Sliding Forward vs Rotating

[MikeLowry5]

I am having a problem with sliding forward vs rotating when transitioning from my back swing. Two things that have helped was using the head turn before starting my back swing and also pushing my backside knee (right knee for all of you right handers out there) inward keeping from too much weight falling on my back side.

While this works good it does not always keep me from sliding forward and my front elbow breaking down. Does anyone have any other suggestions to help with this?

[iacas]

Just be careful you don't completely do away with hip "slide." It's not necessarily a bad thing.

[ks8829]

swing a club with your feet together, this will force you to rotate otherwise you will fall over, you can try this drill with any club even your driver. I have not tried to hit ball at the driving range with this drill, but I suppose you could.

[enduro]

Just be careful you don't completely do away with hip "slide." It's not necessarily a bad thing.

I wouldn't focus on it though. Any forward slide should probably come naturally as a part of the weight shift and rotation. Also in those picture they exaggerate the amount of slide. The rotation moves the hip around so in that picture it looks like they're sliding a lot more than they are.

It's easy to over do it if you're really trying to.

[iacas]

Any forward slide should probably come naturally as a part of the weight shift and rotation.

And in my experience, people who focus on rotation tend to lose the weight shift and thus the slide.

Also in those picture they exaggerate the amount of slide.

Uh, no.

It's easy to over do it if you're really trying to.

To over-do what? Pushing the hips forward? If you over-do it you fall forward, and I don't see too many people doing that. Must not be really easy to over-do that.

[Zeph]

I wouldn't focus on it though. Any forward slide should probably come naturally as a part of the weight shift and rotation. Also in those picture they exaggerate the amount of slide. The rotation moves the hip around so in that picture it looks like they're sliding a lot more than they are.

It's the other way around. The weight shift happens because body mass move from right to left, essentially the hips. You don't want the feet to move, you definately don't want the head to move forward. The weight shift is a result of hip movement, not the other way around. If you just turn the hips from the backswing, the weight won't get all the way to the left foot. Turning without moving the hips forward can put too much weight on the back foot.

[ninetwothree]

The hips can move linearly forward towards the target or you can make a conscious decision to rotate. By moving the center of the hips foward, they will rotate some, but once the center is at the ball or in front, then you can consciously rotate. Rotating from the top with a right side weighted backswing is leading to over the tops very quick. the picture posted of tiger is at a bad camera angle because he does not play his ball that far forward.

Hogan and Tiger also had completely different pivots, where hogan had the center of his hips back to center of his stance before the arms come down, where tiger's center is towards the back.

[iacas]

the picture posted of tiger is at a bad camera angle because he does not play his ball that far forward.

No, it's not. The camera view is fine, and Tiger plays his ball just where it's posted there: right inside his left instep.

And whether or not Tiger and Hogan had different pivots is irrelevant - both moved their hips forward right up until impact.

[ninetwothree]

I have watched Tiger on the range twice in the past 2 months. That view of his ball position is much more forward than he plays it, but hey! the pictures don't ever lie, do they. The style of pivot would effect the amount of hip slide. Tiger would slide more than Hogan.

I think comparing Tiger to Hogan in terms of being champion golfers is a great debate, but comparing Tiger to Hogan in terms of the golf swing and ball striking is like comparing Keystone Light to Heineken.

[enduro]

I have watched Tiger on the range twice in the past 2 months. That view of his ball position is much more forward than he plays it, but hey! the pictures don't ever lie, do they. The style of pivot would effect the amount of hip slide. Tiger would slide more than Hogan.

Actually, you're wrong. Again. That is exactly where Tiger plays his shot and most competent golfers would. Could you please reference some data besides some anecdotal, probable lies about watching Tiger the last couple months? Every image I've ever seen of him is the same as the above.

[tm22721]

The more you can open up the right side, the straighter the appraoch to the ball hence the more lag is generated. Lag is lost when the club shaft moves in a circular path. If you look at at an overhead video of Tiger (we don't have any of Hogan) you will see that his hands trace a pretty straight line from the top to where the club shaft reaches parallel to the ground.

[WilsonWedgeMan]

all this Tiger vs Hogan debate is fine and dandy, but what I need to know,too, is what drills are taught to acheive proper weight shift. I, also,find myself hanging back on my right foot, which is disasterous. I try to keep my head behind the ball, and that just encourages the right side to stay put. I try sliding like the photos show, but that causes topped shots, or terrible mis-hits. I will mention that due to an auto accident a decade ago, I can't rotate the hips like I used to, but still can rotate 75%.
any advice for weight shifting????

[ninetwothree]

Actually, you're wrong. Again. That is exactly where Tiger plays his shot and most competent golfers would. Could you please reference some data besides some anecdotal, probable lies about watching Tiger the last couple months? Every image I've ever seen of him is the same as the above.

Reference data? Do you want the plane ticket, the access badge, or the meal receipts. Look who's anecdotal? " most competent golfers"... you're not even one of them, yet you can sit at your desk and write about what other people have told you without doing any research or analysis on your own. You have references hogan's book in every post. Is that the only book you own? is he the master reference for everything about the golf swing? not to say he wasnt a genius but dude, get a grip on reality and turn on your tv to see that nobody today swings it like he does. campbell, sergio, and trevor's old move are pretty close, but chiming in to every thread saying that "read hogan's book and you'll see that..." is borderline plagiarism. Look at the things that changed in golf in the past 5 years, including what we thought was solid gold: ball flight laws. the boys from S&T; have changed the way we have taken in all that crappy information for the past 30-40-50 years and have given us a new idea on how to get this done. NO more listening to the old pro who's been around the game and therefore has talked to the greats about what they have felt. no more listening to the regurgitators like you who run around shooting their mouth off. grow up, read a book, get a clue, and jump out from behind the leader my friend. do something for yourself. I"m done with you. you can write whatever you want because there are others like you on here who will take anything people say as truth and fact, when in FACT its crap. I hear you're mom calling you in for dinner. ...run along now.

[michaeljames92]

Iacas is right on this. Hip slide is needed to create room to swing from the inside. if you don't bump on the downswing, it is very easy to start hitting snap hooks as i have found out the hard way. However if you really thrust out in front of the ball, you will probably hit a block to the right

[enduro]

Reference data? Do you want the plane ticket, the access badge, or the meal receipts.

Actually, I reference it because consider it the remedial basics and when it's clear certain people haven't mastered these elements I find necessary to point them in that direction. It is the fundamental book that answers about 90% of the questions around here. A simple browsing through those notes would probably do a lot of people (including yourself) a lot of good. Coupled with a few lessons from a PGA Professional and most would see dramatic improvements.

Most golf swings use his principals because frankly, they have to. I suppose "competent golfer" being subjective and all is hard to define. But my handicap is in the 5 range and I believe most people would consider that competent. And it it could be lower if I my putting and chipping improved, which I'm working on. So ball striking isn't exactly the problem. And I understand the elements of my swing from grip to follow through and have reached a state of competent consciousness. That's a large step in improving your game and something I hope you shoot for. I guess I'd suggest you read that book as you've demonstrated you don't have much clue about what you're talking about in various posts. And you've been called on it and you've resorted to petty insults, which are more humorous than anything. In fact, I hope you keep them coming and maybe one of them will make me fall out of my chair laughing. I do enjoy! And you claim you were a surgeon once? Crazy alert!

[ninetwothree]

a 5 handicap? I'll be giving you a few aside, and soon to be more now that I'm retired.

I read hogan's books while you were still in diapers, junior.

[tm22721]

Here are two drills to get the weight shift sequence correct that work for me.

1. From the top drop the club down parallel to the ground and the target line (ie at 9:00), then pause. Note that your hips just bumped to the target automatically clearing your right hip ! Now just rotate the hips and let gravity drop the club thru impact. You will feel your hips rotate open to 30 degrees by impact. Ball will only go 50 yards. The point of the drill is to separate the two moves until they are programmed into the computer that is your brain. As you will note, the hip bump is an automatic effect of the club falling from the top down to 9:00 (into the 'slot'). After performing this drill 60 times/day for 20 days you will have engrained the sequence and it will now blend seamlessly for full shots.

2. Here is an ingenuous way to get an automatic weight shift (employed by Hogan). Take a slightly wider stance than usual. In your backswing turn into your right leg instead of over it. By the end of the backswing the angle of your right leg will be acute and you will have shifted weight to the left leg. Now just rotate the hips into the downswing without losing the acute angle of the right leg. You will feel like you are squatting as you turn, almost like doing the limbo. A video will show that your hips shifted to the target in the backswing.

[akgolfnut]

This video helped me, which supplements what tm just posted: