It almost feels pointless trying to used it at this stage. I'd rather master my irons and putter, and save the driver and woods for the range, than post a higher score with the clubs I can't even properly hit the ball with.

[Ryan Heaslip]

I think this is also ties in with the USGA "move it forward" (or something like that) program. It makes sense. I'm all for anything that makes the game easier. I think the handicap system is obviously good, but its not enough. Especially in Burlington, Vermont where our season is so short I'd like to see the game made easier and increase participation.

[mikelegacy]

  Ryan Heaslip said:

I think this is also ties in with the USGA "move it forward" (or something like that) program. It makes sense. I'm all for anything that makes the game easier. I think the handicap system is obviously good, but its not enough. Especially in Burlington, Vermont where our season is so short I'd like to see the game made easier and increase participation.

Yeah, handicap helps tournament play, but it doesn't take the actual physical number of par or birdie out of play for the new player. When I first started, all I thought about was playing par golf or birdie golf and mentally that just screwed my whole game. If I wouldn't have been worrying about score, I would have played much better I'm sure

[FowlPlay]

  mikelegacy said:

Originally Posted by mikelegacy

Yeah, handicap helps tournament play, but it doesn't take the actual physical number of par or birdie out of play for the new player.

When I first started, all I thought about was playing par golf or birdie golf and mentally that just screwed my whole game. If I wouldn't have been worrying about score, I would have played much better I'm sure

I think this is the case with me. I went out and played my first round of golf, and all I could think about was making sure I was doing the right thing. By doing that, I ended up not doing the right thing and posted a ridiculously high score on an $8 9-hole golf course.

[carpediem4300]

if a beginner slices 240-250 off the tee, then why would he not use course management to aim it well left, knowing it will return to centre/slighty right of centre, but on the fairway?

My golf buddy plays off 15 but cant hit a straight drive to save his life, yet he hits most fairways using the above logic,

much better than a 150yard 6iron that if you hit wrong goes no where.......

Course management, end of