Hacker or Player

[flopdarock]

i think a person who takes the game seriously and wants to improve is a player regardless of handicap... (even beginners)

i think a hacker is someone who doesnt give a crap and is just there to bat some balls around... or someone who believes he is "player" but never practices or takes lessons and claims a very low handicap except for the day we play and has nothing but excuses for his horrible play

[zeg]

Wow, your mom is harsh!

[Fraser]

Wow, your mom is harsh!

I think it was also an incentive to keep my brother and I out of the house in our teenage years...working on our golf game to win the respect of our mother

[Fourputt]

I don't agree with you personally -- but can't speak for others. I think anyone who is trying, playing by the rules, and attempting to play better is a player. Players respect the game, and I don't really care what their handicap might be. Hacker is a bad word, yes... but I might reserve it for someone who has little respect for others on the course, does not fix divots and ball marks, and takes liberties with the rules and, in general, makes a round uncomfortable for others.

Ahhhhh... a ray of sunshine... a breath of air... and a thoughtful comment. Well met Sir Knight!!!

I agree, a player is a golfer. A golfer respects the game, the course, and the players around him. He plays by the rules as he understands them, and is willing to to learn more when the opportunity presents itself. He truly wants to improve, and is willing to do as much as real life allows him time for to work on his game. A hacker (yeah... demeaning, but descriptive) cares little for any of those things. He's mostly interested in when the beer cart is going to come by again, making lewd comments about any woman he sees, and generally being loud and obnoxious. (Did I just describe a "redneck"??? ) They rip out huge chunks of turf, then laugh as they park the cart on the green apron and take another gulp of Bud before heading over to 5-putt from 10 feet. In between are the whole gamut of casual golfers who are out there to have fun, relax and unwind, but don't really have the passion for the game that the player has. They may generally respect others, but aren't always aware that what they do is irritating. They may not replace every divot, nor repair every ball mark. These golfers have the potential to become players, but they may need a Messiah to lead them to the light.

[mako224]

A hacker is someone who consistantly scores over 90. A real player is someone who consistantly scores mid-80s or lower.
A player has a 10 or less handicap.

[mako224]

Some of these responces read like politically correct psychobable. Kind of like how now with kids sports there are no winners and losers, everybody gets a trophy. Sorry to break it to you but if you can't reach greens in regulation, if you duff it all over the place, if you hold up the group behind because you can't advance the ball, if you can't break 90...90% of the time, YOU ARE A HACKER. I don't care how much you love or respect the game, YOU ARE A HACKER. All of us have been there at one time or another. Get over it and accept it. Improve your game if you don't like me calling you a hacker.

[Fourputt]

Some of these responces read like politically correct psychobable. Kind of like how now with kids sports there are no winners and losers, everybody gets a trophy. Sorry to break it to you but if you can't reach greens in regulation, if you duff it all over the place, if you hold up the group behind because you can't advance the ball, if you can't break 90...90% of the time, YOU ARE A HACKER. I don't care how much you love or respect the game, YOU ARE A HACKER. All of us have been there at one time or another. Get over it and accept it.

I can think of a few choice names to call you too, but they'd likely get me banned. "Politically correct psychobabble"?? I may not be able to get my handicap to single digits, but at least I can use a spell-checker.

Then there are people like you who seem to make a concerted attempt to be politically incorrect. There is a clear difference between a hacker and the less skilled casual golfer. If you can't see that then I feel quite sorry for you. How's that for politically correct??? I know quite a few PLAYERS who can't break 80. They used to, but as they approach 80 (age not score), the scores have gone up as the distance has gone down and the feel has gone away. I guess they're hackers too, even though they use to play a level quite a bit better than you? Lord how I hate people like you. And if that gets me a time out... then so be it.

[zeg]

Get over it and accept it. Improve your game if you don't like me calling you a hacker.

I think it's fair to say nobody here gives a damn what you call us.

The idea that players of different skill levels can and should respect each other is built into the game of golf. What other sport has the concept of handicap so integrated? Look at how those of us who consider "player" to be a description of skill level rate that-- in terms of handicap. The whole purpose is so that lower skill players can compete with those with higher skill. So I don't think it's "politically correct" to pay a little respect to those of us who aren't (or aren't yet) hitting GIRs. I think it's needlessly rude to do otherwise. But, what do I know...

[Fat Slice]

Some of these responces read like politically correct psychobable. Kind of like how now with kids sports there are no winners and losers, everybody gets a trophy. Sorry to break it to you but if you can't reach greens in regulation, if you duff it all over the place, if you hold up the group behind because you can't advance the ball, if you can't break 90...90% of the time, YOU ARE A HACKER. I don't care how much you love or respect the game, YOU ARE A HACKER. All of us have been there at one time or another. Get over it and accept it. Improve your game if you don't like me calling you a hacker.

Padraig Harrington hit 60% GIR, John Riegger hit 70%. Is Padraig more of a "hacker?"

The problem with trying to define a word like this is that it means different things to different people. Your definition of hacker is fine for you. I accept it and have nothing to get over as it doesn't bother me if you think of me as a hacker. My definition of a hacker is different, and no more or less valid.

[NM Golf]

I will probably get dinged for this (especially from fourputt) and I certainly do not mean any disrespect, BUT.......I equate these monikers to ability only. A player is someone who plays very well.

I don't believe how someone acts on the course makes them a player. If you can't break 85 but know all the rules, have good ettiquette and play a lot, then you are a person I would like to play with for sure, but I wouldn't consider you a player. I also wouldn't consider you a hacker by any means either.

I would say anyone that breaks 80 on a very consistant basis is a player. Maybe even better than that. A player is someone who competes for the club championship. A player has the ability to break par every time he tees it up.

I define a hacker as someone who rarely plays can't break 100 on a regular basis and has difficulty getting the ball in the air sometimes.

So as someone else suggested there has to be a third category. A category that gives the average golfer who takes golf seriously and plays a lot but doesn't play at that high of a level his due. I don't know what that category would be, I personally call those guys "good golfers". Because that is what they are. In the scheme of things anyone who breaks 100 on a regular basis is a good golfer.

So get pissed at me for my opinion if you want to, Like I said I certainly mean no disrespect. But to call anyone who shoots above 80 consistantly a player,regardless of how they act, is not correct.

[Fraser]

So as someone else suggested there has to be a third category. A category that gives the average golfer who takes golf seriously and plays a lot but doesn't play at that high of a level his due. I don't know what that category would be, I personally call those guys "good golfers". Because that is what they are. In the scheme of things anyone who breaks 100 on a regular basis is a good golfer.

That's one of the few times my game, or one that sounds like mine, has been referred to as good.

[Eeryck]

At what point does someone graduate from being a hacker to a player?

The nature of this question is prone to make this an argumentative thread. It is ultimately unfair to everyone to propose an either A or B situation for the game of golf where the skill set is so large.

It is nice to see that many have posted responding that being a player or hacker is due to mindset and respect for the game and the course on which it is played. The equipment industry/magazine industry has put certain connotations on the word "player" by labeling certain equipments as "players" irons and the like. Unfortunately this leads many golfers to believe that they need to reach a certain index to have proficient skill to be considered a "player" that is false and only intended to sell more equipment at a later date. There have been times that I have played with a guy in the single digits that did not repair ball marks and did not replace divots. This guy regardless of score is a hacker. Just because he has some athletic ability and time in there is no reason he should be considered a player. Anyway, the question is limited and poorly written though I have gotten sucked in. Cheers, -E

[mirv]

i applied the hacker/player terms to ability on the course as well, but i didn't mean "hacker" as a condescending statement in my previous post, though in retrospect i suppose it could very easily be taken as such. i guess i would rephrase the "levels" as simply being beginner, intermediate, and above average. if hacker is going to have a negative connotation applied to it, then i guess i would go with it being someone who has no respect for the course, doesn't know how to play, breaks clubs, curses, and just generally isn't a very mature nor skilled person on the course.

[Bump-n-MI]

If you have the tools to score well (and do so on a consistent basis) many will deem you a "player". I play with several people that can bomb the ball, have a good short game, and are decent putters (what many would consider a well rounded player) but can't score for sh:t. They do not have the mental aspect of the game down and have the dreaded blow-up holes. I still consider many of these folks "players". Potential means a lot to me when and if I deem somebody a "player".

Some might consider me a "player" (last 10 round posted below), others may consider me a "hack"…..it's all relative based on the abilities of the people you play against.

ScoreRatingSlope
74 68.9 122
80 70.5 127
76 70.5 127
81 73.2 133
78 70.5 127
73 69.2 122
79 69.8 124
79 70.0 117
78 68.9 122
81 68.9 122

[Big_M]

State of mind... definitely!!!

I disagree... it's not so much a state of mind as it is a description of ability.

A hacker can't break 100.

that's about how I think of it.

I'm definitely seeing a trend here. Anyone with a single digit handicap can't seem to stand the thought that those of us who aren't that good could possibly call ourselves players. We have to be second class or worse, and shouldn't have the effrontery to speak of ourselves in the same breath as a

why quit just because your not at a top level... a pro is not a player... a player is a step below pro, and above regular golfer.

Ahhhhh... a ray of sunshine... a breath of air... and a thoughtful comment. Well met Sir Knight!!!

My mom plays on a league called the "Happy Hackers"... why because they are all terrible golfers, but I don't think any of them make lewd comments to cart girls or disrespect the game, they just have no skills and are therefore hackers.

Bottom Line.... I think most people associate the terms hacker and player with ability... meaning a hacker is usually pretty bad 100+ shooter, while a player is someone who is at least single digits. EXAMPLE: If I asked Jeff how good his buddy Bill is at golf and Jeff said "oh he's a player"... then that weekend Bill came out and shot a 95... I would ask Jeff WTH... I thought you said Bill was a "player".

[Big_M]

If you have the tools to score well (and do so on a consistent basis) many will deem you a "player". I play with several people that can bomb the ball, have a good short game, and are decent putters (what many would consider a well rounded player) but can't score for sh:t. They do not have the mental aspect of the game down and have the dreaded blow-up holes. I still consider many of these folks "players". Potential means a lot to me when and if I deem somebody a "player".

yeah... you're pretty lousy... a hacker in my book.

joking where do you play in Michigan... I am from the Metro-Detroit area and missed playing my old courses this year, but not missing the long winter so much.

[walk18]

then you have people who only play the same flat 5900 yd course over and over and they score well there, but couldn't break 100 on a different longer course, so it's kind of skewed that way too. To each their own I guess, it's all relative.

[mako224]

The term Player refers to low or single digit handicappers. Its as simple as that. As for hackers.......If I'm behind you and you are on your 3rd stroke and you are still inside my driver range....you my friend are a hacker.

Perhaps another good definition of hacker would be anybody who plays one stroke or more worse than the person being askedthe question.