8 years of this game and this is what i learned

[moreira85]

Okay so i have been playing this game for 8 years and what i finally realized is that you cant hit the ball from the top, in fact you cant it the ball with the clubhead at all. I have tried to swing the club and put it on so many different planes and just cant figure out the key to the swing.
I came to the conclusion today, and not sure if this right, that on the down swing you have to lead down with the handle pointing to the ball and hold the angle until the last moment until the clubhead unleashes at the ball. Almost like what you would do with a whip.
before i would try to swing like a baseball player where i was trying to force it on a certain plane but from messing around I think holding that angle is what gets it on plane.

Ha Ha, is this even correct. If not I am soon from giving up this game!!!!!!!!

[Zeph]

If you are out of ideas, perhaps a lesson could be good?

When it comes to lag, which is what you are talking about, I've found that it's not something you can "do" or force. At least, it's very hard to do consistently. Getting lag and late release is a result of doing other things right.
I haven't recorded my swing since I made these changes, but I'm not casting as much as I did before.

What I did was improve my weight transfer and not use my arms as much. If I throw my arms down or out from the top of the backswing, the wrists will start to throw the clubhead down, ie. casting. I now do my weight shift, turn the hips back to parallell to the target line and let the arms drop from the top of the backswing without speeding up or anything, just a smooth rhythmic move. From there, when my hands have reached my pocket, I speed up, turn the hips fully and follow with the torso and arms.

They key to keeping the lag is to not rushing the arms from the top, that's where it's easiest to lose it. Once you've started and the arms throwing down, trying to force them back won't work. Rushing with the arms is also a key move to come over the top. Those first inches of movement also decide which swingplane you get. It's hard to change the plane once the club has started moving in one direction. So, get the club in the slot immediately and you won't lose it.

If you do cast, trying to get rid of it can be difficult since the wrists are used to throwing out the club, keeping them firm, but loose enough to let the club control them and keep the lag.

[timtim]

Do not hold the angle.

But yes, at some point the handle points toward the ball.

Basically your hips twist, which pulls on your arms, which pulls on the club. At some point you want your right elbow for a right handed golfer in close to your body as your hips turn and open toward the target while your chest continues to point at the back of the ball.

[pittpanther]

Okay so i have been playing this game for 8 years ...

What you describe is called "releasing the club." This is one of the old golf chestnuts that players use, and newbies don't know what the h*ll they're talking about.

Sorry it took you 8 years. Took me about a year to realize that I was supposed to be "whipping" the clubhead towards the ball, and not just swinging the club. You're doing the right thing. You will notice a lot more distance, and swinging will be a lot easier - you will be much less fatigued.

[timtim]

I read that Sergio Garcia used to pretend he was Indiana Jones cracking a whip when he was practicing when he was younger. Sometimes I feel that just after I hit the ball as my right arm straightens and extends.

[flopdarock]

i think he's talking about lag prior to impact and release after impact...
the "whipping" is when you should have the highest part of your clubhead speed just before during and just after impact

[grantc79]

I came to the conclusion today, and not sure if this right, that on the down swing you have to lead down with the handle pointing to the ball and hold the angle until the last moment until the clubhead unleashes at the ball. Almost like what you would do with a whip.

Actually, thats a very good swing thought and basically the idea of the whole situation. There are basically 4 power accumulators (but one is the loaded right arm which only hitters like Lee Trevino and Moe Norman use). 1: The bent right arm 2: The cocked left wrist 3: The angle established between the club shaft and the left forearm 4: The angle formed by the left arm and left shoulder The angle that you are talking about is power accumulator #3. Basically you can look at it like this...... You have an oval race track with 2 cars driving around it. Car #1 is driving around the infield on a tight radius (this is your hands). Car #2 is driving around the outside edge of the oval (this is your club head). The outside car is always trying to over take the inside car and thus the further you can inch the inside car ahead the faster and faster the outside car will speed up. Thus, if you can hold that shaft angle between your left arm and club head shaft (assuming that angle is narrow) then the club head will accelerate to a very high speed at impact.

[timtim]

Do not hold the angle.

[AmenCorner]

I have indeed heard of "throwing the butt of the club at the ball" or something to that effect. For me personally, it is something like that. Sometimes when I find myself losing power, I simply focus on maintaining that angle between the club and my right arm on the first move down towards the ball. After that it takes care of itself. I don't think about maintaining lag or anything like that. If my first move down is correct then I am good. I'm sure there are plenty of players who have more lag than me, but I think mine is pretty good for my caliber.

[imtomtomim]

Here's a thought to add to what you just figured out. Don't hit the ball. It's called a golf swing for a reason. Swing the club, swing the club towards the target.

Do you really want to hit the ball? Or would you rather let the ball get in the way of the swing?

[grantc79]

Do not hold the angle.

Holding the angle between the left forearm and shaft is good.

Narrowing the angle is even better. JGC

[timwalsh300]

I came to the conclusion today, and not sure if this right, that on the down swing you have to lead down with the handle pointing to the ball and hold the angle until the last moment until the clubhead unleashes at the ball. Almost like what you would do with a whip.

It sounds like you have a terrible baseball swing. Good baseball hitters do exactly what you are talking about

: lead with the handle pointing at the ball and hold the angle until the last moment just like a whip. This is pretty much how ALL good throwing/whipping/hitting motions work. Tim

[Robiola the Monster]

See in the second row, the second picture from the left (the one above the writing "perfect posture"), if you can put yourself in this position and then stop (have to mirror it if you are right handed like me) & check you are here and then swing to the top & then make your down swing (as a drill, not when you are playing) + make sure your right elbow (if you are right handed) is not getting lose and 'tucking in' behind your ribs, if you are 'tucking' your elbow in this means you are not having enough shoulder turn & you may need to work on that.

- Go to position
- Check
- Make Backswing
- Swing
- Repeat

If you don't understand i'm sorry i may be explaining it as you already know what to do, and you might not. If anyone knows the name of this drill could you state it, because i can't remember the name of it. I just call it the 'shank' drill because it stops me from getting 'stuck' & when i get 'stuck' i hit shanks, but this also doubles as a swing plane drill. It shouldn't alter your swing to much just the bottom 180 degrees (from hip-to-hip) of your swing.

Sorry if you don't understand what i'm talking about.

[socaltaoist]

I think that is awesome! Most instructors, pros, etc talk about this point as being very critical on the downswing. From a physical standpoint it is intuitive to think that the most efficient way to transfer the energy is with the club being swung on that plane. The angle changes of course for different clubs, body types etc, but if you watch any pros hit the club shaft is always aligned at the ball at that critical point in the swing. What's fun about moments like these in golf, and in life in general, is that sometimes the knowledge itself of secondary importance to the method from which it was found. If we can honestly and accurately judge what we are doing when we come to these conclusions we can teach ourselves to teach ourselves

James

[inthecup]

It is time to take lessons. You can learn more and get better before the end of the summer then you have in the last 8 years if you do it right.