How good are hybrids, really?

[Vladimir Puttin']

  Gresh24 said:

Originally Posted by Gresh24

I struggled with the hybrids early on.  I think I expected them to be "easy".  No long iron/club is easy to hit.

I recommend just trying them.  And to hit them 'like an iron'.  Hit 'down on them' like an iron (not sweeping like a fairway wood) with a smooth swing.   Don't try to hit them too hard.

I converted to hybrids a couple years ago and now I don't have anything higher than a 5-iron in my bag.  It's funny, it took me a while to get used to them too because I was trying to hit them like an iron.  I found a sweeping stroke to work better for me...we're all different.

A couple things I haven't seen mentioned is that I find hybrids much easier to hit out of the rough - the long grass just doesn't seem to grab them like it does an iron and they come handy for chipping around the green when you have a lot of run out.

[rustyredcab]

Guys (like Sean) who hit a 6-iron 190 yards may not have a place for hybrids in their bag. I have seen very few players with that length except on TV. And the guys on TV fit my profile of a player who can play without hybrids and not be crazy.

[Kieran123]

  rustyredcab said:

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Guys (like Sean) who hit a 6-iron 190 yards may not have a place for hybrids in their bag. I have seen very few players with that length except on TV. And the guys on TV fit my profile of a player who can play without hybrids and not be crazy.

Distance has little to do with if you need a hybrid or not

6 iron for 190 yards is long, but not crazy long.

There are guys on the Tour who hit long, but still use hybrids. ie. Adam Scott, Jonathan Byrd, Steve Marino, Rickie Fowler

Source: Wikipedia

" In 2007 the Darrell Survey Company reported that over 30% of consumer golfers were using at least one hybrid club, up from a little over 7% in 2004. They also found 65% of professional golfers on the PGA Tour , and 80% on the Champions Tour now use at least one hybrid club, with many carrying more than one in their bags. ^"

[sean_miller]

  Kieran123 said:

Originally Posted by Kieran123

Quote:

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Guys (like Sean) who hit a 6-iron 190 yards may not have a place for hybrids in their bag. I have seen very few players with that length except on TV. And the guys on TV fit my profile of a player who can play without hybrids and not be crazy.

Distance has little to do with if you need a hybrid or not

6 iron for 190 yards is long, but not crazy long.

There are guys on the Tour who hit long, but still use hybrids. ie. Adam Scott, Jonathan Byrd, Steve Marino, Rickie Fowler

Source: Wikipedia

"In 2007 the Darrell Survey Company reported that over 30% of consumer golfers were using at least one hybrid club, up from a little over 7% in 2004. They also found 65% of professional golfers on the PGA Tour, and 80% on the Champions Tour now use at least one hybrid club, with many carrying more than one in their bags."

I've read something along the lines of "the first iron a player wishes he could hit higher / longer / with more spin is the point where he should switch to hybrids." I think that's bit short sighted. I've seen guys go this route and eventually the longest iron becomes a 4, then a 5, then a 6 and so on. Great for him if he so chooses and he's happy, but for me it's a non-starter. I'd rather go with a GI long iron or bracket one key scoring hybrid (like a 4H for example) with irons.  For example, when I carried my Callaway 3-hybrid last year, I pulled the 4-iron. I went 2-iron, 3-iron, 3H (similar distance to the 3-iron but with a higher trajectory), 5-iron, etc. I can step on a 5-iron or back off a 3-iron and fill that gap, and the 3-hybrid lands softer with less roll. Sometimes I actually want roll.

[Kieran123]

  sean_miller said:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

I've read something along the lines of "the first iron a player wishes he could hit higher / longer / with more spin is the point where he should switch to hybrids." I think that's bit short sighted. I've seen guys go this route and eventually the longest iron becomes a 4, then a 5, then a 6 and so on. Great for him if he so chooses and he's happy, but for me it's a non-starter. I'd rather go with a GI long iron or bracket one key scoring hybrid (like a 4H for example) with irons.  For example, when I carried my Callaway 3-hybrid last year, I pulled the 4-iron. I went 2-iron, 3-iron, 3H (similar distance to the 3-iron but with a higher trajectory), 5-iron, etc. I can step on a 5-iron or back off a 3-iron and fill that gap, and the 3-hybrid lands softer with less roll. Sometimes I actually want roll.

If I wanted to roll to the green, but a 4H would land softly and not roll, I would use a soft 3H, or change my ball placement/swing. Typically I have a lower ball flight anyway, and if I am 220+ out, I don't expect the ball to stop on the spot - even with my hybrid.

Typically, anything a 3, 4 or 5 iron can do, a hybrid can do. But not the other way. The shaft may need tweaking, the ball may need moving, but it can be done. The only thing you may lose is the pure feel of a flushed iron.

For me, they made the game a lot easier. There is no point for me struggling and using practice time to hit my 3 iron consistently, when I can switch to a hybrid, and spend more time on scoring clubs.

Same can be said for those who struggle with hybrids - but do fine with their irons.

If it ain't broke, don't try fix it

[sean_miller]

  Kieran123 said:

Originally Posted by Kieran123

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

I've read something along the lines of "the first iron a player wishes he could hit higher / longer / with more spin is the point where he should switch to hybrids." I think that's bit short sighted. I've seen guys go this route and eventually the longest iron becomes a 4, then a 5, then a 6 and so on. Great for him if he so chooses and he's happy, but for me it's a non-starter. I'd rather go with a GI long iron or bracket one key scoring hybrid (like a 4H for example) with irons.  For example, when I carried my Callaway 3-hybrid last year, I pulled the 4-iron. I went 2-iron, 3-iron, 3H (similar distance to the 3-iron but with a higher trajectory), 5-iron, etc. I can step on a 5-iron or back off a 3-iron and fill that gap, and the 3-hybrid lands softer with less roll. Sometimes I actually want roll.

If I wanted to roll to the green, but a 4H would land softly and not roll, I would use a soft 3H, or change my ball placement/swing. Typically I have a lower ball flight anyway, and if I am 220+ out, I don't expect the ball to stop on the spot - even with my hybrid.

Typically, anything a 3, 4 or 5 iron can do, a hybrid can do. But not the other way. The shaft may need tweaking, the ball may need moving, but it can be done. The only thing you may lose is the pure feel of a flushed iron.

For me, they made the game a lot easier. There is no point for me struggling and using practice time to hit my 3 iron consistently, when I can switch to a hybrid, and spend more time on scoring clubs.

Same can be said for those who struggle with hybrids - but do fine with their irons.

If it ain't broke, don't try fix it

I tend to use irons off the tee quite often. I can control the spin (back and side) more with an iron. If it was all about approach shots to the green, then yeah I'd probably favour hybrids. But game improvement long irons are just like hitting hybrid anyway, so I'm a bit of a hipocrite.

[Kieran123]

  sean_miller said:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

I tend to use irons off the tee quite often. I can control the spin (back and side) more with an iron. If it was all about approach shots to the green, then yeah I'd probably favour hybrids. But game improvement long irons are just like hitting hybrid anyway, so I'm a bit of a hipocrite.

I can not backspin a long iron for the life of me ( nor a hybrid ) and drawing/fading with a hybrid is more controlled for me personally.

If I try shape my 4 iron, I sometimes snap hook it or 'power fade' ( read: slice ) it into oblivion.

Hence my handicap hovering around 10, and yours around 6

[westcyderydin]

Hybrids are great for any golfer from beginner to pro.  It just takes the right hybrid with the right shaft to fit the golfer and what the golfer wants.

Some hyrids are ugly at adress and either take some getting used to or just don't fit everybody.  But there are some great looking well performing hybrids out there.

I really recommend Nickent hybrids.  You can find them online new or used for around $50...with good shafts too.  Just make sure to find out what shaft fits you.

And also don't look at the number or the loft on the hybrid and try to replace a wood or iron with the same number...it doesn't work like that.  They are all a little different as far as distance and trajectory.  As an example my 3 hybrid is twenty degrees and goes about ten yards further than my 3 iron which i believe is 23 degrees.  But like i said that will be different for everybody.

[inthehole]

  sean_miller said:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

But game improvement long irons are just like hitting hybrid anyway, so I'm a bit of a hipocrite.

Exactly - thats what I said early on in this thread ... cavity backed long irons are not that hard to hit & have the forgiveness most of us are looking for.     I'm wondering if those that make the claim that hybrids should replace long irons, are soley referring to traditional irons and not the SGI irons that are so popular today ?

[MSDOGS1976]

I use a couple of hybrids during the winter here. Seems to always be wet and sloppy. Just easier to hit. But the rest of the year I normally stick to irons and FW woods. As I get older(and I'm getting older), I will probably go more with some hybrids year round. A good way to play senior golf.

[newtogolf]

That's a great point and reason I have both a 4h and 4i in my bag.  A mishit with my 4i is usually easier to recover from than a 4h.  I also mentally have a tough time with a hybrid out of thick rough and feel more confident with an iron.

  sean_miller said:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

Your description of a mishit and fluttering long iron versus a similar shot with a hybrid is actually one reason I shy away from them. Sometimes a poorly struck ball that goes 150 yards bouncing its way down the middle of the fairway or one that flutters its way the right rough is preferable to one that banana slices or snap hooks into the trees. We all have our own fears. For some it's carries and for me its the ball taking a 90 degree detour. Actually now that I've commented on it, I'll probably struggle with forced carries this year. Stupid karma.

[sean_miller]

  inthehole said:

Originally Posted by inthehole

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

But game improvement long irons are just like hitting hybrid anyway, so I'm a bit of a hipocrite.

Exactly - thats what I said early on in this thread ... cavity backed long irons are not that hard to hit & have the forgiveness most of us are looking for.     I'm wondering if those that make the claim that hybrids should replace long irons, are soley referring to traditional irons and not the SGI irons that are so popular today ?

Apparently I'm also a bit of an excellent speller!!

[Tomboys]

  westcyderydin said:

Originally Posted by westcyderydin

Hybrids are great for any golfer from beginner to pro.  It just takes the right hybrid with the right shaft to fit the golfer and what the golfer wants.

Some hyrids are ugly at adress and either take some getting used to or just don't fit everybody.  But there are some great looking well performing hybrids out there.

I really recommend Nickent hybrids.  You can find them online new or used for around $50...with good shafts too.  Just make sure to find out what shaft fits you.

And also don't look at the number or the loft on the hybrid and try to replace a wood or iron with the same number...it doesn't work like that.  They are all a little different as far as distance and trajectory.  As an example my 3 hybrid is twenty degrees and goes about ten yards further than my 3 iron which i believe is 23 degrees.  But like i said that will be different for everybody.

IME, it does depending on the configuration/design of the hybrid.

FWIW, per Wikipedia:

Behavior

Though generally similar to a wood of the same loft in performance, with slightly less carry distance (distance traveled before first impact) but similar launch trajectory, and generally similar to an iron in swing mechanics, hybrids have some behaviors different from either. Because the wood-like head design creates enormous impulse on the ball, the loft of a hybrid head is generally higher than either the wood or iron of the same number, so that the distance carried by the ball is similar to the comparable iron number.

This does two things; first, the angle of launch is increased so that the ball carries higher than the comparable iron. Second, the increased loft coupled with the tighter impulse also imparts increased backspin on the ball. This increased backspin is different from both the iron and the wood of the same number, and creates a flight path similar to a higher-loft iron but at a lower angle of launch; the backspinning ball will lift itself in the air along its flight line, "stall" when the lift generated by the spin coupled with the ball's momentum can no longer keep it in the air, and drop relatively sharply onto the turf. The sharp drop coupled with the continuing backspin creates "bite"; the ball's forward momentum will be arrested sharply at its point of impact and carry only a few yards thereafter.

Once this behavior is known to the player, it can be used to great effect. For instance, a player may be faced with a hole incorporating a hazard just in front of the green. A driver, low-loft fairway wood or long iron shot will roll significantly, and depending on the distance carried in the air the ball will either roll into the hazard with a resulting penalty, or roll past the green, which on many courses is difficult to recover from and may incorporate other hazards. Normally a player might hit a mid-iron shot designed to "lay up" in front of the hazard and then hit an "approach" shot with a wedge or short iron to carry over the hazard and onto the green. However, a hybrid with sufficient distance would allow the player to hit a shot that carries the full distance to the green in the air, but then "sticks" on the green relatively close to its impact point, allowing the player to make one stroke instead of two to get on the green.

Both my 3i and 3h are 21*.  But, my 3h is an inch longer, so it yields a slight increase in swing speed which results in a carry that is greater than my 3i.  However, since it stops quicker, the total distance is no greater than my 3i.  For example, 210 is the "go" number for both my 3i and 3h.  My 3i may carry 200 and roll out to 210.  In contrast, my hybrid may carry 207 and roll out to 210.  Granted, when my target is a fairway, I may get a little more total distance (due to increased roll) because I can lower the trajectory and spin more with a 3i than a 3h (ok, I admit it, I can't actually do that, I'm talking about when I thin or "blade" the shot, but you get the general concept. LOL).  However, the trade-off is worth the benefit of being able to hit the green and hold it from 210 out even with slightly thinned shots.  In fact, it's because of this last point that I decided to switch out my 3i for a 3h.  I was going for a green in two on a par 5.  I had 210 left with a trap in front and a lake guarding the left side of the green.  I mis-hit my 3i resulting in a low draw.  It cleared the trap, but once it hit the green, it just rolled and rolled right off the green into the water.  I threw down another ball, took the cellophane off the grip of my 3h--I had just bought it, and hit another ball.  Crap, another low draw.  Just like my 3i, it cleared the front bunker and hit the green. I saw the ball rolling and figured it was gone too.  However, it just stopped.  It was then that I had my "Ah-ha" moment with hybrids.  It's funny that Wikipedia uses this very example because I "discovered" this "attribute" about hybrids long before I looked it up.

Lastly, my initial foray with a hybrid was a complete disaster.  My results were mixed at best.  It was a 20* head fitted with a 67 gram stiff HL graphite shaft.  I hit more duck hooks than I could count resulting in me trying to change my swing to become anti-hook.  Not a good thing because I starting missing left and right, so I sold the damn thing.  My current hybrid is a 21* head fitted with a 92 gram stiff graphite shaft with a higher kick point.  Plays like an iron and I don't worry about duck hooks any more than I did with my 3i.

[MikeyGolf]

First Post

As someone that grew up with a 1 and 2 iron in my bag, I resisted the hybrids.  Once the groove rule came along, I need to replace my irons and did not have a lot of luck finding a 1 iron that met the rules.  I purchased a 17 degree hybrid and really like it.  It is great out of the fairway and off the tee.  It has worked so well, that I took my strong 3 wood out of the bag and now just go with the Driver and hybrid.

I do miss my 1 iron, it was great for getting out and around trees.

[Jwat381]

I read this topic, and really began to think about my hybrid play. There's no real question that they're easier to hit than long irons. I can hit them off a mat well, but whoop-de-doo. I can use them off a tee on a long par 3 or for a more conservative start to a par 4 or 5, if needed. They are night and day easier and better out of the rough. All sounds good, right? The one place I almost always struggle to him them is off the fairway. A lot of the fairways I play here in Eugene are soft and a little muddy feeling for a good chunk of the year, and I think that's my problem. Because when I have a solid surface to hit off, I can hit them high and relatively straight. I have certainly experienced the balooning effect and the amplification of mis-hits though. As far as my stroke with the hybrid, I swing it like a hybrid between an iron and a wood. A little bit more vertical plane with a little bit more of a sweeping motion. Biggest key for me is making sure to swing paralell or down at the ground, as coming up at all will lead to nothing more than a 10 yard roller with a big hole in the ground right in front of my feet.

[Shindig]

  Mikey Ernest said:

Once the groove rule came along, I need to replace my irons and did not have a lot of luck finding a 1 iron that met the rules.  I purchased a 17 degree hybrid and really like it.

Unless your old 1-iron is very weakly lofted, you can still use it. I forget the exact number, but only clubs with more than a certain amount of loft are affected, and I think that number is 24 degrees (or about a 4-iron these days, maybe 5-iron if it's TaylorMade).

[MikeyGolf]

I will look into the groove rule. The 1 iron is an old tommy armour 845.

[ohiolefty]

I ditched traditional hybrids and went to a hybrid 2 iron that I'll really only be using for long shots out of rough and a few other miscellaneous times.

Hybrids are great if you can't hit your irons high. However, I fight a hook to begin with, and I find a hard time finding a hybrid that doesn't tend to shut on me when I'm hitting shots with it...and being so hook-concious with the club mentally negates most of the physical benefits I'm getting from it.

The hybrid I have now is, essentially, a slightly-easier-to-hit 2 iron with a graphite shaft that's probably a touch longer than a standard 2 iron. That's about what I wanted. I can also hit more shots with it than I could my 2 iron.

I think you should play whatever clubs work best for you, and you need to be honest with yourself about it. As 'sexy' as a traditional blade is, I play a forged CB because it's what performs best for me. You have to do what you need to do. Period. If that means, for this season, you carry hybrids from your 5 iron up, then you should do that. If it means you should carry 1 hybrid, or carry a 5W, or a 7W or whatever - you should do that.