Bogey Golfers Only (Index 16-22) / Breaking 90 Topic

[Russtopher]

If you have distance & accuracy with 3/4 swing, why not?  I've seen pros use 3/4 swing (or other partial swing) more than half of their shots.  One pro golfer I know hits 70% of shots with less than full swing.

Definitely agreed. Plus, what to a lot of us bogey golfers feels like a 3/4 is actually a *correct* swing, since a lot of us (and I count myself in that group) overswing. Arm runoff after the shoulders stop turning, club past parallel, trying to swing out of our shoes, etc. I was videoing myself doing what I thought was a 9 to 3 swing, but when I looked at it on camera it looked more like a "regular" backswing.

[AmazingWhacker]

Definitely agreed. Plus, what to a lot of us bogey golfers feels like a 3/4 is actually a *correct* swing, since a lot of us (and I count myself in that group) overswing. Arm runoff after the shoulders stop turning, club past parallel, trying to swing out of our shoes, etc. I was videoing myself doing what I thought was a 9 to 3 swing, but when I looked at it on camera it looked more like a "regular" backswing.

The arm-runoff is the big thing I noticed.  My shoulders only turn so far . . .and when they stop my club is well short of parallel.  I can get my club to parallel . .but my shoulders aren't turning anymore . .which causes all kinds of grief.  Still it was sort of upsetting the day I realized both that my shoulders should keep turning and that they are not able to.

I experience the same in the downswing.  My body just doesn't turn fast enough going forward, either . .and my hands outrace my body again in the follow through.  So now I have this very short backswing and an Arnold Palmer type follow-through . .not the very young Arnold Palmer either but the getting-on-in-years Arnie.

I'm playing the best actual golf of my life, though . .which has also made me confront the whole reason I'm on the golf course . .am I here to hit it far or to shoot low scores?  Honestly . .the jury is still out on that one, lol.

[jetsknicks1]

Yeah, it's kind of funny that the USGA created guidelines for our enjoyment of the game, then most of us use the furthest tees to make ourselves miserable.:-$

We all wanna think we're better than we are. :-D

[rkim291968]

.which has also made me confront the whole reason I'm on the golf course . .am I here to hit it far or to shoot low scores?  Honestly . .the jury is still out on that one, lol.

You are on the course to have fun!  That's the ultimate goal.

[rkim291968]

Definitely agreed. Plus, what to a lot of us bogey golfers feels like a 3/4 is actually a *correct* swing, since a lot of us (and I count myself in that group) overswing. Arm runoff after the shoulders stop turning, club past parallel, trying to swing out of our shoes, etc. I was videoing myself doing what I thought was a 9 to 3 swing, but when I looked at it on camera it looked more like a "regular" backswing.

Once I recorded my swing thinking I wasn't turning my body enough and my club is not parallel at the top.   When I saw the video, my club head at the top went beyond parallel and pointing downward.  My arms were bent to (over)compensate for lack of body turn .

[Lihu]

We all wanna think we're better than we are.

That's a part of it, for sure.

I think most people hooked on golf are looking for continuous improvements. They do it because it is a challenge and enjoy watching themselves improve. So, the obvious thing to do to improve is to challenge yourself beyond your normal standards. The general thinking might be something like playing a harder set of tees makes it easier when you go back to the easier set of tees.

For many other sports that mentality works, like playing a much harder opponent in tennis, sprinting uphill, training with weights, etc.

However, golf does not seem to be something scalable like that because it is not simply an action/reaction sport.

[rkim291968]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

Yeah, it's kind of funny that the USGA created guidelines for our enjoyment of the game, then most of us use the furthest tees to make ourselves miserable.

We all wanna think we're better than we are.

I am better than I am.   Therefore, I am bogey golfer.

[dave s]

My middle game sucks to the point it's killing me EVERY time out!  I've faced some facts:

1. I'm not going to drive the ball 250+.  It's just not going to happen.  So I'm content to put my drives in play at 200-230 on a real 'bomb.'  I can fade, draw and hit a straight driver.  This part of the game makes complete sense to me for some reason.

2. A decent short game is always the best way to keep one 'in the ball game,' so to speak.  I don't 3-putt very often, I get up and down around 50% of the time and have an overall pretty good short game.  Good distance control, can hit pitches high and soft or low and stop on a dime.

3. The middle game and why it's so difficult for me to hit a solid 7-iron, 5-hybrid or even a scoring wedge club more than 50% of the time is completely puzzling.  And it's killing my game.

Last round this season, I resorted to hitting 7-irons as layup shots even on some of the longer par-4s because it was a better strategy than rolling a 5-hybrid on the par-4s or an even longer club on the par 5s.  The other puzzling aspect of the mid-range game is I usually make good club selection and put a good swing on par-3 shots.  Par 3s ranging from 120 - 170 are usually makeable par holes for me.

Put a ball in the middle of the fairway with the requirement of hitting the next shot 140-200 yards and my success rate is about 10% for even making anything close to solid contact and getting an 80% effective result.

Time for some lessons this coming spring.

dave

[Lihu]

Put a ball in the middle of the fairway with the requirement of hitting the next shot 140-200 yards and my success rate is about 10% for even making anything close to solid contact and getting an 80% effective result.

There is no "requirement" to hit it 140 to 200 yards. If you can just get it closer, it seems like you should have a good chance for an up and down. That's where good accuracy with a 50-70 yard pitch shot is nice to have.

[rkim291968]

My middle game sucks to the point it's killing me EVERY time out!  I've faced some facts:

1. I'm not going to drive the ball 250+.  It's just not going to happen.  So I'm content to put my drives in play at 200-230 on a real 'bomb.'  I can fade, draw and hit a straight driver.  This part of the game makes complete sense to me for some reason.

2. A decent short game is always the best way to keep one 'in the ball game,' so to speak.  I don't 3-putt very often, I get up and down around 50% of the time and have an overall pretty good short game.  Good distance control, can hit pitches high and soft or low and stop on a dime.

3. The middle game and why it's so difficult for me to hit a solid 7-iron, 5-hybrid or even a scoring wedge club more than 50% of the time is completely puzzling.  And it's killing my game.

Last round this season, I resorted to hitting 7-irons as layup shots even on some of the longer par-4s because it was a better strategy than rolling a 5-hybrid on the par-4s or an even longer club on the par 5s.  The other puzzling aspect of the mid-range game is I usually make good club selection and put a good swing on par-3 shots.  Par 3s ranging from 120 - 170 are usually makeable par holes for me.

Put a ball in the middle of the fairway with the requirement of hitting the next shot 140-200 yards and my success rate is about 10% for even making anything close to solid contact and getting an 80% effective result.

Time for some lessons this coming spring.

dave

I could have written this myself verbatim.  I'd hit a perfect 3i and follow it up with a 6i shank.   I rarely OB with driver in hand.  Not so with irons and hybrids.  So, when I go to range, I focus on mid to long irons.   It used to be the other way around (bad driving, and good iron game) when I was at 12 HI.   Sigh.

[inthehole]

I could have written this myself verbatim.  I'd hit a perfect 3i and follow it up with a 6i shank.   I rarely OB with driver in hand.  Not so with irons and hybrids.  So, when I go to range, I focus on mid to long irons.   It used to be the other way around (bad driving, and good iron game) when I was at 12 HI.   Sigh.

No fooling - me too !    It's the middle clubs that kill me - based on another thread, I'm dedicating my practice next year to this aspect of my game which will greatly improve GIR's, which is apparently where it's at.   Putting is what it is ... good and bad days (mostly bad), but the mid/long irons are an area where I know I can improve if I put in the time

[AmazingWhacker]

I was just about to post that I surprisingly have no issue with mid game and then I read that bit about "GIR".  I always miss the green . .well, almost always.  I usually get close .. but not on.  Practicing distance control seems like one of the hardest things for weekend golfers to do . .even when I go to the range and hit to the 100 yard, 150 yard targets, etc . .well . .those are range balls, the tee at my range is way elevated and there is almost always a strong head-wind, etc.

So I basically accept that, from 140 plus, I'm going to miss the green almost all the time.  I usually make good contact and all . .but end up just short, long, left or right, etc.  If you're flubbing a 7iron from the fairway but not off the tee then perhaps you're putting too much pressure on yourself?  I will look at a small green 150 yards away and think "no way can I hit that" - there have been times when I've felt intimidated just standing over that shot.  But I try not to think about hitting it . . just getting close enough to have  good chance of getting up and down.

[Lihu]

I was just about to post that I surprisingly have no issue with mid game and then I read that bit about "GIR".  I always miss the green . .well, almost always.  I usually get close .. but not on.  Practicing distance control seems like one of the hardest things for weekend golfers to do . .even when I go to the range and hit to the 100 yard, 150 yard targets, etc . .well . .those are range balls, the tee at my range is way elevated and there is almost always a strong head-wind, etc.

So I basically accept that, from 140 plus, I'm going to miss the green almost all the time.  I usually make good contact and all . .but end up just short, long, left or right, etc.  If you're flubbing a 7iron from the fairway but not off the tee then perhaps you're putting too much pressure on yourself?  I will look at a small green 150 yards away and think "no way can I hit that" - there have been times when I've felt intimidated just standing over that shot.  But I try not to think about hitting it . . just getting close enough to have  good chance of getting up and down.

This is my feeling too.

If you can chip from 20 yards and in as reliably as you can putt long, it seems like you should make a few pars.

[rkim291968]

The worst part of this is that I know what a good swing is and can repeat it.   But when I am in field, I get absentminded about the next swing (some says this is good) and hit a lousy one.  I am trying to build a muscle memory of a good swing so that I can be absentminded and still hit well.   Couple of days ago, I hit some balls with my eyes closed to see where I am at with muscle memory.  Sure enough, I missed more than I connected.

[Lihu]

The worst part of this is that I know what a good swing is and can repeat it.   But when I am in field, I get absentminded about the next swing (some says this is good) and hit a lousy one.  I am trying to build a muscle memory of a good swing so that I can be absentminded and still hit well.   Couple of days ago, I hit some balls with my eyes closed to see where I am at with muscle memory.  Sure enough, I missed more than I connected.

I presume that you had your eyes open during setup? Otherwise, I see it as a minor miracle that you hit any of them, or didn't end up creeping over to the next stall.

Seriously, I try to keep my head still by locking my eyes/head on the ball. I think this is Key 1 of the 5SK. http://thesandtrap.com/t/55426/introducing-five-simple-keys

[rkim291968]

I presume that you had your eyes open during setup? Otherwise, I see it as a minor miracle that you hit any of them, or didn't end up creeping over to the next stall.

Seriously, I try to keep my head still by locking my eyes/head on the ball. I think this is Key 1 of the 5SK. http://thesandtrap.com/t/55426/introducing-five-simple-keys

In my absentmindedness, sometimes, I don't keep my eyes on the ball through impact.  My recent lower neck, upper back problem made this worse.  As I lost a bit of my neck's side to side mobility, I could not keep my eyes on the ball through impact.

[Lihu]

In my absentmindedness, sometimes, I don't keep my eyes on the ball through impact.  My recent lower neck, upper back problem made this worse.  As I lost a bit of my neck's side to side mobility, I could not keep my eyes on the ball through impact.

What about shortening your swing, and rotating about the spine rather than swaying side to side to prevent the painful side motion to the neck?

[jbro06]

I second this. You miss a fairway, but not by much, you can still make GIR. GIR is a much better indicator of scoring than fairways hit.

I agree GIR regulation is a fantastic way to keep your scores low, however do you know how much harder that is to do when you are not in a position to make a play for the green...  Can you still make GIR from the rough, sure, i do it intentionally sometimes to take shortcuts. But what im saying is that it makes hitting GIR "easier" if you can keep it in the fairway (and fairway for those of us non-professional types = Fairway+first cut).

When you are not in tall grass the clubs do all the work as opposed to trying to power through the rough stuff...

Ball strike is cleaner.

Aiming is more precise.

Clubs play closer to correct yardage.

People underestimate the effects the rough can have on your shot. I mean hell thats its sole purpose, and to not avoid it at all costs would be the equivalent of not trying to walk into an ambush on the battlefield.