Jack vs. Tiger: Who's the Greatest Golfer?

[delav]

"I think tiger is better because

You catch the 2010 Quail Hollow?

[The Recreational Golfer]

I saw Jack several times, including 1962 several months after he won the U.S. Open, 1967 at the PGA, and 1973 at the Andy Williams San Diego Open. The last time was the most impressive. On the 72nd tee, he hit the highest drive I had ever seen and the longest drive I had ever seen, all in the same shot. It was so far beyond what I had seen anyone else do that day it was scary. He just unloaded on the ball and he was not swinging out of his shoes like the big hitters (including Tiger) do today. Not that it makes a difference to this thread, I just like to talk about it. But, I don't see anyone being that separated today.

I would be comfortable calling Tiger Woods the most dominant golfer of all time, but if the number of majors a player wins is the gold standard for determining all-time greatness (a highly debatable point), then Tiger certainly has less competition at the top that Jack did, and that needs to be considered in picking the best golfer of all time.

People on Tiger's side bring up his superior short game, and they are right. But every athlete competes according to the expectations of his own time. In Jack's era, an adequate short game was all that was required, and an outstanding short game stood out. There were players known for getting around via their short game, and Jack wasn't one of them. Jerry Barber, Phil Rogers, and Deane Beaman, and others I can't think of right now. Now, you have to have an outstanding short game or you're off the tour. The demands of the game have changed. Jack didn't need a great short game, so he developed one that was good enough. If the demands of competition had required a better one, I have no doubt he would have responded.

[RC]

Don't forget to include Billy Casper in the list of short game wizards. That man could put the ball in the hole. I don't think Tiger could match Casper on the greens.

[Loota65]

Has to be Tiger for me

[ryan7]

Tiger got me into golf so I'm biased, but I do believe Tiger will go down as the best of all time.

[olkev]

For What It's Worth - In the june 2010 issue of Golf Digest, there is an interesting article featuring Butch Harmon, Hank Haney, David Leadbetter and Jim McLean discussing what the star players since 1950 taught us.

It is pretty interesting what they say in response to the question, "Jack Nicklaus: What's his legacy on how golf is played? Haney speaks of his record and how people seem to measure greatness by the record, Harmon talks about Nicklaus introducing yardage books, and how far he could hit a wooden driver and a soft ball and how strong he was. Haney also mentioned how high he hit it as well. McLean mentioned his fundamentals and how when he was playing would go to Jack Grout EVERY year for a refresher and prepare for the upcoming season. Leadbetter says he was the greatest strategist and commented on his influence of the swing becoming more upright (in contrast to the Hogan model).

As far as Tiger is concerned, Haney speaks to his work ethic. Harmon agrees and mentions that Tiger has changed his swing mechanics twice with him (Harmon) and twice with Haney. McLean talked about watching him practice at Doral and how he was shaping shots. Haney mentioned how he had pulled of some incredible shots and Harmon says Tiger gets it up and down better than anyone.

[jamo]

I've never chimed in on this, so I guess I will. I might me a little biased because I never saw Jack play but i have watched replays and read books, so I think I am fairly well informed.

To me, Tiger is the best. He is now and will be when he breaks the record. It would be very easy to say today that Tiger never will because of his recent struggles, but if anyone can turn it around, it is Tiger. Jack was likely comparatively longer, but Tiger's brute strength and more mechanically sound swing have allowed Tiger to throttle back on equipment changes that could eventually hurt him. Jack surely wins in driving the ball, but no body can hit the iron shot like Tiger, and his ability to get out of trouble is second to none. His short game is better than people give him credit for, and he is a great clutch putter. Jack was very good, but his uncanny ability to just win is what made him great. So, in the end, I give the nod to Tiger. More wins, higher win percentage, and the fact this his own greatness made his competition better just put him over the top.

[APowell0057]

Outside of the 2000 run, I think Jack is better than Tiger. IF Tiger's knee had been healthy the past 10 years, he'd have passed Jack in majors. The Harmon swing could no longer be duplicated by Tiger because of his bad knee IMO. I think people are greatly underestimating guys like Bobby Jones and Ben Hogan though

[olkev]

Outside of the 2000 run, I think Jack is better than Tiger. IF Tiger's knee had been healthy the past 10 years, he'd have passed Jack in majors. The Harmon swing could no longer be duplicated by Tiger because of his bad knee IMO.

Dead on correct. I just got through watching Hogan and Snead on Shell's Wonderful World of Golf at the Houston Country Club. I don't know the exact date it was made but at the time they were building the Astrodome. The course was a little over 7000yds.

Hogan hit every fairway (pretty much in the middle) and every green in regulation and shot 69. It didn't even look like he was breaking a sweat. He was calm, decisive, determined, even for an exhibition where he only won $3000. No emotions out of control, no fist pumping. He acted like he had been there before, because he had and calmly beat Snead by 3 shots. Gene Sarazen was providing commentary and thought it was the greatest round of golf he had ever seen. It was a GREAT example on how the game should really be played and how one should conduct themselves on the course.

[olkev]

I've never chimed in on this, so I guess I will. I might me a little biased because I never saw Jack play but i have watched replays and read books, so I think I am fairly well informed.

That's interesting . . . In 2007 Arnold Palmer said Nicklaus was the greatest iron player

ever.

[Zeph]

So that makes it true because Palmer said so? With the exception of statistics, you can't measure how well a player hits a golf ball. Since Jack and Tiger played in different eras, you can hardly compare statistics, since times change so fast.

[olkev]

What I'm saying is that you have an individual that at one time dominated professional golf and has been involved in professional tournament golf for over 50 years. In that time period he has seen (with his own eyes, not video, not reading about it) everyone from Nelson, Hogan, Demaret, Snead all the way up to and including Woods. I believe the man has some credibility as would anyone that knows anything about Arnold Palmer. Are you trying to tell me that you can't go to the golf course and see for yourself the difference between another 15hdcp and a scratch player? It's not that much different here except that the differences are more subtle, yet discernable to the trained eye.

If, as you say, Jack and Tiger played in different eras and you can hardly compare the two, through statistics or otherwise, then how can you or anyone else say at this point that Tiger is the greatest?

[holeinon3]

I'm growing up in the Tiger era, Tiger all the way!

[beast44k]

There's no question, they're both good.

[JWL1957]

To look at alot of these threads......... you would think golf history only goes back as far as Tigers 1st professional tee shot.

[sunray1985]

everyone has there deamons but tiger is by far the greatest player of his time a jerk but great player

[olkev]

to look at alot of these threads......... You would think golf history only goes back as far as tigers 1st professional tee shot.

BULLSEYE!! Right on target! That is so true!

[Trek3]

I gotta say its Tiger Woods. I have tredendous respect for Jack but since I didn't watch him play much golf until later in life most of my opinion is only formed from reading and highlights.