Bridgestone Thread

[RemyM]

This statement is absurd. We're not talking about hoofing your local muni here. We're talking PGA tour, playing for $1.4mil.

Doesn't matter. There is a pace of play policy for the event and all players are aware of it.

[RemyM]

I dont think it' so absurd when the players are at the highest level playing for big bucks- id say 4 and a half hours on a course like Firestone is acceptable.

The committee running the event doesn't agree with you.

[alf174]

So the next to last group should be required to play in 4 hours but the last group shouldn't? How is that fair?

Its not fair and Padraig pointed that out in the post-round interview. I'm a big fan of Padraig but it does seem he's a little slow. We didn't see the final putts on Saturday's TV coverage because Harrington & Clark's group was apparently behind.

Now granted, there may have been obstacles creating a backup several groups ahead. It was reported that JB Holmes ran into some issues that created a delay.

[wannabe]

I dont really understand why the last group of a big time tournament would be put on the clock? .... It was unessacary, i think.

This was my first thought also. Final pairing, Sunday, pro tourney, last few holes of the round, and put on the clock. Really? Why would tourney officials do such a thing that could possibly be construed to impact the outcome?

When allowable under the rules, how often does this scenario actually happen vs. how often do tourney officials just give slack? Final group in a tourney put on the clock? wow. That said, these guys should be able to handle anything thrown at them, and I don't think it should asterisk Tiger's win, or Paddy's loss, at all. One additional question on this whole 'put on the clock' thing. Did the announcers know about this and choose not to mention it during the live broadcast, or not, and if they knew, why would they choose not to mention it?

[wannabe]

....

I don't think that you can get put on the clock for delays ahead of you, just for your own slowness during your shots.

It was stated after the tourney by commentators that Tiger & Paddy had an empty hole between themselves and the pairing in front of them, so there was no issue with them getting delayed by the goings on in front of them.

[RemyM]

This was my first thought also. Final pairing, Sunday, pro tourney, last few holes of the round, and put on the clock. Really? Why would tourney officials do such a thing that could possibly be construed to impact the outcome?

Because it's in the rules

When allowable under the rules, how often does this scenario actually happen vs. how often do tourney officials just give slack? Final group in a tourney put on the clock? wow.

Whenever a group falls out of position and it is noticed they are put on the clock. No one on the PGA Tour has been penalized for slow play in 16 years. The reason is they play faster when told they are on the clock.

One additional question on this whole 'put on the clock' thing. Did the announcers know about this and choose not to mention it during the live broadcast, or not, and if they knew, why would they choose not to mention it?

They did mention it when Harrington was on 18.

[alf174]

I don't think that you can get put on the clock for delays ahead of you, just for your own slowness during your shots.

You can have space in front of you as long as your group is not taking too much time; you should not be penalized for not keeping up with a faster field also.

But yeah, for whatever reason, they were on the slow side and the officials did the right thing by warning the group about the clock.

[jonnythan]

You don't get penalized for falling behind from a fast group - you just start getting timed to make sure you're staying within the time limits for each shot.

You've got the same time limits all the time, they just actually start clocking you when you fall behind.

Right?

[Zeph]

I did notice that Paddy was taking a very long time on a couple of his shots, especially some putts. Tiger got his usual routine when putting, he sometimes spend more time on a difficult shot, or stop and start over if someone click a camera or a gust of wind pass by. There were several occasions where Paddy told the audience to be quiet.

[Lemay427]

If they want the PRO players to follow the time limit rules, then they need to have PRO workers running the course, not volunteers. The marshalls fail to stop people from crossing the course in time before the players at the tee boxes are ready to hit. I have witnessed this countless times at the 06&07 PGA and last years BMW championship. I am not saying that was a problem in Sundays round, but I know that it happens, yet the Pros are still required to follow the time schedule. Doesnt make sense.....

If delays happen due to crowds they should be taken off the clock. Its not fair to the players that have large crowds following them that they are required to keep up to the players that have half the gallery.

[enduro]

About the time issue:

The thing is, when a group like Tiger and Harrington is out, in the final round, last pairing, there are thousands of fans and cameras and press and whoever else following them. These people take time to get into a position that won't be distracting to the golfers.

Often when Tiger would make a putt Harrington did the right thing by waiting. He had his own big putt ahead and had to wait while the crowd moved to the next tee and people started calming down. I don't see how there can't be an exception to the rule in cases like this; huge gallery's chatter, the crowd not set and moving around or to the next tee, cameras still finding position, etc.

The rules official messed up, it's as simple as that. I understand he went by the letter of the law but he didn't go by the spirit of it. He potentially ruined one of the better showdowns of the year because he didn't get it. He needs to use better judgment in instances like this because there are so many factors slowing the players down that isn't really their fault. Why shouldn't these players get the same shot conditions as the guys with 5 people and no cameras in the gallery?

[iacas]

Of course it's fair.

I agree. Tiger isn't the fastest player in the world, but Padraig makes him look like John Daly (in terms of pace). Maybe Paddy will play a tad faster now.

For a twosome to take over 4 hours to play is absurd.

At this point, 4:00 is fine. That's how long it took them, and that's fine by me. They're playing for a lot, they really can't finish much sooner (the group in front of them took over 3:50, after all), and the course is long and difficult with fast, tricky greens and long rough. And it was windy. So 4:00 is fine. 4:30, though, and I have a problem - even Thur/Fri in threesomes.

The thing is, when a group like Tiger and Harrington is out, in the final round, last pairing, there are thousands of fans and cameras and press and whoever else following them. These people take time to get into a position that won't be distracting to the golfers.

That's why the clock doesn't start until it's the player's turn to hit his shot. If people are still moving around or clearing out, or the player's taking a drop, or doing whatever, then the clock doesn't start.

The rules official messed up, it's as simple as that.

I don't think so. I think Paddy messed up by not realizing how long 40 seconds is. Or just walking faster between shots to get to his ball sooner (had he done that all day, there wouldn't have been an open hole and they wouldn't have been on the clock to begin with).

I understand he went by the letter of the law but he didn't go by the spirit of it.

I'd love to see some penalties get handed out. Heck, give one to Tiger - you bet your butt the rest of the guys on Tour will speed the heck up. Slow play sucks, and it makes watching golf difficult. I wish the PGA Tour did MORE to enforce faster play.

[enduro]

That's why the clock doesn't start until it's the player's turn to hit his shot. If people are still moving around or clearing out, or the player's taking a drop, or doing whatever, then the clock doesn't start.

When is that? Lets happen to say Tiger hits his shot is it then my turn to hit my shot immediately? Because that's tough as a lot of people move as soon as Tiger hits his ball.

I agree slow play sucks... but the final pairing in a championship round...wouldn't mind things being more lax. I mean, I sort of enjoy the tension created by this. In baseball, for instance, pitchers take a long time between pitches for bit at bats and it adds to the intensity. I guess the golf corollary is take extra time from time to time on big shots but for most shots just play. Maybe they need to revisit these rules because there are so many different situations and I'm not sure a blanket rule can apply to every situation.

[MSDOGS1976]

I wonder if the PGA official would have actually had the balls to penalize either player after they were put on the clock? Can you imagine the out cry if Tiger was penalized and that cost him the tournament?

[retexan599]

I think Paddy messed up by not realizing how long 40 seconds is. Or just walking faster between shots to get to his ball sooner (had he done that all day, there wouldn't have been an open hole and they wouldn't have been on the clock to begin with).

Or perhaps Padraig's

caddy messed up? I should think the caddy would be the one to stay aware of such things; and the caddy can carry a stop watch, yes?

[PiustheDrGolf]

if Tim Herron can walk fast enough not to get a warning for slow play, Paddy shouldn't have a problem :) Just kidding. But.... my only disappointment on the issue is that it could be a great match on 17th & 18th if Paddy went with bogey on the 16th, as Tiger said. I cheered for AK at AT&T; and cheered for Paddy this time. Disappointing result both cases..

[Cesar]

I think the tournament officials neglected to use common sense. Yes there are rules in place, but they don't HAVE TO be enforced in a situation like that. You have arguably the best player ever going up against a guy who won 3 majors in 13 months revently on a great course and stage. Why do anything to ruin it?

Word on the Golf Channel last night was that CBS was the the one applying the pressure to wrap the the thing up on time and that's why they were put on the clock. IMO, that's idiotic on their part because a playoff was a very possible scenario anyway. Not to mention how good for the game something like that would have been (and their ratings).

Kudos to Tiger for sticking up for Paddy after the event and kudos to Paddy for taking the high road, even though you could tell he was obviously upset about it.

Personally, I think whoever made that call needs to be taken as far away from a PGA event as possible in the future. Clueless.

[TN94z]

So what is everyone's thoughts on Tiger being fined for his words about the official that put them on the clock. Tiger said that this caused Padraig to rush his shots and triple the 16th.