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How many of you "fluff" your ball or play 6"/winter rules all the time?


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  1. 1. Do you fluff your ball or play 6"/winter rules all year around?

    • Yes, always or almost always
      4
    • Sometimes, depending on my mood...
      24
    • No, play the ball where it lies (unless it's REALLY bad like sunk in a fairway or GUR)
      94


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Originally Posted by LovinItAll

Hmm.....'Let's start this hole over' is 'cheating', too. I really, really hate to hit my first drive of the day into the junk, but it just means I've gotta start grinding immediately, something I should do the whole round anyway.

I get your point, and I admit that it is cheating. But it is not the same as improving lie and you know it, improving lie is moving the ball, not counting it as a stroke, and then taking a shot from an improved position. A mulligan is playing the shot from the same position.

I don't think either should be an approved activity, but fluffing just defeats the purpose of golf to me.

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It is hard to continue to improve as a golfer if your alter your lie on the majority of your shots.

If you are beginner or do not play competitive rounds then I don't see why anyone would get their panties in a wad.  If you paid for your round and you want to learn how to hit the ball from a decent lie first until you develop a little bit of confidence then I think it is actually good.  As you improve then it is really important to learn how to hit from poor lies.  I'm sure someone will say " learn to hit on the range," but course management cannot be learned from beating golf balls to an open field.

On a personal level, I might play lift clean and play on soggy/muddy course.  I don't general hit off of pebbles either.  It is not worth tearing up a 100$ golf club, when I can simply brush the pebbles away and still play off the poor lie on hard pan or the waste area...whatever the surface is.  IMO

Learning how to play from the rough, buried lies, side hill lies, etc. are part of the game and I think you cheat yourself over the long term if you don't learn how to play in all situations.

EXCEPTION: When I play on a golf course that has alligators everywhere (Hilton Head/Myrtle Beach), I make sure I have a 10-15 foot cushion between me and the water if the water is to my back.  Unless I have a close friend I'm playing with that I trust to watch the water instead of the cart girl while I am hitting.

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I get your point, and I admit that it is cheating. But it is not the same as improving lie and you know it, improving lie is moving the ball, not counting it as a stroke, and then taking a shot from an improved position. A mulligan is playing the shot from the same position.  I don't think either should be an approved activity, but fluffing just defeats the purpose of golf to me.

I'm not knocking whatever anyone wants to do, but if someone is re-teeing, they should be hitting their third shot at that point. That's two shots not counted. Do that two or three times per round and I think it will impact one's score more than rolling it in the fairway (not the same as a foot wedge). I've played 'winter rules' before. It doesn't improve my score by more than a shot or two, if that.

In The Bag: - Patience - Persistence - Perseverance - Platitudes

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Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel2852 View Post

I get your point, and I admit that it is cheating. But it is not the same as improving lie and you know it, improving lie is moving the ball, not counting it as a stroke, and then taking a shot from an improved position. A mulligan is playing the shot from the same position.

I don't think either should be an approved activity, but fluffing just defeats the purpose of golf to me.

You play as you want, but mulligans are just as much against the rules as fluffing.  I don't see how you can say one is any less wrong than the other.  Rule 1-1 is pretty clear about it:

Quote:

1-1 . General

The Game of Golf consists of playing a ball with a club from the teeing ground into the hole by a stroke or successive strokes in accordance with the Rules .

The most basic principle behind the game of golf is that ideally you play from the teeing ground and don't touch the ball again until you lift it from the hole.  Once you play from the tee you don't get any overs.

Rick

"He who has the fastest cart will never have a bad lie."

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourputt View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by daniel2852 View Post

I get your point, and I admit that it is cheating. But it is not the same as improving lie and you know it, improving lie is moving the ball, not counting it as a stroke, and then taking a shot from an improved position. A mulligan is playing the shot from the same position.

I don't think either should be an approved activity, but fluffing just defeats the purpose of golf to me.

You play as you want, but mulligans are just as much against the rules as fluffing.  I don't see how you can say one is any less wrong than the other.  Rule 1-1 is pretty clear about it:

Quote:

1-1 . General

The Game of Golf consists of playing a ball with a club from the teeing ground into the hole by a stroke or successive strokes in accordance with the Rules .

The most basic principle behind the game of golf is that ideally you play from the teeing ground and don't touch the ball again until you lift it from the hole.  Once you play from the tee you don't get any overs.

. . . except for the gazillion times that you can touch and / or lift the ball within the rules.

But yeah, mulligans be cheatin'.

Mizuno MP600 driver, Cleveland '09 Launcher 3-wood, Callaway FTiz 18 degree hybrid, Cleveland TA1 3-9, Scratch SS8620 47, 53, 58, Cleveland Classic 2 mid-mallet, Bridgestone B330S, Sun Mountain four5.

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I never said it wasn't cheating. Jeez didn't expect a bunch of rule nazis to jump on me just because I re-tee one shot per round.

Honestly the foot-wedge is far worse, because when I observed it, it was on every drive this guy was doing it. To me that just defeats the purpose of the game in a different way then re-teeing a shot because it went in the weeds.

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Originally Posted by sean_miller

Quote:

1-1. General

The Game of Golf consists of playing a ball with a club from the teeing ground into the hole by a stroke or successive strokes in accordance with the Rules.

. . . except for the gazillion times that you can touch and / or lift the ball within the rules.

But yeah, mulligans be cheatin'.

And that is why 1-1 says "in accordance with the Rules". Let's be honest about it... the times you get a free touch between tee and green are relatively few in the typical round of golf.

Rick

"He who has the fastest cart will never have a bad lie."

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Originally Posted by LovinItAll

I'm not knocking whatever anyone wants to do, but if someone is re-teeing, they should be hitting their third shot at that point. That's two shots not counted. Do that two or three times per round and I think it will impact one's score more than rolling it in the fairway (not the same as a foot wedge).

I've played 'winter rules' before. It doesn't improve my score by more than a shot or two, if that.

Of course, replaying a shot that has gone awry saves at least 2 strokes. Rolling the ball over in the fairway, which I don't do unless permitted by local rule, may not save any strokes at all.

Originally Posted by LovinItAll

Hmm.....'Let's start this hole over' is 'cheating', too. I really, really hate to hit my first drive of the day into the junk, but it just means I've gotta start grinding immediately, something I should do the whole round anyway.

Absolutely, you don't know how many times I've had to salvage bogey on the 1st hole with a one putt because I hit an errant tee shot due to not being properly warmed up. But that's golf, you have to learn to accept your bad shots and recover from them; there is no do over.

My Tools of Ignorance:

Driver: Ping I20 9.5*
Woods/Hybrids: Cobra AMP 3W and 3 HY

Irons: Cobra AMP 4-GW

Wedges: Callaway Forged Copper 56* and 60*

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Ball: Bridgestone B330-RX and Srixon Z-Star

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Originally Posted by Fourputt

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

Quote:

1-1. General

The Game of Golf consists of playing a ball with a club from the teeing ground into the hole by a stroke or successive strokes in accordance with the Rules.

. . . except for the gazillion times that you can touch and / or lift the ball within the rules.

But yeah, mulligans be cheatin'.

And that is why 1-1 says "in accordance with the Rules".    Let's be honest about it... the times you get a free touch between tee and green are relatively few in the typical round of golf.

I just meant there are always exceptions to the "most basic principle behind the game of golf" and in that spirit some people ignore most of them.

Mizuno MP600 driver, Cleveland '09 Launcher 3-wood, Callaway FTiz 18 degree hybrid, Cleveland TA1 3-9, Scratch SS8620 47, 53, 58, Cleveland Classic 2 mid-mallet, Bridgestone B330S, Sun Mountain four5.

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Absolutely, you don't know how many times I've had to salvage bogey on the 1st hole with a one putt because I hit an errant tee shot due to not being properly warmed up. But that's golf, you have to learn to accept your bad shots and recover from them; there is no do over.

I play in a big group, and we draw pills to see who plays with who. There are some guys that would LOVE to take a mulligan on #1, but we just don't allow it. They're the guys that, when they've hit an errant tee shot on one, look over at the rest of us and see us shaking our heads, like 'No way, buddy....don't even ask.' These are usually the same guys that we don't leave alone if they have a really questionable lie. It's unfortunate that some people are like that, but what are ya gonna do? Gotta protect the field, man......

In The Bag: - Patience - Persistence - Perseverance - Platitudes

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I'll occasionally take a mulligan, but never on an early hole and always when I've already decided not to keep score for the rest of the round.  Since I don't have an official handicap and don't gamble, my scores just reflect how I'm playing and if I'm playing poorly to the point where I don't want to see a large number telling me just how poorly I've played, then I won't bother keeping score any further.  At that point, a mulligan doesn't really matter and if a do-over of a particularly heinous tee shot gives me some degree of satisfaction and sense of accomplishment if I hit my mulligan well, then it's increasing my pleasure out on the golf course and giving me some value for my greens fee instead of just aggravation.  But I don't take many of them (almost never more than one per 9 holes) and don't take them if it would slow down play.

In my bag: - Ping G20 driver, 10.5 deg. S flex - Ping G20 3W, 15 deg., S flex - Nickent 4dx 3H, 4H - Nike Slingshot 4-PW - Adams Tom Watson 52 deg. GW - Vokey 58 deg. SW -Ping Half Wack-E putter

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I'll occasionally take a mulligan, but never on an early hole and always when I've already decided not to keep score for the rest of the round.  Since I don't have an official handicap and don't gamble, my scores just reflect how I'm playing and if I'm playing poorly to the point where I don't want to see a large number telling me just how poorly I've played, then I won't bother keeping score any further.  At that point, a mulligan doesn't really matter and if a do-over of a particularly heinous tee shot gives me some degree of satisfaction and sense of accomplishment if I hit my mulligan well, then it's increasing my pleasure out on the golf course and giving me some value for my greens fee instead of just aggravation.  But I don't take many of them (almost never more than one per 9 holes) and don't take them if it would slow down play.

There's nothing wrong with what you've described, and you can play golf (and have fun doing it) the rest of your life like that. There is some satisfaction to be gained, I think, turning bad rounds into okay rounds, though. Also, the idea of never giving, up regardless of what's already happened, has appeal to me. It would bug me to no end to be playing poorly on the front, take a mulligan, then turn and come in with a great number. I'd feel like I cheated myself.....certainly no one else would care, though.

In The Bag: - Patience - Persistence - Perseverance - Platitudes

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I have been guilty of hitting a second teeshot on the first hole if I had to run to the first tee from the parking lot, fortunately most people are cool with it for that one swing but after that it's golf.

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Originally Posted by onesome

I have been guilty of hitting a second teeshot on the first hole if I had to run to the first tee from the parking lot, fortunately most people are cool with it for that one swing but after that it's golf.

breakfast ball. most guys i've played with have immediately told someone to take another ball if they shank their first one off the first tee.

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 G20 3 Wood (15* Stiff Flex)

 i15 3 Hybrid (20* Stiff Flex)

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 JPX 800 (5-AW)

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Depends entirely upon my reason for playing golf that day.  If it's to get a mental break and just have fun, then I'll nudge it from a nasty lie to an acceptable one.  Same thing if there's a reasonable chance of damaging the club.  Also if there are parts of the course that SHOULD be marked as Ground Under Repair, but they don't bother to take the time to do it, I'll make that call for them (if I'm playing to post a score, this is discussed and agreed upon prior to starting the round and at least 1 other player has to agree with the call - if you've played golf for any length of time you know exactly what I'm talking about).

If I'm playing to improve, post a score or especially if I have money riding on it, I'll play it "down" (and make it clear that's how ALL balls will be played by everyone - and yes, I WILL drive my cart all the way across the fairway to make sure if I suspect you're fluffing!).

There's a difference in playing for the fun of getting out and enjoying the course and the time away from everything else vs. playing "serious" golf.  Just don't confuse the two and expect me to believe you can shoot a 75 when I know you can't make a 4 foot put more than 1 outta 3 times!

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Depends entirely upon my reason for playing golf that day.  There's a difference in playing for the fun of getting out and enjoying the course and the time away from everything else vs. playing "serious" golf.  Just don't confuse the two ......

I just don't understand why so few people can't have fun, enjoy the course and time away from everything while playing golf properly at the same time. I just don't get that. To each his own though.

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

Wedges: Scratch 51-11 TNC grind, Vokey SM-5's;  56-14 F grind and 60-11 K grind
Putter: Scotty Cameron Kombi S
Ball: ProV1

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Originally Posted by David in FL

I just don't understand why so few people can't have fun, enjoy the course and time away from everything while playing golf properly at the same time.

I just don't get that. To each his own though.

This puzzles me too.  I reiterate that I don't really care what others do when they aren't in competition with me, but I can't understand the attitude that golf can't be fun when played by the rules.  To me, playing any other way is just wasting time, since I can't count anything I do as being part of a meaningful round.

Have a great round and shoot a lifetime low score?  Nope didn't happen since I was giving myself improved lies.  Holed out from the fairway for an eagle?  Can't really count it since I rolled the ball off that dry patch of fairway grass.  I'm left with only one memory, and that is that I didn't play the game as it was meant to be played, thus anything I accomplished is irrelevant.  To me, for my own play, that approach is unacceptable.

I often wonder when reading the accomplishments of others on this forum how many times those great holes or outstanding rounds were truly played by the rules, especially after reading this thread and seeing how many players really don't seem to think that the rules have any bearing on the game.  If you have only broken 90 once in your life, but played by some of the modified rules seen here, then I'm really sorry, but you haven't broken 90 - you may not even have broken 100.

Rick

"He who has the fastest cart will never have a bad lie."

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