Jump to content
Subscribe to the Spin Axis Podcast! ×
Note: This thread is 3664 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

Posted

New guy here.

Been playing a long time, handicap sadly about 20 these days.

I had never been able to hit my sand wedge from the fairway.  I finally broke down and traded in my 20 year old sand wedge for a new Cleveland,  Love the club, played with it the first time today.

HOWEVER - a question / issue.

The new club is 58 degrees, average bounce (12).  When I hit it off of the fairway, I close the face down (i.e., move the ball further back in my stance)  to remove the bounce so I can cleanly hit down on the ball to launch it.

When I took it to the driving range, I was  hitting it about 75 yards, which is fine. Driving range  won't let me hit down on the rubber mat like I would on a fairway.

So here's the dilemma - on the course today, when I closed the face down, hit down on the ball, and took the 'right' divot, the ball flew.  Not the same ball flight as the range, but more of a penetrating flight that climbed and then dropped - but I couldn't get a good read on how far I was hitting the ball.

When I didn't close the face as much, obviously it was a higher, softer shot, but bounce came into play.  But in closing the blade with a tight lie, the change in trajectory really put the ball much further out.

Without wasting precious shots on the course trying to figure this out, is there some kind of 'rule of thumb' to get an idea of how long I should expect the ball flight with a closed face?

Am I missing something?


Posted

Try the SCOR wedges.  They have a "V sole" that keeps you from digging a hole in the fairway.   I have a 57* and get 61-70 yds out of a full swing.  Currently, the last available SCOR's are on ebay for aboyt $70 apiece.  This is because they now make the new Ben Hogan irons and wedges...


Posted

Not quite ready to give up on the new Cleveland.  I like it from a fluffy lie and in sand, just can't figure out how to judge the distance when removing the bounce.

The driving range doesn't help because I can't hit that hard down and take a divot on a rubber mat.

Other than that, it's a great sand wedge.


  • Moderator
Posted
  Arthur Dent said:

The new club is 58 degrees, average bounce (12).  When I hit it off of the fairway, I close the face down (i.e., move the ball further back in my stance)  to remove the bounce so I can cleanly hit down on the ball to launch it.

When I took it to the driving range, I was  hitting it about 75 yards, which is fine. Driving range  won't let me hit down on the rubber mat like I would on a fairway.

So here's the dilemma - on the course today, when I closed the face down, hit down on the ball, and took the 'right' divot, the ball flew.  Not the same ball flight as the range, but more of a penetrating flight that climbed and then dropped - but I couldn't get a good read on how far I was hitting the ball.

When I didn't close the face as much, obviously it was a higher, softer shot, but bounce came into play.  But in closing the blade with a tight lie, the change in trajectory really put the ball much further out.

Without wasting precious shots on the course trying to figure this out, is there some kind of 'rule of thumb' to get an idea of how long I should expect the ball flight with a closed face?

Am I missing something?

I wouldn't fool around with the face very much. For distance control will full-ish wedge shots, just change how far you take it back.

Also you still want to use the bounce on tight lies, helps ensure more consistent contact and distance control.

Mike McLoughlin

Check out my friends on Evolvr!
Follow The Sand Trap on Twitter!  and on Facebook
Golf Terminology -  Analyzr  -  My FacebookTwitter and Instagram 

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Posted
  Arthur Dent said:
I understand that, but without positioning the ball further back in my stance (which removes the bounce), I scull the shot.

It's not the bounce that's causing your problems it's your swing. A common mistake trying to hit a full SW....heck, a 58* is really a lob wedge , is to get flippy and try to scoop the ball into the air. It's very easy to blade the ball when you do that... Honestly, assuming you have one, I'd recommend working on a 3/4 shot with your 52* or 54* rather than a full shot with the 58*, as @mvmac recommends in the first thread he linked to. Welcome to the site! :beer:

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

Wedges: Scratch 51-11 TNC grind, Vokey SM-5's;  56-14 F grind and 60-11 K grind
Putter: Scotty Cameron Kombi S
Ball: ProV1

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Posted

Could be.  I've been focusing on hitting down on the ball,since I have never been able to hit my old sw off the fairway.

You're saying hit down hard enough to negate the bounce and not put it further back in my stance?


Posted

Agree 100% with @David in FL .   I've stopped using my 58 off the fairway anymore as I've improved on partial wedge shots - thanks to @mvmac 's thread mentioned above - with the "flighted" shot approach.  Now the 58 has been relegated to basically just greenside and bunker play.

  • Upvote 1
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Moderator
Posted
  Arthur Dent said:

Could be.  I've been focusing on hitting down on the ball,since I have never been able to hit my old sw off the fairway.

You're saying hit down hard enough to negate the bounce and not put it further back in my stance?

Bounce is your friend, even on 1/2 to full wedge shots. You don't want to "negate" the bounce. You're skulling it because something is off with your swing. Weight isn't forward enough and/or you're flipping it, that's why you can't "hit down".

Mike McLoughlin

Check out my friends on Evolvr!
Follow The Sand Trap on Twitter!  and on Facebook
Golf Terminology -  Analyzr  -  My FacebookTwitter and Instagram 

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Posted
  Arthur Dent said:
So you are just pretty much using 1/2 - 3/4 pitching wedge shots?

3/4 everything from about 160 down to about 100 yards, which is a 3/4 54* wedge, and then from there to 55 yards, just shorter swings with the 54. From inside of 55, it's pitch shots with the 54 until green side. Then it's mostly the 58. But like Mvmac said above, I'm NEVER not utilizing the bounce on any of those clubs. Bounce helps!

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Moderator
Posted
  David in FL said:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arthur Dent

I understand that, but without positioning the ball further back in my stance (which removes the bounce), I scull the shot.

It's not the bounce that's causing your problems it's your swing. A common mistake trying to hit a full SW....heck, a 58* is really a lob wedge, is to get flippy and try to scoop the ball into the air. It's very easy to blade the ball when you do that...

Honestly, assuming you have one, I'd recommend working on a 3/4 shot with your 52* or 54* rather than a full shot with the 58*, as @mvmac recommends in the first thread he linked to.

Welcome to the site!

@Arthur Dent

I took this advice from @David in FL a couple of seasons ago and it was the best advice. I will only hit a full 58 if I absolutely have no other alternative. I can only remember one time this season. The 3/4 and 1/2 shots are more accurate and I make more consistent contact for better distance control. My 100 yard shot is a 3/4 PW. It used to be a full gap wedge.

Review the threads @mvmac posted. Go to a grass range and start working on them. This technique is easier to master than full swing mechanics too. You will have an easier time becoming proficient with it too.

Scott

Titleist, Edel, Scotty Cameron Putter, Snell - AimPoint - Evolvr - MirrorVision

My Swing Thread

boogielicious - Adjective describing the perfect surf wave

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Posted

It makes sense.

I am also thinking of adding a gap wedge/ Recommendations for a gap wedge?  52 degrees sound about right? 8 degree boounce?


Posted
  Arthur Dent said:
Not quite ready to give up on the new Cleveland.  I like it from a fluffy lie and in sand, just can't figure out how to judge the distance when removing the bounce.

The driving range doesn't help because I can't hit that hard down and take a divot on a rubber mat.

Other than that, it's a great sand wedge.


What do you think bounce does?

There are also many ways to get 12 deg of bounce -- wide sole, higher leading edge, etc.

Bounce is typically a forgiving feature of a club, because it helps the club slide if  you hit it slightly fat. But its effect also depends on setup -- the problem with setting the ball in the back of your stance is that it is a hit or miss proposition - you've got to be accurate or you chunk or thin and can get inconsistent yardage.

If you are skulling on a normal lie from a middle to front positioning of the ball, I'd say the issue is your swing, weight, etc.

Weight forward, flat left wrist at impact, make divot in front of ball. Stay with relaxed muscles.

Ping G400 Max 9/TPT Shaft, TEE EX10 Beta 4, 5 wd, PXG 22 HY, Mizuno JPX919F 5-GW, TItleist SM7 Raw 55-09, 59-11, Bettinardi BB39

 

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Posted

From my perspective when looking down at the club, the 58 seems to have the leading edge sitting up a bit when placed on the ground.

The only way to make the leading edge the first point of contact (to me, that is) was to move the ball a bit further back in my stance. In doing this, I change the trajectory of the shot drastically from the fairway, and that's my real issue.

There aren't any grass driving ranges that I am aware of in my area. Well, there is one at the local college, but it is primarily hard pan.

I liked the 58 TREMENDOUSLY from the rough around the green with the right lie, and it was amazing out of traps.  Truly effortless.

The more I read the responses and ask around, I'm being told I"m really looking for a gap wedge.


  • Moderator
Posted
  Arthur Dent said:

From my perspective when looking down at the club, the 58 seems to have the leading edge sitting up a bit when placed on the ground.

The only way to make the leading edge the first point of contact (to me, that is) was to move the ball a bit further back in my stance. In doing this, I change the trajectory of the shot drastically from the fairway, and that's my real issue.

The leading edge being a little off the ground is fine, can still hit great shots. Again, bounce is your friend.

Mike McLoughlin

Check out my friends on Evolvr!
Follow The Sand Trap on Twitter!  and on Facebook
Golf Terminology -  Analyzr  -  My FacebookTwitter and Instagram 

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Note: This thread is 3664 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • TST Partners

    PlayBetter
    TourStriker
    Golfer's Journal
    ShotScope
    The Stack System
    FitForGolf
    FlightScope Mevo
    Direct: Mevo, Mevo+, and Pro Package.

    Coupon Codes (save 10-20%): "IACAS" for Mevo/Stack/FitForGolf, "IACASPLUS" for Mevo+/Pro Package, and "THESANDTRAP" for ShotScope. 15% off TourStriker (no code).
  • Posts

    • That's part of why faster greens reward better putters. Given time to acclimate, golfers of any level (not talking about utter beginners or people who can't break 100 often) putt better on faster greens.
    • Smoother greens rewards better putters. The faster the green, the bigger the error in distance control. But, if you make the greens too slow good players are not used to hit the ball that hard so it can make them struggle a bit.
    • Day 11 (August 21).  Practice session this morning;  chipping for a while (focusing chips that aren't "on the number" for me --- I'm very comfortable with 20 and 25 yard chips, less so with 15 and 10).  Then full swing work, shared a small bucket.  For my share, I was focusing on setup and where I'm aiming.  It dawned on me that I've been hitting some really nice drivers and woods lately, as far as contact, flight, and distance, but not getting them where I want them to go, and the conversation from yesterday's Spin Axis podcast (nice to finally be caught up!) made me realize I wonder if I'm adjusting my aim for the difference in swing path.  I definitely put my woods closer to my intended target line today;  not sure if that means I'm adjusting for a pull or aiming correctly though. 😕 
    • Tied my season low with a 79 at an away course.  Nothing spectacular on the front (3 pars, 6 bogeys), but on the back I had 3 birdies (should have been 4 as I missed a putt from 5').   This round almost dropped one full shot from my index....from a 13.4 to a 12.6   Also....just a on side note, I have a consecutive 72 hole streak currently on playing the same ball.
    • Wordle 1,524 4/6 ⬜⬜⬜🟨🟨 🟨🟨⬜🟩⬜ 🟩🟨⬜🟩⬜ 🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...