End of out of bounds line

[KoenA]

Hello everyone,

Apologies if the below has been asked before, but I couldn't find it through a search.

I was playing matchplay against a friend 2 days ago, when the following situation happens:

We were playing hole 5, for which a local rule states that for shots of the tee, hole 14 is out of bounds. Along the left side of #5, there are white stakes clearly showing this internal out of bounds, however these stop as of a certain moment.

My tee shot landed left of the fairway, but before the stakes (lousy lie). My second shot however sails across the out of bounds line, and comes to rest beyond where the last white stake showing the out of bounds is.

At this point, we were unsure whether the ball was out of bounds or not.

Unfortunately, reading what the R&A; has to say on out of bounds still doesn't give the answer.

Quote:

It is a common misconception that it is not permissible to define areas within the course as out of bounds. However, it is not unusual for features such as maintenance areas, clubhouses and practice grounds to be marked as out of bounds. In addition, it may be necessary to establish boundaries between two holes to maintain the character of a hole or to protect players on the adjacent fairway. In these cases, it is important to consider where the boundary starts and finishes so that there is no doubt where it begins and ends. Where there is no natural start/finish point, e.g. the boundary exists in isolation and is not “tied” into other boundaries on the course, often it is necessary to place two stakes, side-by-side and at a right angle to the first and last stake, to indicate that the boundary extends indefinitely in that direction.

It is not permissible to make an area out of bounds only for certain strokes at a given hole, for example, a stroke from the teeing ground (see Out of Bounds, Chapter 3).

Source: http://www.randa.org/en/Rules-and-Amateur-Status/Guidance-on-Running-a-Competition.aspx?chapter=3&section;=1

First, it would seem that the local rule saying the out of bounds only applies to shots of the tee is wrong and so that fact that it was my second shot doesn't matter. This still leaves me with the question of where the out of bounds zone stops. As there were no double stakes, the line doesn't continue indefinitely, yet then how should the area be defined? Perpendicular to the OOB line?

I'm sure this situation arises at more courses. Any thoughts on what the right ruling would be here?

Thanks!

Koen

[luu5]

I would rule the OB to end at the last stake and your ball to be in bounds. Players should not have to suffer from lazy marking.

[jsgolfer]

I would rule the OB to end at the last stake and your ball to be in bounds. Players should not have to suffer from lazy marking.

I would agree, if you are past the last stake, you're in-bounds.

[Rulesman]

First, it would seem that the local rule saying the out of bounds only applies to shots of the tee is wrong and so that fact that it was my second shot doesn't matter.

Koen

Your local rule would seem to be in conflict with the Rules of Golf. This decision covers it.

33-2a/13

Tee Decreed to Be in Bounds for the Tee Shot and Out of Bounds Thereafter

Q. A Committee has decreed that ground surrounding a certain teeing ground is in bounds for tee shots and out of bounds thereafter. Is this permissible?

A. No. In play of a particular hole, an area cannot be both in bounds and out of bounds.

As you suggest, undefined termination is not an uncommon problem. I suggest you speak to the committee i) about the illegal LR and ii) about following the R&A; recommendation re double stakes.

[KoenA]

Your local rule would seem to be in conflict with the Rules of Golf. This decision covers it.

I agree, but then there are still two ways to look at it:

1) The OOB as a whole is to be dismissed

2) The fact that it only applies to tee shots is to be dismissed

We went with the second option in the end, but I played the ball from where it was considering the OOB zone ended at the last stake.

[saevel25]

My second shot however sails across the out of bounds line, and comes to rest beyond where the last white stake showing the out of bounds is.

At this point, we were unsure whether the ball was out of bounds or not.

Unfortunately, reading what the R&A; has to say on out of bounds still doesn't give the answer.

I am not sure as to the orientation on this. It would be nice if the rules say take a 90 degree orientation.

Something like this, If you are standing by the stake on the right your ball looks OB. If you walk to the end then the ball is clearly past the last stake. Just wondering what reference point is used to determine if the ball is OB or not.

I agree, but then there are still two ways to look at it:

1) The OOB as a whole is to be dismissed

2) The fact that it only applies to tee shots is to be dismissed

We went with the second option in the end, but I played the ball from where it was considering the OOB zone ended at the last stake.

I'd say the internal OB should be played for the entirety of the golf hole. The white stakes are present. What isn't legal is the local rule only allowing the OB for one shot. This is if I was playing the course for the first time and came upon this hole.

I would bring this up with the course and either tell them to use the white stakes correctly or get rid of them. You could always email or call the R&A; and ask them this. I would reference the USGA ruling 33-2a/12 stated above.

[Rulesman]

I would bring this up with the course and either tell them to use the white stakes correctly or get rid of them. You could always email or call the R&A; and ask them this. I would reference the USGA ruling 33-2a/12 stated above.

If he's calling the R&A; I suggest he refers to R&A; ruling 33-2a/12

[Braivo]

Hello everyone,

Apologies if the below has been asked before, but I couldn't find it through a search.

I was playing matchplay against a friend 2 days ago, when the following situation happens:

We were playing hole 5, for which a local rule states that for shots of the tee, hole 14 is out of bounds. Along the left side of #5, there are white stakes clearly showing this internal out of bounds, however these stop as of a certain moment.

My tee shot landed left of the fairway, but before the stakes (lousy lie). My second shot however sails across the out of bounds line, and comes to rest beyond where the last white stake showing the out of bounds is.

At this point, we were unsure whether the ball was out of bounds or not.

Unfortunately, reading what the R&A; has to say on out of bounds still doesn't give the answer.

First, it would seem that the local rule saying the out of bounds only applies to shots of the tee is wrong and so that fact that it was my second shot doesn't matter. This still leaves me with the question of where the out of bounds zone stops. As there were no double stakes, the line doesn't continue indefinitely, yet then how should the area be defined? Perpendicular to the OOB line?

I'm sure this situation arises at more courses. Any thoughts on what the right ruling would be here?

Thanks!

Koen

I had the exact same situation occur, see my post and replies starting at #24 of this thread.

http://thesandtrap.com/t/73457/determining-out-of-bounds/18

I did that same as you and played it as if it was in bounds, assuming a perpendicular line from the stakes.