The Squat

[Traveller]

Picked up on a recent interview of Justin Thomas who won the PGA Tour title at CIMB Classic last November.

When asked about his long driving distance he said "I use the force off the ground to hit upward on the ball - that's a big part of it"

Being somewhat of a Moe Norman fan, I went back and had another look at Moe's swing videos, which show a squat or bob on the downswing (iirc he had a sequence which included the "bob"), then using his lead leg to push up into the ball, I wonder if this was what Justin Thomas was referring to. Usually when I straighten my lead leg I end up topping the ball or hitting it thin but if this move was under control I can see a lot of energy being transferred into impact. Don't think this is anything new - I just want to work on it.

[saevel25]

With a proper weight shift with good hip and shoulder inclination turning around the spine produces a squat move because the hips want to bump and squat q bit due to the lead hip being lower than the back hip at transition. 

Some do more squatting as a timing power move. Mostly speed comes from fast hands and arms. 

[Traveller]

6 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

With a proper weight shift with good hip and shoulder inclination turning around the spine produces a squat move because the hips want to bump and squat q bit due to the lead hip being lower than the back hip at transition. 

Some do more squatting as a timing power move. Mostly speed comes from fast hands and arms. 

that would explain what Justin Thomas meant about using the ground, along with his good swing

[natureboy]

An extending lead leg / lead side is important in providing some club shaft 'whip' through impact.

[bm85]

I was actually playing around with a more exaggerated squat move, and was getting serious height.

Don't know when, but at some point I had gone back to a more vertical shaft position at address which was the culprit. Adding some shaft lean helped me de-loft the club at impact resulting in a much more desirable flight. 

Just throwing that out there in case you attempt it, and find you're hitting moon balls.

[mvmac]

16 hours ago, Traveller said:

Picked up on a recent interview of Justin Thomas who won the PGA Tour title at CIMB Classic last November.

When asked about his long driving distance he said "I use the force off the ground to hit upward on the ball - that's a big part of it"

Check this out

 

 

[Traveller]

14 hours ago, mvmac said:

Check this out

 

 

I watched the videos. Good stuff. I play my irons with most weight on lead leg, left shoulder down a bit and ball placement back in the stance. One problem I had was tending to sway whole body into the ball. 

[Traveller]

14 hours ago, bm85 said:

I was actually playing around with a more exaggerated squat move, and was getting serious height.

Don't know when, but at some point I had gone back to a more vertical shaft position at address which was the culprit. Adding some shaft lean helped me de-loft the club at impact resulting in a much more desirable flight. 

Just throwing that out there in case you attempt it, and find you're hitting moon balls.

I tend to address ball with hands ahead and open the face a bit so I don't draw/hook. It may sound strange but I rarely if ever fade the ball and dread the hook. I can also compensate a closed face by twisting wrists clockwise at the top of the swing - not too much - just enough to keep the head square on impact.

[mvmac]

6 hours ago, Traveller said:

I watched the videos. Good stuff. I play my irons with most weight on lead leg, left shoulder down a bit and ball placement back in the stance. 

I would avoid feeling most of your weight/pressure stay on your lead side on the backswing, it should move back a little. You don't want to be "leaning" or "loading" left on the backswing because that can cause the head to move down and forward with the hips swaying back. 

I'd also caution against having the ball back in the stance, can lead to some bad compensations.

[Traveller]

18 hours ago, mvmac said:

I would avoid feeling most of your weight/pressure stay on your lead side on the backswing, it should move back a little. You don't want to be "leaning" or "loading" left on the backswing because that can cause the head to move down and forward with the hips swaying back. 

I'd also caution against having the ball back in the stance, can lead to some bad compensations.

wider stance prevents leaning forward and my rear leg stops any hip movement rearwards - I turn a tight pivot on the backswing with no movement forward or back. Ground impact point of any club tends to be closer to the middle of stance so I can get away with the ball being back of centre and still have solid hitting down contact with a divot. I've always played irons this way and find it gives me a lot of control.

[boogielicious]

30 minutes ago, Traveller said:

wider stance prevents leaning forward and my rear leg stops any hip movement rearwards - I turn a tight pivot on the backswing with no movement forward or back. Ground impact point of any club tends to be closer to the middle of stance so I can get away with the ball being back of centre and still have solid hitting down contact with a divot. I've always played irons this way and find it gives me a lot of control.

I moved this thread to the Instruction and Playing Tips section.

One thing about wider stances to keep in mind: The wider the stance, the further back the low point in your swing can be. The low point on a good Pro's swing is roughly under their left armpit. So the wider your stance, the further from your left heel the low point will be. Your countryman Adam is below with his driver. If his right foot was further back, the low point would move back as well.

There is a balance between power generated from a wider stance and your ability to slide and rotate the hips forward. Try this test: Take an easy swing with a 7 iron with your feet the width apart of your normal standing width, say 10 cm. See how easy it is to slide your hips forward and rotate them. Then widen your stance very wide, more than your driver stance width. See how much harder it is to slide the hips forward and rotate them?

Good instructors know the balance between being able to generate power and being able to get your weight forward and rotate the hips fast. Your stance width is really based upon your body build and flexibility. So there really isn't a stock number that fits all players. Also, there are other ways and feels to keep you from shifting back in the back swing that don't require a wider stance. A lot of us work on this. Check out the thread below.

 

If you haven't set up a My Swing thread, I would recommend doing so. It will be easier to help answer your question after seeing your swing. Don't be shy about it either. We all came to this site to get better. 

[Traveller]

11 hours ago, boogielicious said:

I moved this thread to the Instruction and Playing Tips section.

One thing about wider stances to keep in mind: The wider the stance, the further back the low point in your swing can be. The low point on a good Pro's swing is roughly under their left armpit. So the wider your stance, the further from your left heel the low point will be. Your countryman Adam is below with his driver. If his right foot was further back, the low point would move back as well.

There is a balance between power generated from a wider stance and your ability to slide and rotate the hips forward. Try this test: Take an easy swing with a 7 iron with your feet the width apart of your normal standing width, say 10 cm. See how easy it is to slide your hips forward and rotate them. Then widen your stance very wide, more than your driver stance width. See how much harder it is to slide the hips forward and rotate them?

Good instructors know the balance between being able to generate power and being able to get your weight forward and rotate the hips fast. Your stance width is really based upon your body build and flexibility. So there really isn't a stock number that fits all players. Also, there are other ways and feels to keep you from shifting back in the back swing that don't require a wider stance. A lot of us work on this. Check out the thread below.

 

If you haven't set up a My Swing thread, I would recommend doing so. It will be easier to help answer your question after seeing your swing. Don't be shy about it either. We all came to this site to get better. 

Thanks for the information. I don't want to get involved with videos, I'm happy with my swing, it has served me well for 4 decades and I'm more interesting in just playing golf and talking about courses and experiences rather than getting deeply involved in the mechanics.