Why are Women such Bad Instructors?

[Lastpick]

As I previously stated I attended a John Jacobs School about 20 years ago.  Five day school and they really changed my game.  Very good school for a new golfer or beginning golfer.  Here is what I found amazing is that when we got there on monday morning, quite a number of the class couldn't hit the ball 20 yards.  The swings were horrible.  Worse than mine.  After five full days of instruction, about half of these people still couldn't resemble any type of golf swing at all.  Five full days and no improvement.  How does the golf instructor keep his sanity with someone that is unteachable?  I have had five private lessons in the past few years.  Have to drive about 240 miles to the guy, but IMO it is well worth it.

[Ernest Jones]

As I previously stated I attended a John Jacobs School about 20 years ago.  Five day school and they really changed my game.  Very good school for a new golfer or beginning golfer.  Here is what I found amazing is that when we got there on monday morning, quite a number of the class couldn't hit the ball 20 yards.  The swings were horrible.  Worse than mine.  After five full days of instruction, about half of these people still couldn't resemble any type of golf swing at all.  Five full days and no improvement.  How does the golf instructor keep his sanity with someone that is unteachable?  I have had five private lessons in the past few years.  Have to drive about 240 miles to the guy, but IMO it is well worth it.

Perhaps that speaks more to the instructors' failures than the students'?

[Lastpick]

Perhaps that speaks more to the instructors' failures than the students'?

Nope, don't think so.  How come many students improved immensely.   Some people just don't have it, but as I recall, they seem to be having a great deal of fun.

[iacas]

Nope, don't think so.  How come many students improved immensely.   Some people just don't have it, but as I recall, they seem to be having a great deal of fun.

Either way, not really the topic here…

[trickyputt]

[QUOTE name="Ernest Jones" url="/t/78028/why-are-women-such-bad-instructors/54#post_1074655"] Perhaps that speaks more to the instructors' failures than the students'?[/QUOTE] Nope, don't think so.  How come many students improved immensely.   Some people just don't have it, but as I recall, they seem to be having a great deal of fun.

LoL the topic is women, sexual overtones and sports. No fun allowed!

[JonMA1]

except purple-for better guys women in general cannot demonstrate how to hit a high soft 3-iron 210 yards or whatever),

I think this is a legitimate point. Physical limitations are probably why you don't see too many women coaching men at a high level of other sports.

I have a question for Phil, Mike or Erik... Is it possible for an instructor - male or female - to be excellent at helping double-bogey students get to the level of bogey or a bit better but perhaps not be as good at getting a single-digit golfer down to scratch? To word it another way, are some instructors less skilled at helping beginners but excellent at teaching better players? Or is that part of what makes an instructor good - the ability to teach at all levels?

If the first question can be answered yes, then I think It would be likely that a female instructor could excel at that level. People are driven to be good at what they do for a living. While few women can hit as far as a skilled male player, they could be passionate enough with their profession to gain the knowledge and develop the teaching skills Erik has listed. Would there be an abundance of women with enough ambition to get there? Probably not. But I don't know why it couldn't happen.

[WUTiger]

OK, Phil, back to the beginning. You asked, Why are Women such Bad Instructors? I disagreed with your premise.

You define a "bad instructor" as someone who... can't develop someone to play professional golf? You never really gave a definition.

JonMA1 has a point. It this what makes a great instructor - someone who can teach at all levels? Sounds acceptable to me.

... I have a question for Phil, Mike or Erik... Is it possible for an instructor - male or female - to be excellent at helping double-bogey students get to the level of bogey or a bit better but perhaps not be as good at getting a single-digit golfer down to scratch? To word it another way, are some instructors less skilled at helping beginners but excellent at teaching better players? Or is that part of what makes an instructor good - the ability to teach at all levels? ...

But, this brings us back to your original question: Why are Women such Bad Instructors?

Is someone who can't teach at all levels a bad instructor? I think not.

Despite your "30+ years as a golf instructor" (what did you caution about credentialing?) you have failed to convince me that women are "such bad golf instructors?"

[Phil McGleno]

Are you a great student if you get two As and three Ds? Are you a great baseball player if you never get past A baseball? Are you a great golfer if you never shoot below 77? I dont care if I failed to convince you of anything-Youre a lousy golfer who thinks that your wife is 4'9 is relevant info. Topping out your skill level at teaching beginners and hacks does not make you a great instructor. Or even a good one.-I'll PM the mods and ask them to change the topic to 'not good' if it makes you feel better though.-Same question in my eyes. Perhaps you should have asked for definition before saying you dont agree. [quote name="WUTiger" url="/t/78028/why-are-women-such-bad-instructors/54#post_1074688"]OK, Phil, back to the beginning. [SIZE=13px]You asked,[/SIZE][SIZE=13px] Why are Women such Bad Instructors? [/SIZE][SIZE=13px]I disagreed with your premise.[/SIZE] You define a "bad instructor" as someone who... can't develop someone to play professional golf? You never really gave a definition. [SIZE=13px] JonMA1 [/SIZE][SIZE=13px]has a point. It this what makes a great instructor - someone who can teach at all levels? Sounds acceptable to me.[/SIZE] [SIZE=13px]But, this brings us back to your original question:[/SIZE] [SIZE=13px] Why are Women such Bad Instructors? [/SIZE] Is someone who can't teach at all levels a bad instructor? I think not. Despite your "30+ years as a golf instructor" (what did you caution about credentialing?) you have failed to convince me that women are "such bad golf instructors?"  [/quote] BTW I did not ever add '30+ years as golf instructor' to the conversation.-You did.

[newtogolf]

OK, Phil, back to the beginning. You asked, Why are Women such Bad Instructors? I disagreed with your premise.

You define a "bad instructor" as someone who... can't develop someone to play professional golf? You never really gave a definition.

JonMA1 has a point. It this what makes a great instructor - someone who can teach at all levels? Sounds acceptable to me.

But, this brings us back to your original question: Why are Women such Bad Instructors?

Is someone who can't teach at all levels a bad instructor? I think not.

Despite your "30+ years as a golf instructor" (what did you caution about credentialing?) you have failed to convince me that women are "such bad golf instructors?"

Seems your issue is with the use of the word "bad" which you're interpreting out of the context of Phil's use of it.  Phil is saying that at the top level of instruction, women are "Bad Instructors" to which most here agree.

Given there are poor - great instructors that are qualified to and do instruct at the pro level then how would you classify (in the overall scope of golf instruction) an instructor that isn't even competent enough of being one of the worst pro level instructors?

[iacas]

Seems your issue is with the use of the word "bad" which you're interpreting out of the context of Phil's use of it.  Phil is saying that at the top level of instruction, women are "Bad Instructors" to which most here agree.

I agree - perhaps the better word would be "complete" but you can be a "complete" instructor that's still not good at anything in particular, so maybe even "complete" isn't good. I don't think "complete" implies "does everything well " so now I'm arguing against myself.

We had a PM conversation about it and the result was to add the "edit" to the first post to clarify the OP and title. Until we can come up with a title that works this one will remain.

[trickyputt]

In a physical environment, awareness is important. It may be that they are all busy being girls. As evidence I offer recent meme-ery: [video]http://youtu.be/7iYymNjSSKk[/video]

[iacas]

In a physical invironment, awareness is important. It may be that they are all busy being girls. As evidence I offer recent meme-ery:

Please contribute to the topic being discussed or be restricted from the thread.

This is not the topic. In fact, none of your posts in this thread have been on topic.

[trickyputt]

[QUOTE name="trickyputt" url="/t/78028/why-are-women-such-bad-instructors/54#post_1074991"] In a physical invironment, awareness is important. It may be that they are all busy being girls. As evidence I offer recent meme-ery:[/QUOTE] Please contribute to the topic being discussed or be restricted from the thread. This is not the topic. In fact, none of your posts in this thread have been on topic.

I DO APOLOGIZE. I take the position that the original premise is silly, and I am afraid I have been less than serious about the topic as a result. The OP had suppositions. Preconceived expectations. I enjoy revelations about the game from people who enjoy it, but why ask a question like this about a group of persons who are so obviously oriented in a different direction? Does one consider oneself so important that one assumes all others would wish to be like themself? I find that position self inflating.