Presidential Race 2016

[StevenR84]

This democratic race has some shocking similarities to the last primary Hillary lost. Obama was down early and then rallied late and gained the support of the super delegates (who WILL be the ones to pick the nominee). Today could be a nice move for Bernie 7 of 8 with NY in his sights. I hate hearing how NY is Hillary's state. Bernie was born and raised in Brooklyn so it's HIS state. Too bad the MSM can't get their bias out of the way. I saw someone say on an earlier page in this thread that Bernie was a bum until 40. Partially true. He used the money he collected from unemployment to fund his first campaign. This same man is now running for the highest office in the country. Born poor, struggled, worked through with some help, and now has record crowds turning out to see his public appearances. This man is the epitome of what we should be. Anyone who has an already rich father who uses his clout to help build an empire can be a billionaire, not impressive. John Oliver does a great piece on the "wall". Did you know there's already an awkward fence that has been built? Some people had imminent domain claims made against them so that the government could build that fence. Cost estimates for the "wall" are about $12 billion and that doesn't include maintenance costs. This recent Panama thing only serves to help Bernie, as yet again, there's documented evidence of him speaking out against it and Hillary praising Obama for it. Here is my big takeaway when I compare Bernie to Trump. Trump says he loves the uneducated (because he knows largely they are voting for him, not necessarily you fine people here no insults being thrown) and Bernie wants you to be able to go to college without coming out with a mountain of debt.

[rkim291968]

Cruz won big in Wisconsin today.  He may get the most of 42 delegates.  This is the 1st time Trump put foot in his mouth and paid for it.  Before this, Trump's blunder leading to election day didn't hurt him much.  Trump's aura of invincibility is eroding.  

Bernie's win is not so big in delegate counts.  He needs to somehow figure out how to get at the super delegates.   

Is Kasich going to win any states, delegates going forward?   

[Dave2512]

The Trump campaign non-concession announcement to the Wisconsin beat down is another misstep. The insults are getting old. Calling Ted Lyin Ted was a slimy way to acknowledge his win. 

[rkim291968]

43 minutes ago, Dave2512 said:

The Trump campaign non-concession announcement to the Wisconsin beat down is another misstep. The insults are getting old. Calling Ted Lyin Ted was a slimy way to acknowledge his win. 

I agree.  It will push the people on the fence to Cruz (or Kasich).   Trump's statement today made him look like what he has been all along - a 7 year old spoiled brat who can't accept losing.   

[Braivo]

17 hours ago, StevenR84 said:

This democratic race has some shocking similarities to the last primary Hillary lost. Obama was down early and then rallied late and gained the support of the super delegates (who WILL be the ones to pick the nominee). Today could be a nice move for Bernie 7 of 8 with NY in his sights. 

Bernie is charging, I love to see it. I am not a Bernie fan, but I am pulling for anyone that can unseat the establishment candidate. Nicely done. 

11 hours ago, rkim291968 said:

Cruz won big in Wisconsin today.  He may get the most of 42 delegates.  This is the 1st time Trump put foot in his mouth and paid for it.  Before this, Trump's blunder leading to election day didn't hurt him much.  Trump's aura of invincibility is eroding.  

Bernie's win is not so big in delegate counts.  He needs to somehow figure out how to get at the super delegates.   

Is Kasich going to win any states, delegates going forward?   

As a Trump supporter from the beginning I will say this is true. The cracks are showing in his campaign. He must shift course to a more Presidential tone very soon. My fear is that he is incapable of this expected shift in tone. If that's the case then he is finished. He will not leave a contested convention with the nomination, no way. 

Make no mistake, Kasich is being paid to stay in the race simply to suck delegates from Trump, that's it. There is no other reason for him to be there. 

[saevel25]

12 minutes ago, Braivo said:

As a Trump supporter from the beginning I will say this is true. The cracks are showing in his campaign. He must shift course to a more Presidential tone very soon.

I think he needs to study a bit. Not knowing what the EPA was is big. Especially for a guy who is in the golf business or retail business who have to routinely work with the EPA on construction projects. You'd think he would be very aware of what the EPA is. 

The making it up and then trying to sound competent at it. That didn't look too good for those who are looking for him to look presidential. 

Quote

But he went on: “Department of Environmental, I mean, the DEP is killing us environmentally, it’s just killing our businesses.”

 

14 minutes ago, Braivo said:

My fear is that he is incapable of this expected shift in tone. If that's the case then he is finished. He will not leave a contested convention with the nomination, no way. 

Is this his ego coming into play? Was the expectation to see if he could get this train rolling and then just glide into the convention? I wonder if he ever had a plan to deviate from this outlandish character he is playing. 

I think the less outlandish he plays it the more he has to know his stuff. He just doesn't know his stuff right now. 

16 minutes ago, Braivo said:

Make no mistake, Kasich is being paid to stay in the race simply to suck delegates from Trump, that's it. There is no other reason for him to be there. 

I'm not sure about that. 

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/03/john-kasich-contested-convention-insiders-220946

I know your opinion on polls. Still, many in important positions believe in them. Kasich is the only candidate that can claim to have been consistently polled as the candidate that can beat Clinton. 

In a contested convention this might be a big pull for Kasich if he can market himself well there. Let Cruz and Trump demolish themselves and then slide in under the radar. I think if he lost Ohio he was out. Winning Ohio lets him market that as well during the general election. If you can take Ohio that is big. 

Just saying, he has a lot of appeal at a contested convention. 

 

[Dave2512]

Kasich is a dreamer that thinks riding it out to the convention gives him a chance nothing more. He knows Trump can't get to 1237. Reality is Trump's early success baffled everybody and Kasich's hopes are when the dust settles delegates will push forth someone presidential. He is the republican candidate that can claim that. 

[StevenR84]

The problem with Kasich is that he is just overshadowed by the other circus performers running. He is by far the only republican I would even think of voting for, and might vote for over Hillary (if she wins). He's level headed and he's the only one who when he talks about birth control/abortion doesn't make women everywhere hate him. The republicans shot themselves in the foot when they held 2 debates because 17 idiots thought they were qualified, some of whom will never sniff the nom, but will keep running (what kind of scam is Mike Huckabee running that he can run for president every 4 years?). They have no focus as a party and are just so scattered. Dems gave hillary and she was the overwhelming choice a year ago. It's amazing what Bernie has been able to do in such a small fragment of time, between support and fundraising he's turning into a machine.

[Mr. Desmond]

1 minute ago, StevenR84 said:

The problem with Kasich is that he is just overshadowed by the other circus performers running. He is by far the only republican I would even think of voting for, and might vote for over Hillary (if she wins). He's level headed and he's the only one who when he talks about birth control/abortion doesn't make women everywhere hate him. The republicans shot themselves in the foot when they held 2 debates because 17 idiots thought they were qualified, some of whom will never sniff the nom, but will keep running (what kind of scam is Mike Huckabee running that he can run for president every 4 years?). They have no focus as a party and are just so scattered. Dems gave hillary and she was the overwhelming choice a year ago. It's amazing what Bernie has been able to do in such a small fragment of time, between support and fundraising he's turning into a machine.

Kasich - waiting for a brokered convention and recognition that he is the only candidate with a high probability of winning a general election. He has re-made himself. Apparently, he has a bad temper and can cut people to shreds, but has either had a St Paul moment - saw the light - or is keeping it all in check, or a combo.

Wild card will be Trump getting on the ballot in some states as a 3rd party candidate if he is not the nominee -- BUT he has a mini organization and I doubt if they've thought that far ahead.

Cruz - strategist with a smart organization, but it's Ted's way or no way, and let's face it, he is creepy and obviously underhanded. Any guy who starts off saying "my opponent's position is ...." and then fictionalizes his opponent's positions is not worth trusting. On this point, Donalid and I agree. He is lyin' Ted. At his core, Cruz is supposedly an Evangelist. All we need to do is look around and see what religion has done to politics over the last 16 years. Nothing gets done to advance the business of the country. Mired in social issues.. .

[Braivo]

22 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

I think he needs to study a bit. Not knowing what the EPA was is big. Especially for a guy who is in the golf business or retail business who have to routinely work with the EPA on construction projects. You'd think he would be very aware of what the EPA is. 

The making it up and then trying to sound competent at it. That didn't look too good for those who are looking for him to look presidential. 

 

Is this his ego coming into play? Was the expectation to see if he could get this train rolling and then just glide into the convention? I wonder if he ever had a plan to deviate from this outlandish character he is playing. 

I think the less outlandish he plays it the more he has to know his stuff. He just doesn't know his stuff right now. 

I'm not sure about that. 

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/03/john-kasich-contested-convention-insiders-220946

I know your opinion on polls. Still, many in important positions believe in them. Kasich is the only candidate that can claim to have been consistently polled as the candidate that can beat Clinton. 

In a contested convention this might be a big pull for Kasich if he can market himself well there. Let Cruz and Trump demolish themselves and then slide in under the radar. I think if he lost Ohio he was out. Winning Ohio lets him market that as well during the general election. If you can take Ohio that is big. 

Just saying, he has a lot of appeal at a contested convention. 

 

Good point, Kasich might sneak through because he is staying underneath the blood bath for now. He is probably more electable in the GE than Cruz, I honestly don't know how anyone likes Cruz, I have yet to meet anyone that is a Cruz supporter beyond "anti-Trump" reasons. 

As for Trump, yes, he is unprepared when it comes to real issues of substance. He would do well to listen to his advisers (especially Sessions) and get up to speed on important issues.

After reading some this weekend I now believe he never intended or expected his candidacy to get this far, he never prepared for the next step because he never thought it would happen, now he is slow to adjust to the new landscape he finds himself in. Not good.

20 minutes ago, Dave2512 said:

Kasich is a dreamer that thinks riding it out to the convention gives him a chance nothing more. He knows Trump can't get to 1237 so he is riding it out. Reality is Trump's early success baffled everybody and Kasich's hopes are when the dust settles delegates will push forth someone presidential. He is the republican candidate that can claim that. 

Maybe he is the smart one. 

14 minutes ago, StevenR84 said:

The problem with Kasich is that he is just overshadowed by the other circus performers running. He is by far the only republican I would even think of voting for, and might vote for over Hillary (if she wins). He's level headed and he's the only one who when he talks about birth control/abortion doesn't make women everywhere hate him. The republicans shot themselves in the foot when they held 2 debates because 17 idiots thought they were qualified, some of whom will never sniff the nom, but will keep running (what kind of scam is Mike Huckabee running that he can run for president every 4 years?). They have no focus as a party and are just so scattered. Dems gave hillary and she was the overwhelming choice a year ago. It's amazing what Bernie has been able to do in such a small fragment of time, between support and fundraising he's turning into a machine.

Perhaps Kasich gets the nod at a convention. Might be the least controversial pick that saves face for a lot of folks. 

[Dave2512]

Ted is creepy no doubt. He's got the neighbor that peeks through the curtains vibe. 

[Braivo]

3 minutes ago, Mr. Desmond said:

Wild card will be Trump getting on the ballot in some states as a 3rd party candidate if he is not the nominee -- BUT he has a mini organization and I doubt if they've thought that far ahead.

It'll never happen. Trump has already spent more of his own money than he ever intended. He won't finance a failing 3rd party run. 

[StevenR84]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Desmond said:

At his core, Cruz is supposedly an Evangelist. All we need to do is look around and see what religion has done to politics over the last 16 years. Nothing gets done to advance the business of the country. Mired in social issues.. .

Which i think is hilarious when they start talking about religion and then how socialism is such a terrible thing. I may be wrong but that Jesus guy was a scoialist jew, kind of like someone else...(this is not say that Bernie is Jesus, just a similarity)

[saevel25]

1 minute ago, Mr. Desmond said:

Kasich - waiting for a brokered convention and recognition that he is the only candidate with a high probability of winning a general election. He has re-made himself. Apparently, he has a bad temper and can cut people to shreds, but has either had a St Paul moment - saw the light - or is keeping it all in check, or a combo.

There was an interesting story about him on his temper. When he was in congress in the mid-late 90's he was a pit bull and had to be reigned in a bit. He also has gone off on a few people while being governor. 

2 minutes ago, Mr. Desmond said:

Cruz - strategist with a smart organization, but it's Ted's way or no way, and let's face it, he is creepy and obviously underhanded. 

He is so creepy. Can't you picture him on some used car lot waiting to sell you a lemon. 

 

[Mr. Desmond]

Just now, Braivo said:

It'll never happen. Trump has already spent more of his own money than he ever intended. He won't finance a failing 3rd party run. 

I don't think he has the organization to strategize for it, and I think you are correct - he won't finance a failure if he thinks bottom line; it would be out of spite to ensure Hillary gets the win.

[Dave2512]

2 minutes ago, Braivo said:

It'll never happen. Trump has already spent more of his own money than he ever intended. He won't finance a failing 3rd party run. 

I don't know about that. He's approached this like a tent show from day one. 

[StevenR84]

Just now, Mr. Desmond said:

I don't think he has the organization to strategize for it, and I think you are correct - he won't finance a failure if he thinks bottom line; it would be out of spite to ensure Hillary gets the win.

You've never been to Atlantic City where he has financed at least 2 failures haha. Also Trump is only financing about 70% of the campaign himself in the form of loans, not even his own cash.

[Braivo]

2 minutes ago, Dave2512 said:

I don't know about that. He's approached this like a tent show from day one. 

I have read his books and understand how he works to an extent. He is a very frugal guy when it comes to business. He has invested very little in this campaign, he relies on outrageous statements getting him news coverage in place of running ads. He has only 94 paid campaign staffers (compared to hundreds for Hillary). It is basically a miniature campaign. He has no reserves to fall back on. He was hoping to get nom quickly then get the establishment backing for the GE. 

If he runs third party it will be a circus and nothing more.