Jump to content
IGNORED

Grip Strength - Opposites and Compensations Video


Note: This thread is 3849 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

Interesting. Definitely debunks what I would typically think about ball flight as a result of  the grip. Also really liked how you pointed out how much of a difference the grip can make in shoulder and hip angles.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I am absolutely jazzed with this type of info.  THANKS

weak strong - you mean hand position.  not how hard you're squeezing......(((right?)))

Bill - 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Originally Posted by rehmwa

I am absolutely jazzed with this type of info.  THANKS

weak strong - you mean hand position.  not how hard you're squeezing......(((right?)))

Yes.

I almost mentioned this in my first response. I watched a video of Michael Breed giving a lesson in front of other PGA Pros. He went on for a few minutes about how he avoided using the terms "strong" and "weak" (among others) because they mean different things to different people. I think it was a good point.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Quote:
I think it was a good point.

Agree.  But Iacas is alway very good about terminology and what they mean in regards to his lessons.  It's something I appreciate in this forum.  Not everyone is fully in doctrinated in the 'standard' language of the activity so definitions are great for the casual player.

on topic - My thoughts on the topic was along the lines of how my hands move through the impact from the different starting grips, but it never made complete sense - something was missing.  Just the visual of the hand adjustment and how that changed the shoulder alignment at address........light bulb moment.  If you start there, the impact on face angle and club path then becomes very clear.  then the mechanics almost shouts the conclusions to you.

I see it's always a good idea when making any change to look at how that affects the entire body before drawing any theories.  A good lesson.  As well as the idea to particularly start with seeing if and how the setup is affected with any type of adjustment.

Bill - 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator
Originally Posted by BostonBrew

I think it was a good point.

It is. In lessons I'll sometimes say "stronger" but only after I'm 100% certain the person knows what I mean. Before that, even for good players who one can usually assume knows what I mean, I'll say words like "clockwise" or "more to the right" along with demonstrating the positions so that we're very clear. Eventually I work in that it is a "stronger" or "weaker" grip in most people's definitions, so that if they hear the words they're not confused, and so on.

I've yet to find a substitute that I can use exclusively and ditch "strong" and "weak." They're almost the kinds of words that have become so entrenched that it may not be worth the effort of finding "new" words - even if they're "better" - to describe the grip.

Originally Posted by rehmwa

Agree.  But Iacas is alway very good about terminology and what they mean in regards to his lessons.  It's something I appreciate in this forum.  Not everyone is fully in doctrinated in the 'standard' language of the activity so definitions are great for the casual player.

Yeah, I probably could have done definitions in this video - I remember saying at some point that the left and right hand are more on top or underneath, but that's it. In the end I decided against it because the video is already too long.

Originally Posted by rehmwa

on topic - My thoughts on the topic was along the lines of how my hands move through the impact from the different starting grips, but it never made complete sense - something was missing.  Just the visual of the hand adjustment and how that changed the shoulder alignment at address........light bulb moment.  If you start there, the impact on face angle and club path then becomes very clear.  then the mechanics almost shouts the conclusions to you.

Yes, the grip changing the alignments is one thing. It may even be the biggest thing among some people. I think, though, that most people will change things dynamically more so than their setup changes. After all, I'm a reasonably skilled player, so I make some setup compensations because I know what I want to do in the end - start the ball relatively online from a very weak and a very strong grip. A lot of people might make the same setup, but change their swing dynamically (or they will after they duck-hook the first few!).

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Hey Eric, I know you guys did a ton of research when you were putting together a list of commonalities among the best ball strikers. I'm guessing one of the thing you guys examined was grip. It seems to me that almost no player on the tour uses a really weak grip. I could be completely wrong as I haven't studied the data, but what trends did you guys see regarding strong vs weak grips?
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Originally Posted by pholmes

Hey Eric, I know you guys did a ton of research when you were putting together a list of commonalities among the best ball strikers. I'm guessing one of the thing you guys examined was grip. It seems to me that almost no player on the tour uses a really weak grip. I could be completely wrong as I haven't studied the data, but what trends did you guys see regarding strong vs weak grips?

Corey Pavin and Jose Maria Olazabal are both well known for their weak grips.

But I would agree that the majority of Tour players have stronger grips.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Administrator
Originally Posted by pholmes

Hey Erik, I know you guys did a ton of research when you were putting together a list of commonalities among the best ball strikers. I'm guessing one of the thing you guys examined was grip. It seems to me that almost no player on the tour uses a really weak grip. I could be completely wrong as I haven't studied the data, but what trends did you guys see regarding strong vs weak grips?

Tiger Woods (less so since working with Foley).

Ben Hogan.

Grips are maybe a hair strong overall, but it kind of depends on how you view "neutral." You could set "neutral" as the average grip, and then there are plenty of weak grips on the PGA Tour. :)

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Is there a reference somewhere with some pictures of what strong is and what weak is? I used to be very strong but have moved to more neutral. I constantly worry that I am going to end up too weak. Some pictures would be nice.

Michael

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Thanks Eric, this helps me tremendously atm. Im searching my lost usual path, maybe it dissapeared when I switched to a weaker grip 3 weeks ago. My body compensated without me consiously thinking about it! Will try tomorrow.
Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Moderator

I just weakened my RH grip as well about 20-30 degrees. This video would explain why I didn't hit the shanks I expected to. I thought the change would make the face to open up more through impact, but it did the opposite, I didn't really consciously try to close it. With the stronger right hand grip, I would hit the occasional shank because I was holding the face open.

Do any pros or good amateurs mix their grips by hand? For example strong right, weak left or weak right and strong left? I'm guessing a low percentage?

Steve

Kill slow play. Allow walking. Reduce ineffective golf instruction. Use environmentally friendly course maintenance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Originally Posted by nevets88

For example strong right, weak left

I do that when receiving a volleyball.  Does that count?

Bill - 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Moderator

OK, at 9:57 you began talking about a player that starts the ball at target with a slide fade.  You say, "often times the fix for them..."  Then the audio stops.  Then at 10:14 you start with "so then the takeaway from all this is a strong grip will often produce".  What was the fix for the first guy?  Namely me!!!  It's like the missing audio in the Nixon Watergate tapes!  You left me hanging!

Scott

Titleist, Edel, Scotty Cameron Putter, Snell - AimPoint - Evolvr - MirrorVision

My Swing Thread

boogielicious - Adjective describing the perfect surf wave

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

I just weakened my RH grip as well about 20-30 degrees. This video would explain why I didn't hit the shanks I expected to. I thought the change would make the face to open up more through impact, but it did the opposite, I didn't really consciously try to close it. With the stronger right hand grip, I would hit the occasional shank because I was holding the face open. Do any pros or good amateurs mix their grips by hand? For example strong right, weak left or weak right and strong left? I'm guessing a low percentage?

The only guy I've seen do this is chad Campbell, maybe other guys have more examples.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Administrator
Originally Posted by mchepp

Is there a reference somewhere with some pictures of what strong is and what weak is? I used to be very strong but have moved to more neutral. I constantly worry that I am going to end up too weak. Some pictures would be nice.

No, because stronger and weaker will vary for each person. Perhaps I could have done a better job being clear, but it's relative to their current grip. So if they're hitting pulls, the fix may be to go to a stronger grip to force the path and face to be more right-pointing at impact (as they may be compensating for the weak grip by swinging left and rolling the forearms to close the face).

Originally Posted by boogielicious

OK, at 9:57 you began talking about a player that starts the ball at target with a slide fade.  You say, "often times the fix for them..."  Then the audio stops.  Then at 10:14 you start with "so then the takeaway from all this is a strong grip will often produce".  What was the fix for the first guy?  Namely me!!!  It's like the missing audio in the Nixon Watergate tapes!  You left me hanging!

Yeah here's the deal: you'll notice how after the pause I start off by saying "so the takeaway from all of this is…"? I meant to chop that part out, the part to which you're referring. If I was going to continue, I'd say the fix is often going to a slightly stronger grip. But I've removed that portion of the video and re-posted it (or I will have done so by the time you read this).

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Note: This thread is 3849 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...