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Iron fitting wisdom needed

post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 
Went to get fitted the other day on the mizuno machine, swing speed with 7 iron with the monitor attached was 78-80-78=79, tempo 4-4-4=4, can't remember the rest. But it put me right between R and SR. It gave me a few shaft options. But those didn't take into account my ball Flight preference.

I would prefer if my flight was higher, as I can always lower it myself with technique but it's tougher for me to raise the ball flight.

Being right between stiff-regular and regular, I would prefer to err on the stiffer side as my swing will probably only get faster as I'm 25. But there aren't SR shafts, at least that I'm aware of...

Should I look into hard stepping some regular shafts (taking some length off the tip of a regular shaft) or soft stepping (taking length off of the butt of a stiff shaft)? I was told by my fitter that I should get my next shafts 1/4" short (I'm 5'9") so this could be two birds with one stone. Especially since I'll be buying used and won't be ordering shafts from the factory. Three birds if you factor in New grips also.

I like the performance of the NS pro 105T Regular. But I like that the XP95 is lighter, though I haven't tried it. I have a graphite stiff shafted 7 iron that I really feel I can swing fast, but I don't want to go Graphite. Should I soft step a XP95 S300? I would like the flex to end up as stiff-regular, and yield a high launch. Lighter and somewhat less stiff than stiff could get me to SR, yeah? Or should I just go XP95 R300 just to be sure I get high launch? Remember, I was right on the line between regular and regular stiff on the mizuno machine, not including flight preference.

I should also mention that I'm always drawing or hooking the ball, and sometimes I even hit behind the ball. He noted that my hands are lower at impact than they are before takeaway. And that I'm hitting 1-2 degrees Upright because of it. And that I'm crowding the ball... Bare with me... Would shortening the shafts fix any of this? I choke up on almost every Club in my bag so that's not why my impact is upright. I would just hate to get 1 degree flat 1/4" short shafted clubs just to never covered up the swing problem.

Also, is a putter length of 34" pretty standard for someone my height? 34"is comfortable for me, 35" I'm choking too much. 33" haven't tried.

And for the ball, he told me any 3 piece would be good, recommending the Callaway SR-1 and the Taylormade project a ball. Balls are more a feel and confidence-inspiring thing more than anything else, but I just wanted to see if we had any opinions here.

I'm super glad I got fitted. Just wish I would have spent more time going over details. Any help would be MUCH appreciated!
post #2 of 12

post and a half!!! but getting fitted is always a very good idea

 

I would errr towards stiff shafts, as you say your 25, determined to get better and if your spending the time/money to get fitted you will only get better, 

 

i dont see the point of going half way now, to then in 1-2 years be at a point where stiff shafts would suite you better and your spending another wodge of money getting new shafts

 

My swing speed is about the same as yours, and im 5'9 so i have mine 2 degrees flatter, although i use standard length clubs i could probably be better off with 1/4 shorter, but my fitter put me with regular shafts and although my distance improved dramatically my accuracy faltered and it just didnt feel right, i felt like less in control, we switched to stiff shafts and accuracy improved, although distance suffered slightly

 

pays ya monies takes ya pic i guess

post #3 of 12

Some Mizuno fitting expert may be able to chime in with a definitive answer, but I would think that "regular stiff" would equate simply to "stiff" with most shafts.  This, as opposed to the "Tour X Stiff" extra stiff shafts that you see sometimes.  Most of the information I have seen on "regular flex" and "stiff flex" is based on a range of swing speeds and there isn't a hard dividing line, but rather a pretty good size overlapping area in the middle.  It is my understanding that a more flexible shaft will tend to promote a higher ball flight as a generality, though where in the shaft the flex point is can also have a huge effect. 

 

My feeling is that if you are 25 and buying some used clubs you are going to re-shaft with the intent of improving your game, I wouldn't be thinking so much about using components you can "grow into" in a year, but rather components that will help you the most NOW.  This also extends to heads.  Your profile says 15 handicap.  That ain't bad!  But it doesn't suggest you are ready for "players" clubs either.

 

Quote:
I should also mention that I'm always drawing or hooking the ball, and sometimes I even hit behind the ball. He noted that my hands are lower at impact than they are before takeaway. And that I'm hitting 1-2 degrees Upright because of it. And that I'm crowding the ball... Bare with me... Would shortening the shafts fix any of this? I choke up on almost every Club in my bag so that's not why my impact is upright. I would just hate to get 1 degree flat 1/4" short shafted clubs just to never covered up the swing problem.

 

Perhaps some lessons with a competent pro would be in order?  That person could also very probably help you sort through some of these other questions since he/she will become familiar with your actual swing.

post #4 of 12
Thread Starter 

Based on the fact that a 65i regular flex graphite helps me get a higher clubhead speed and feel where the clubhead is more (I like this), and that I was fitted for regular-stiff, I chose stiff XP95 shafts. The higher speed ill get should offset the fact that they are rated as stiff. And coming from Dynamic Gold shafts, just about anything else should yield higher ball flights.

post #5 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissouriHacker View Post


He noted that my hands are lower at impact than they are before takeaway. And that I'm hitting 1-2 degrees Upright because of it. And that I'm crowding the ball... Bare with me... Would shortening the shafts fix any of this? I choke up on almost every Club in my bag so that's not why my impact is upright. I would just hate to get 1 degree flat 1/4" short shafted clubs just to never covered up the swing problem.

 

Not that it matters, except for my curiosity, but is that a misprint?

 

It's pretty unusual for someone to have their hands lower at impact than at address. If they did the lie angle would likely need to be flatter instead of more upright.

 

Of course it's 4:00 o'clock in the morning so maybe my brain isn't working well yet. :-D

post #6 of 12
Thread Starter 

No typo. He recommended clubs 1-2* flat. But I'm not playing well as it is, hitting behind the ball sometimes because of my angle of attack. I also read that if you're 5'9"-6'1" you need standard spec'd clubs.

post #7 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissouriHacker View Post
 

No typo. He recommended clubs 1-2* flat. But I'm not playing well as it is, hitting behind the ball sometimes because of my angle of attack. I also read that if you're 5'9"-6'1" you need standard spec'd clubs.

 

During my recent fitting, which I am second guessing per my nature, I was told it doesn't matter how tall you are but more how long your arms are in relationship to your height. 

post #8 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian W View Post
 

 

During my recent fitting, which I am second guessing per my nature, I was told it doesn't matter how tall you are but more how long your arms are in relationship to your height. 


Yep. My son and I are the same height and his wrist to floor measurement is 2 inches shorter than mine. His wedges feel like something from Toys Are Us to me, but fit him just fine.

post #9 of 12

My Son is 6'5" has really long arms. Had his TM irons fitted, they are 2 up and 1/2" over, so yeah, height doesn't always play a part in how your clubs fit you. 

post #10 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 

Not that it matters, except for my curiosity, but is that a misprint?

 

It's pretty unusual for someone to have their hands lower at impact than at address. If they did the lie angle would likely need to be flatter instead of more upright.

 

Of course it's 4:00 o'clock in the morning so maybe my brain isn't working well yet. :-D


If you hit the ball with max power, the clubhead is affected by centrifugal force, correct?

 

Centrifugal force pulls the club down and outwards near impact area, near the low point of the swing. This tends to straighten your arms, as the centrifugal force is quite big with fast swing speeds. Chicken wing at impact means to my mind that you use your muscles to pull the club back to your belly.

 

I'm not a pro golfer or even a golf instructor but centrifugal force is easy enough to comprehend (it's not "golf magic" but it's straight-up physics you learn from a book! ):-D

 

If your arms dont straighten / extend near the impact zone, I guess by definition your arms are flexed at impact.

 

You must be fighting against the force with your arm muscles (to keep the arms flexed near impact, you must tighten muscles)

post #11 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by late347 View Post
 


If you hit the ball with max power, the clubhead is affected by centrifugal force, correct?

 

Centrifugal force pulls the club down and outwards near impact area, near the low point of the swing. This tends to straighten your arms, as the centrifugal force is quite big with fast swing speeds. Chicken wing at impact means to my mind that you use your muscles to pull the club back to your belly.

 

I'm not a pro golfer or even a golf instructor but centrifugal force is easy enough to comprehend (it's not "golf magic" but it's straight-up physics you learn from a book! ):-D

 

If your arms dont straighten / extend near the impact zone, I guess by definition your arms are flexed at impact.

 

You must be fighting against the force with your arm muscles (to keep the arms flexed near impact, you must tighten muscles)


It's easy enough to see how many people have their hands higher or lower at impact than they were at address. Just draw a circle around the hands from a DTL view at address and stop the video at impact.

 

Most player's hands are higher at impact, some (especially among better players) get back to the same spot, and a small percentage have the hands lower at impact.

 

In the cases of the better players that have their hands higher at impact it usually has nothing to do with chicken-winging or bending the left arm.

 

Something similar to this at 2:18 is what you'll see with most golfers although it is high for a Tour player.

 


Edited by MS256 - 6/6/14 at 7:30am
post #12 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissouriHacker View Post

Went to get fitted the other day on the mizuno machine, swing speed with 7 iron with the monitor attached was 78-80-78=79, tempo 4-4-4=4, can't remember the rest. But it put me right between R and SR. It gave me a few shaft options. But those didn't take into account my ball Flight preference.

I would prefer if my flight was higher, as I can always lower it myself with technique but it's tougher for me to raise the ball flight.

Being right between stiff-regular and regular, I would prefer to err on the stiffer side as my swing will probably only get faster as I'm 25. But there aren't SR shafts, at least that I'm aware of...

Should I look into hard stepping some regular shafts (taking some length off the tip of a regular shaft) or soft stepping (taking length off of the butt of a stiff shaft)? I was told by my fitter that I should get my next shafts 1/4" short (I'm 5'9") so this could be two birds with one stone. Especially since I'll be buying used and won't be ordering shafts from the factory. Three birds if you factor in New grips also.

I like the performance of the NS pro 105T Regular. But I like that the XP95 is lighter, though I haven't tried it. I have a graphite stiff shafted 7 iron that I really feel I can swing fast, but I don't want to go Graphite. Should I soft step a XP95 S300? I would like the flex to end up as stiff-regular, and yield a high launch. Lighter and somewhat less stiff than stiff could get me to SR, yeah? Or should I just go XP95 R300 just to be sure I get high launch? Remember, I was right on the line between regular and regular stiff on the mizuno machine, not including flight preference.

I should also mention that I'm always drawing or hooking the ball, and sometimes I even hit behind the ball. He noted that my hands are lower at impact than they are before takeaway. And that I'm hitting 1-2 degrees Upright because of it. And that I'm crowding the ball... Bare with me... Would shortening the shafts fix any of this? I choke up on almost every Club in my bag so that's not why my impact is upright. I would just hate to get 1 degree flat 1/4" short shafted clubs just to never covered up the swing problem.

Also, is a putter length of 34" pretty standard for someone my height? 34"is comfortable for me, 35" I'm choking too much. 33" haven't tried.

And for the ball, he told me any 3 piece would be good, recommending the Callaway SR-1 and the Taylormade project a ball. Balls are more a feel and confidence-inspiring thing more than anything else, but I just wanted to see if we had any opinions here.

I'm super glad I got fitted. Just wish I would have spent more time going over details. Any help would be MUCH appreciated!

 

 

1 - I play Mizuno MP-57 with NS Pro 950 stiff shafts.  My 6 iron swing speed during my fitting was ~80 - 82, so similar to you.  A couple of points to consider:

 

For the most part, lighter shafts tend to flex more than heavier shafts from the same company.  Example:  True Temper Dynamic Gold shafts R300 will be equivalent to in between their DG SL R300 and S300.  So the fitter may adjust the shaft by stepping the R300 to increase the tip stiffness.  This is where I was.  I went with the NS Pro and he put me in stiff because this light shaft regular was too flexible for my swing.  I also needed higher launch.

 

For ball flight, Ralph Maltby has this nice code system to describe the shafts verse characteristics.  You can plug in your desired flight and characteristic and get the shaft code.

 

http://ralphmaltby.com/265

 

Then you can look at what shafts have the characteristic by code at  Golf Works.  Below is an example for my shaft.

 

http://www.golfworks.com/product.asp?pn=NP0004

 

There is a search by code in there somewhere too.  So this will give you an idea of the shaft that you want.  If you go the used route, keep that in mind.

 

At your age, I would stay away from graphite shafts (I am 54).  Some other forum members feel that lighter shafts can also cause you to be too fast on takeaway and prefer heavier shafts for that reason.

 

2 - Putter shaft length is more dependent on your putting style and set up than height.  I use a 35.5" putter length and I am 5"10.  I would recommend you try different lengths and see what is most comfortable for you.  Don't let your height be the only factor.

 

3. To select a ball think of the following two things, price you can afford and performance.  Then work from green to tee to select the ball for you, not tee to green.  Start with putting feel, pitch and chip performance, approach shots, then tee shots.  I like the ProV1 and V1x most because they are great around the green and longer approach shots will stick to the green more because of the added spin.  But they are expensive.  At my age, I can afford them.  My son plays the NXT ball.

 

Hope this helps.

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