Soooooooo........I broke 80 with an asterisk....

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by MEfree

Yes, but they would have to only count that half as much as a real 18 hole round unless you wanted a 9 hole score to be as important as an 18 hole score.

Since the HDCP is based on an average of the best 10 differentials, and it's based on an 18 hole round, if you wanted to use a stray nine as one of those, the only way for it to be "accurate" would be to double it, right?

For simplification let's say a course with 72 rating and 113 slope ... if I shot 80 the last ten times in a row, my handicap would be 7.6 (8*.96 truncated).

If I had nine 80's and one 40 and didn't double the 40, my handicap would be 7.2.

[Datsyuk]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

I look at it like this.  A couple of years ago I shot 33 (par 36) on the front nine.  The next day I shot 37 on the front nine.  If I had only played 9 each day that would have been a 2 under par 70.  In the first round I actually ended up with a 76, which is still outstanding for me.  The second round I shot 45 on the back for an 82 total.  This is why I don't see consecutive nines as being equivalent to a full 18.  It is just much more difficult to hold it together for a full 18.  I've done the opposite too, shot a very weak front nine, then gone lights out on the back.  I rarely play only 9 because I always feel like I left something unfinished.

Originally Posted by bplewis24

It counts against his index, so there would be no need to call him a sandbagger.  It's a simple distinction:

Fact: it does count for his index

Opinion: it does not count for his "I broke 80" milestone.

I typically would not be on the side of "golf purists", but on this one I'd say that you do have to play 18 holes to reach some specific scoring milestone.  As mentally taxing as golf is, and as many people choke down the stretch, it becomes clear that there is a mental/fatigue hurdle to overcome in reaching a scoring milestone.  I give him props for putting together 2 good 9-hole scores, and they are both legitimate in their own right.  However, I'm betting that he didn't feel the jitters while teeing off on that 8th and 9th hole of his 2nd 9 the way he would have if he was teeing off on the 17th and 18th holes of a full round.

Yeah, right.

Originally Posted by Dave2512

I wish, I suffer from the same thing all the time. Not uncommon to follow up a 38 with a 39 or 40 later in the week because I play a lot of 9 hole golf. Which is a big reason I've been so frustrated this summer. Can't seem to put it together when I am out for 18. Though worse is the more often than not 45+ after a sub 40 9 hole score.

Two separate 9's paired up by the computer are either a round of golf or they aren't. If people make the distinction for milestones, why do they argue so vehemently that they're a round for HC and accurately reflect potential? Hogwash.

[MEfree]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Since the HDCP is based on an average of the best 10 differentials, and it's based on an 18 hole round, if you wanted to use a stray nine as one of those, the only way for it to be "accurate" would be to double it, right?

For simplification let's say a course with 72 rating and 113 slope ... if I shot 80 the last ten times in a row, my handicap would be 7.6 (8*.96 truncated).

If I had nine 80's and one 40 and didn't double the 40, my handicap would be 7.2.

What I am saying is that if you had nine 18 holes rounds you would need two 9 hole rounds to have a total of 180 holes like the current handicap is based on.  There are several ways this could be made to work mathematically, but this is how I would do it:

Holes	Score	Rating	Slope	Differential	Weight
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
18	80	72	113	7.68	1
9	40	36	113	3.84	0.5
9	40	36	113	3.84	0.5
Sum (10 Best)				76.8	10

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by MEfree

What I am saying is that if you had nine 18 holes rounds you would need two 9 hole rounds to have a total of 180 holes like the current handicap is based on.  There are several ways this could be made to work mathematically, but this is how I would do it:

Holes

Score

Rating

Slope

Differential

Weight

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

18

80

72

113

7.68

1

9

40

36

113

3.84

0.5

9

40

36

113

3.84

0.5

Sum (10 Best)

76.8

10

How is that different from how it is now?

[BuckeyeNut]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

I look at it like this.  A couple of years ago I shot 33 (par 36) on the front nine.  The next day I shot 37 on the front nine.  If I had only played 9 each day that would have been a 2 under par 70.  In the first round I actually ended up with a 76, which is still outstanding for me.  The second round I shot 45 on the back for an 82 total.  This is why I don't see consecutive nines as being equivalent to a full 18.  It is just much more difficult to hold it together for a full 18.  I've done the opposite too, shot a very weak front nine, then gone lights out on the back.

This sums it up nicely........

It's 1 thing to play a good nine, but it's quite another to play an equally good 18.   Going out on a monday and shooting 39 and then a 40 on tuesday is irrelevant to breaking 80.  The same holds true if you play 9 in the morning, and then another 9 in the evening. The scores are 2 individual 9's....

I looked up some personal 9 hole stats of my own from 2012.  In my case...it's shooting par or better. I've scored par or better 38 times for 9 holes in 2012.   Would anyone care to guess how many times (based on the above) I did the same over 18 holes?   I'll give you a hint....8. LOL...and I'm surprised it was that many.   Choking has nothing to do with anything.....it's just exponentially more difficult to hold it together through 18 holes.   Keep playing more holes, and sooner or later things will average out......

The same goes for tourney golf.....except they need to put 4 rounds together!

[Datsyuk]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut

This sums it up nicely........

It's 1 thing to play a good nine, but it's quite another to play an equally good 18.   Going out on a monday and shooting 39 and then a 40 on tuesday is irrelevant to breaking 80.  The same holds true if you play 9 in the morning, and then another 9 in the evening. The scores are 2 individual 9's....

I looked up some personal 9 hole stats of my own from 2012.  In my case...it's shooting par or better. I've scored par or better 38 times for 9 holes in 2012.   Would anyone care to guess how many times (based on the above) I did the same over 18 holes?   I'll give you a hint....8. LOL...and I'm surprised it was that many.   Choking has nothing to do with anything.....it's just exponentially more difficult to hold it together through 18 holes.   Keep playing more holes, and sooner or later things will average out......

The same goes for tourney golf.....except they need to put 4 rounds together!

Thanks for making my point. I clearly don't know that much about how and why indexes are calculated the way they are, but I've stopped judging people who don't consider 9 holes a round of golf and don't enter it. I'm on the fence, so I'll try to either play 18 or go to the range.

[MEfree]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

How is that different from how it is now?

Now they wait until you have a second 9 hole score to pair it with...I didn`t elaborate, but what I would really do is look at your last 360 holes and count your oldest 18 hole round half if you have an odd 9 more recently...so it would look like this

Date	Holes	Score	Rating	Slope	Differential		Weight
10/12/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68	*	1
10/10/2012	18	84	72	113	11.52		0
10/8/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68	*	1
10/6/2012	18	87	72	113	14.4		0
10/4/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68	*	1
10/2/2012	18	89	72	113	16.32		0
9/30/2012	18	79	72	113	6.72	*	1
9/28/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68	*	1
9/26/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68	*	1
9/24/2012	9	40	36	113	3.84	*	0.5
9/22/2012	18	87	72	113	14.4		0
9/20/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68	*	1
9/18/2012	18	89	72	113	16.32		0
9/16/2012	18	77	72	113	4.8	*	1
9/14/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68		0
9/12/2012	18	80	72	113	7.68		0
9/10/2012	9	40	36	113	3.84		0
9/8/2012	18	81	72	113	8.64		0
9/6/2012	9	42	36	113	5.76		0
9/4/2012	18	78	72	113	5.76	*	1
9/2/2012	18	87	72	113	14.4		0
8/31/2012	18/2	77/2	36	113	2.4	*	0.5
Sum (10 Best)					69.6		10

where the 18 hole on Aug 31 would count like a 9 hole round so you would have been considered to have "shot" 38.5 for 9 holes instead of 77 for 18.

[Chas]

My last round: 40 on front 9, 48 .. repeat 48 .. on the back end. Yes, I was thinking how smoothly things were going, with the possibility of a sub-80 round, just before a series of double bogeys. hmmm, maybe I should check the back 9 of the round prior to see if I've shot "under 80" :>) But good going mate - wish I were in your shoes. And yes, 9 holes DOES count as half a round for index purposes.

[Valleygolfer]

Originally Posted by Chas

My last round: 40 on front 9, 48 .. repeat 48 .. on the back end. Yes, I was thinking how smoothly things were going, with the possibility of a sub-80 round, just before a series of double bogeys.

hmmm, maybe I should check the back 9 of the round prior to see if I've shot "under 80" :>)

But good going mate - wish I were in your shoes. And yes, 9 holes DOES count as half a round for index purposes.

The good part of my scoring lately is that I feel like I am just on the brink keeping the scores in the low 40's and 30's for 18.

[jshots]

I got another hypothetical situation. What if you play 27 holes of golf one day and shoot like a 45-39-40? Or 40-39-45? Can you say that you broke 80?

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by jshots

I got another hypothetical situation. What if you play 27 holes of golf one day and shoot like a 45-39-40? Or 40-39-45? Can you say that you broke 80?

Absolutely.  On the other hand, if you went 39-45-40 or 40-45-39, then no.

I bowl in a 4 game league and the same thing works for 700 or 800 series milestones.  If you can do it for the first or the last 3 you get credit for it, but you wouldn't get credit for the 800 if you go 279-279-199-260 for example.

EDIT:  Thought about it more and I think your examples aren't quite equal.  For me, the 79 would feel a tad cheaper if it was the second two nines, than if it was the first two.

[MEfree]

Originally Posted by jshots

I got another hypothetical situation. What if you play 27 holes of golf one day and shoot like a 45-39-40? Or 40-39-45? Can you say that you broke 80?

79 on your first 18 seems 100% legit unless you were playing a 27 hole format that had you repeat the same first 9 for your second 9.  Of course, there are some 9 hole courses that mix up tees to make up your second 9...so far anyone looking to break 80 this would be solid play.

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

EDIT:  Thought about it more and I think your examples aren't quite equal.  For me, the 79 would feel a tad cheaper if it was the second two nines, than if it was the first two.

I agree but still see it as more of an accomplishment than pairing two 9 together when they are separated by 1 or more 18 hole rounds in between.

[Desert Driver]

No -

It is a different thing all together to break 80 playing 18 holes straight and playing by the rules. It is all about keeping your game and emotions together for 18 continuous holes. That's why it is a goal for so many amateur golfers, it is a difficult challenge.

Breaking 40 isn't such a bad accomplishment either, by the way.

I play a lot of 9 hole rounds due to limited time. This year I've worked hard to get in more 18 hole rounds for this very reason, breaking 80 was a goal I'd not yet reached. I've had a lot of 9 hole rounds pieced together by the GHIN system that broke 80, but we all know inside that this isn't "BREAKING 80". Come on guys.

I finally broke thru earlier this year and shot a 77 on a difficult course. Once I figured out how to do it, it has become easier, something I've been able to repeat.

Best of luck in your quest to break 80.

Fairways and Greens.

DD

[Lihu]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut

yes...combined scores count the same for HC purposes.  If you normally play 18, the first nine may be from April, and the 2nd could be from October before they are combined and count towards your HC. When 2 nines are combined for an 18 hole score, that score is noted with a "C".

What if my typical score on a 9 hole course "http://www.greenskeeper.org/southern_california/los_angeles/Eaton_Canyon_Golf_Course/scorecard.cfm" is 44, and I play the course once a week (not twice in 1 day). Is my handicap based upon the 44 that I get once a week to be combined into a score of 88? Which gives me a handicap of 16 rather than the 18 hole course that I usually play with an average score rounded to 97 (69/121 rated course) for a handicap of 25?

I assume that you are stating that I can mix and match my scores on the front 9 and the back 9 (of this 69/121 rated 18 hole course) to give me the optimal score, and get a lower handicap from this as another option as well?

Not sure if I am being confused by all this. To me, it seems more kosher to only count and average the played 18 hole scores per round.

[Lihu]

Originally Posted by Lihu

What if my typical score on a 9 hole course "http://www.greenskeeper.org/southern_california/los_angeles/Eaton_Canyon_Golf_Course/scorecard.cfm" is 44, and I play the course once a week (not twice in 1 day). Is my handicap based upon the 44 that I get once a week to be combined into a score of 88? Which gives me a handicap of 16 rather than the 18 hole course that I usually play with an average score rounded to 97 (69/121 rated course) for a handicap of 25?

I assume that you are stating that I can mix and match my scores on the front 9 and the back 9 (of this 69/121 rated 18 hole course) to give me the optimal score, and get a lower handicap from this as another option as well?

Not sure if I am being confused by all this. To me, it seems more kosher to only count and average the played 18 hole scores per round.

Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut

yes...combined scores count the same for HC purposes.  If you normally play 18, the first nine may be from April, and the 2nd could be from October before they are combined and count towards your HC. When 2 nines are combined for an 18 hole score, that score is noted with a "C".

Correction to the above calculation (in the first paragraph) is that the hypothetical handicap would be 18.5 not 16.

[MEfree]

You can`t mix and match scores as you please...when you post a 9 hole round, it gets paired with the next 9 hole round you post...they could be from the same course or different courses

[Lihu]

You can`t mix and match scores as you please...when you post a 9 hole round, it gets paired with the next 9 hole round you post...they could be from the same course or different courses

That's what I thought, thanks. So, I get low to mid 40s on 9 holes, but mid to low 90s on 18 holes. I feel like I play the same, but there's is so much more that can go wrong on 18 holes.

[Valleygolfer]

I think I know why you have to use 18 holes, you play 9 well and then the during the other 9, you start thinking you can do things you shouldn't attempt that rack up strokes. I think there is a 5 stroke drop once you stop being a moron making idiot shots.