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How Fred Couples, Vijay and Hank Kuehne go rid of their back pain

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 

We've been hearing that Freddy makes trips to Germany to see a doctor that has done wonders for his back pain.  He played a full schedule last year, something I don't think he's done in a while and was pain free until towards the end of '11.  Here is more information on the process from this article about Hank Kuehne playing professional golf again/

 

 

Quote:

That’s when Kuehne, at the urging of his father, visited Dr. Peter Wehling in Dusseldorf, Germany, where a method of blood spinning — small samples of blood are spun in a centrifuge to increase the concentration of growth hormones, calcium and enzyme thrombin are added and the sample is injected into the wound — was applied to Kuehne’s spine.

Wehling is the same doctor who healed the notoriously bad backs of Fred Couples and Vijay Singh.

 

post #2 of 15

Tiger had that done to his knee as well.

post #3 of 15
Procedure with unproven benefit, not covered by insurance, not FDA approved, with significant risk. There are a few human studies with low "n" subject numbers. (none of the spine PRP studies have been placebo controlled or blinded)

Intradiscal Injection of Autologous Serum Isolated From Platelet‐Rich‐Plasma for the Treatment of Discogenic Low Back Pain: Preliminary Prospective Clinical Trial: Gp141
Akeda, Koji1; Imanishi, Takao1; Ohishi, Kohshi2; Masuda, Koichi3; Uchida, Atsumasa4; Sakakibara, Toshihiko5; Kasai, Yuichi5; Sudo, Akihiro1

Free Access
Author Information
1Mie University Graduate School of Medicine, Orthopaedic Surgery, Tsu, Japan; 2Mie University Hospital, Transfusion Service, Tsu, Japan; 3University of California, San Diego, Orthopaedic Surgery, La Jolla, US; 4Mie University, Tsu, Japan; 5Mie University Graduate School of Medicine, Spinal Surgery and Medical Engineering, Tsu, Japan

INTRODUCTION: The treatment of degenerative disc disease is one of the most challenging clinical problems facing the spine surgeon. Activated platelets are known to release several kinds of growth factors that contribute to tissue repair. Serum isolated from platelet‐rich‐plasma (PRP‐serum) has recently been demonstrated to influence the metabolism of intervertebral discs in vitro and in vivo. Based on a preclinical study, we performed a preliminary clinical trial to determine the safety and efficacy of an intradiscal injection of autologous PRP‐serum in patients with discogenic low back pain.METHODS: Inclusion criteria for this study included chronic low back pain without leg pain for more than 3 months; one or more lumbar discs (L3/L4 to L5/S1) with evidence of degenerative changes on magnetic resonance imaging (MRI); and at least one symptomatic disc confirmed using standardized provocative discography. PRPserum, isolated from clotted PRP, was injected (2.0 ml) into the center of the nucleus pulposus. Outcome measures included the visual analog scale (VAS), Roland‐Morris Disability Questionnaire (RDQ), X‐ray and MRI (T2‐quantification).RESULTS: Data were analyzed from 6 patients (3 men, 3 women; mean age 34.4 years‐old) who had completed 6 months follow‐up. After treatment, no patient showed adverse events or significant narrowing of disc height. The mean pain score before treatment was significantly decreased at one month (VAS score: 7.1±1.2 to 1.8±2.0, p<0.01; RDQ score: 11±1.8 to 3.2±2.4, p<0.01); this was sustained for six months after treatment. The mean T2 values did not change significantly after treatment (p=0.18).DISCUSSION: The intradiscal injection of autologous PRP‐serum in patients with low back pain has been shown to be safe and effective for six months after treatment. Future long‐term follow‐up and/or randomized control studies should be performed to evaluate the effects of this therapy.
© 2011 Lippincott Williams & Wilkins, Inc.
post #4 of 15

Wonder if they have a doctor in the Bay Area that can do that. I recently just got an inversion table to see if it helps my back pain, which it does but I don't think it will be a permanent fix. 

post #5 of 15

I need something too!  I fractured two vertebrae in my lower back when I was 15...a 40+ year old man took my legs out from under me because I stole the ball from him twice in a pick up basketball game...not kidding.  If my vertebrae would have detached I would have been paralyzed.  So I will have lower back pain for my entire life.   I also have two bulging disks in my neck from a car accident years back...it took years to surface, but last year my whole left arm basically went dead and I had shooting pains that would make Chuck Norris cry.   My doctor advised me to buy a Comfortrac Home cervical traction device that has worked wonders...But I am still going to be a miserable old man.  Cuz I'm not gonna stop golfing anytime soon!

 

 

post #6 of 15

I have degenerative disc between L2, L3, L4, and L5. I just recieved 2 spinal epideral shots and will get 2 more next friday. My back hasn't felt this good in some time. Now the shots didn't repair anything, but they will allow me to rehab and strenghten the core muscles which will aid in disc recovery.

 

post #7 of 15
Yes, epidural steroid injections are a safe procedure (in trained hands), FDA approved, cost effective, covered by insurance, proven to work in placebo controlled blinded studies for radicular neck and back pain (neck pain radiating down the arm/ back pain radiating down the leg) Cervical traction via Comfortrack or even $15 over the door cervical traction and lumbar traction via inversion tables can be effective for many.

You are spot on azgreg. The greatest benefit of the epidural is to enable the patient to tolerate more neck and back strengthening/stabilization exercises. Steroids do cause tissue atrophy and help "shrink" the disc/osteophyte complex compressing nerve roots.

Depending on the etiology/pain generators/pathology; other effective non surgical FDA approved procedures include facet injections and rhizotomy.
post #8 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhwmusic View Post

" ... I also have two bulging disks in my neck from a car accident years back...it took years to surface, ..."

 



Just curious, how were you able to trace the problem back to the car accident?  I only ask because I have the same problem in my lower back (L3/L4 and L4/L5) but have no idea what the origin is.  I just assume and tell people that it is from a combination of years of sports (football, baseball, golf, hockey) and bad posture.  Hmmm..

 

I have had a handful of epidural steroid injections, each lasting anywhere from 8 months to 2 years, but the last time I went to the Dr., he sent me to physical therapy instead.  It has worked just as well, if not better that the injections and lasted just as long.  I just gotta keep up with the exercises.

 

post #9 of 15
Is this the same thing Kobe Bryant had done?
post #10 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post



Just curious, how were you able to trace the problem back to the car accident?  I only ask because I have the same problem in my lower back (L3/L4 and L4/L5) but have no idea what the origin is.  I just assume and tell people that it is from a combination of years of sports (football, baseball, golf, hockey) and bad posture.  Hmmm..

 

I have had a handful of epidural steroid injections, each lasting anywhere from 8 months to 2 years, but the last time I went to the Dr., he sent me to physical therapy instead.  It has worked just as well, if not better that the injections and lasted just as long.  I just gotta keep up with the exercises.

 


I guess I can't say 100% for sure...but I was in two violent car accidents where the car I was in was hit from behind. One I was bending over to tie my shoes in the passenger seat and basically spider webbed the windshield with my forehead. And then I was in another where I was in the back of a PT Cruiser and got hit by I a work truck from behind. Its a small trunk but that that trunk was on top of me and i had to crawl out from underneath it. Both times we were at a dead stop. The first accident happened when I was 17 and the second when I was 26...I am 32 now. Numbness in arm started when i was 30...I think.

It is both my doctor's and my opinion that the all the sports played as a kid (like you I played EVERYTHING) and the multiple car accidents probably started the problem way back when. And all the golf, guitar playing, sitting at a computer and poor posture finally caused the nerve to pinch. I felt it slowly happening but didn't really pay much attention to it. After my fracturing the two vertebrae when I was 15, my pain threshold has never been the same. That injury was so painful that it takes a lot for me to really feel like I am hurt. So nagging injuries are just something that I have been used to. I have always played through the pain. I also chose physical therapy and home traction over the injections. I should probably just get the injections but as long as I keep up with the stretching and traction, I feel pretty good. But if I am don't keep up with the traction, I slowly get the pain in my left arm and fingers start going numb. I also bought this pillow called the "Arc for Life" that has made a big difference...google it...it gives you a mild form of traction while you sleep...and as actually pretty comfortable. Took a bit to get used to, but I love it. Wouldn't really do anything for lower back pain but if you have any neck pain at all, it will help. I have tried everything too.
post #11 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamo View Post

Is this the same thing Kobe Bryant had done?

With HIPAA, patient specific information is confidential. Due to more literature support relative to spine PRP, there are plenty of doctors performing PRP knee, hip, and shoulder injections in the USA. Not sure why so many athletes are going overseas or to Canada for hip, knee, or shoulder injections, assuming they are simply receiving PRP therapy.
post #12 of 15

im not saying this is for everyone but this has helped me the last year or so keeping back pain away. this was after 3 epidurals to rid the pain.

 

http://www.healingbackpain.com/

post #13 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhwmusic View Post


I guess I can't say 100% for sure...but I was in two violent car accidents where the car I was in was hit from behind. One I was bending over to tie my shoes in the passenger seat and basically spider webbed the windshield with my forehead. And then I was in another where I was in the back of a PT Cruiser and got hit by I a work truck from behind. Its a small trunk but that that trunk was on top of me and i had to crawl out from underneath it. Both times we were at a dead stop. The first accident happened when I was 17 and the second when I was 26...I am 32 now. Numbness in arm started when i was 30...I think.
It is both my doctor's and my opinion that the all the sports played as a kid (like you I played EVERYTHING) and the multiple car accidents probably started the problem way back when. And all the golf, guitar playing, sitting at a computer and poor posture finally caused the nerve to pinch. I felt it slowly happening but didn't really pay much attention to it. After my fracturing the two vertebrae when I was 15, my pain threshold has never been the same. That injury was so painful that it takes a lot for me to really feel like I am hurt. So nagging injuries are just something that I have been used to. I have always played through the pain. I also chose physical therapy and home traction over the injections. I should probably just get the injections but as long as I keep up with the stretching and traction, I feel pretty good. But if I am don't keep up with the traction, I slowly get the pain in my left arm and fingers start going numb. I also bought this pillow called the "Arc for Life" that has made a big difference...google it...it gives you a mild form of traction while you sleep...and as actually pretty comfortable. Took a bit to get used to, but I love it. Wouldn't really do anything for lower back pain but if you have any neck pain at all, it will help. I have tried everything too.



Ouch.  Guess it's pretty safe to say those car accidents were your source (or a giant part of it).  I would say you are better off with your traction and stretching.  The injections (in my case) worked great for varying periods of time.  The problem I had is remembering that its just masking the pain and not curing it, and not bothering with stretches and exercises because I felt so good.  Then inevitably, the pain recurs and I'm back to square one.  With the physical therapy, I am still always dealing with the nagging pain, but it's almost a blessing in disguise to remind me to stick with it.

 

My biggest annoyance now is that I wake up in pain every day and don't feel good until after a little stretching and a hot shower.  (Stupid Tempur Pedic was not quite as amazing as I'd hoped)  No 6:30am golf for me.

 

post #14 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post



Ouch.  Guess it's pretty safe to say those car accidents were your source (or a giant part of it).  I would say you are better off with your traction and stretching.  The injections (in my case) worked great for varying periods of time.  The problem I had is remembering that its just masking the pain and not curing it, and not bothering with stretches and exercises because I felt so good.  Then inevitably, the pain recurs and I'm back to square one.  With the physical therapy, I am still always dealing with the nagging pain, but it's almost a blessing in disguise to remind me to stick with it.

 

My biggest annoyance now is that I wake up in pain every day and don't feel good until after a little stretching and a hot shower.  (Stupid Tempur Pedic was not quite as amazing as I'd hoped)  No 6:30am golf for me.

 


Me too! Tempurpedic didn't really do it for me either...although we just bought the pad to go on top of the bed. And it is amazing how much better I play later in the day. It is almost impossible for me to play well early in the morning. I have to wake up like 2 hours before my tee time to take a long hot shower, heating pad, heavy stretching and so on...I have weighted driver that has helped me loosen up faster. Sucks!!!
post #15 of 15

I would think that Stem cell therapy would be more in vogue since CC sabathia admitted to it. 

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