Most Overpaid People in Sports

[Kapanda]

Originally Posted by meenman

So if they are getting too much, who should get the cash? The owner who already has billions? The doctor that has nothing to do with the sport because you think he deserves more? The bum who tries to shake me down for change at every traffic light?

There is nothing wrong with athletes making millions in a multi-billion dollar industry.

The point is on whether they are getting paid too much or not, not on who the best suitor for the cash is.

Originally Posted by Gresh24

You either agree with/believe in a free market or you don't.  It's pretty simple.  In a free market, people earn what they can based on their demand and earning power.  Bitching about it is ridiculous, imo.

And doctors (since that seems to be the comparison some want to use), btw, can earn money in their profession for 40 years if they want to.

You must've skipped the whole thread.

And in any case, afaik, the system as it is now is the best alternative known to man (as in, the free market-based system), it works and it is tremendously positive. It's a bit delusional to defend it as if it has no flaws though. I say that because you guys are now just saying "well, that's just how the system works".

[x129]

Ticket prices and players salaries are not related.  College players make 50k/year. The tickets at good schools are not cheap. If the players were making 30 million less, the owner would keep that money and not give it to the fans.

As far as public funding for stadiums, it sucks. It also sucks when governments give tax breaks to business to move (or stay).

Quote:

No, but it would be less sad if the players got 30 million less and the ticket prices went down ten bucks. And it would be less sad if the players got 30 million less and the owners didn't push bills through the legislature that forced taxpayers in Walla Walla to pay for a new stadium in Seattle, 260 miles away. And yes, that really happened.

[Kapanda]

College players make money?? legitimately or underhand?

Thought getting paid for NCAA sports was against the rules...

[Gresh24]

Originally Posted by Kapanda

The point is on whether they are getting paid too much or not, not on who the best suitor for the cash is.

You must've skipped the whole thread.

And in any case, afaik, the system as it is now is the best alternative known to man (as in, the free market-based system), it works and it is tremendously positive. It's a bit delusional to defend it as if it has no flaws though. I say that because you guys are now just saying "well, that's just how the system works".

If you think there is any alternative suitor(s) for the income that an individual makes, other than that individual, that's crazy.

I have read the thread, and to me, it remains very simple.  I think it is delusional to agree that 'people are overpaid' in a free market.

[Gresh24]

Originally Posted by Kapanda

College players make money?? legitimately or underhand?

Thought getting paid for NCAA sports was against the rules...

In the form of hunrdeds of thousands of dollars in tuition and room and board.

[Gresh24]

Originally Posted by Kapanda

It's a bit delusional to defend it as if it has no flaws though. I say that because you guys are now just saying "well, that's just how the system works".

No one has argued that the system is entirely without flaws.  But, this sure isn't one of them.  In fact, it's kinda the whole point and beauty of the system.  Doesn't matter if you are the commissioner of football, an athlete, an entertainer, a physician, or a person that becomes a millionare starting a business from the trunk of his/her car.  You have the right to earn whatever amount of money you can get people to pay for your product or service.  Just because you disagree with it, does not mean it is a flaw in the system.  This is actually the system working as it is designed to.

If you can get people to pay X for what you're selling, I see no grounds to complain about that in a free market.

[meenman]

They make a lot of money, but they spend a lot of money too. Many athletes are not The best money managers - they are The best people to have it since they will put it back into the economy. You or I with that extra cash would do something silly like save some or pay down our bills.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by Kapanda

The point is on whether they are getting paid too much or not, not on who the best suitor for the cash is.

I think there are two different arguments going on here.  One side is simply saying its a free market, the owners will get what they can from the fans and the players will get what they can from the owners.  They players aren't overpaid unless you think that the owners deserve a bigger share, or that ticket (and merchandise prices) should be lower - which of course in a free market is silly because we are willing to pay it.

The other argument (Kapanda's) is more a "in an ideal world" argument.  In a previous post, someone asked if he'd be willing to take a paycut at his job.  I didn't think much of it because it was basically a rhetorical question, the answer almost obviously being no.  If you told me that I had to take a 50% paycut, I would say no thanks and look into another profession.  However, if you asked a random professional baseball or football player who's making 1 million dollars per year if they would like to take a 50% paycut or find another job, how many of them would say no?  'My choice is 500k to play a game I love and be worshipped by kids everywhere, or go into the "real world" and find a normal boring job where I get paid 50k-150k to do work?'

In that sense, I agree with both arguments.  In the real world, everybody makes what the market will bear and nothing is really fairer than that.  But in an ideal fantasy world, it would be nice if the best doctors, nurses, firemen, policemen, military, were rewarded more than athletes.

Kapanda, stop arguing this nonsense and start concentrating on getting ready for your first ever game of golf!!!

Quote:

..... afaik .....

Off topic ... this is the first, and so far only internet forum I've joined so its the only place I get to see these acronyms.  Since I came in knowing only the basics, lol, btw, fwiw, I find it a fun amusing game to try and figure these out myself.  For the record, I had to cheat for iirc, but this one I think I've got (as far as I know?)

[x129]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gresh24

In the form of hunrdeds of thousands of dollars in tuition and room and board.

[x129]

Why? Would the world really be better if the top nurse made 10 million instead of over 300k (I don't know the highest paid nurse but there are several in CA who were over 300k)? I don't think so. Paying the top 1000 nurses a million dollars each probably isn't much motivation when  the odds of being one of those people would be like .5% at best.  And I am guessing better care (for society in general) would be given in most cases by having 6 x150k nurses versus 1 1 million dollar nurse.

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

In that sense, I agree with both arguments.  In the real world, everybody makes what the market will bear and nothing is really fairer than that.  But in an ideal fantasy world, it would be nice if the best doctors, nurses, firemen, policemen, military, were rewarded more than athletes.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by x129

Why? Would the world really be better if the top nurse made 10 million instead of over 300k (I don't know the highest paid nurse but there are several in CA who were over 300k)? I don't think so. Paying the top 1000 nurses a million dollars each probably isn't much motivation when  the odds of being one of those people would be like .5% at best.  And I am guessing better care (for society in general) would be given in most cases by having 6 x150k nurses versus 1 1 million dollar nurse.

I guess it would have been better to say it like this ... "But in an ideal fantasy world, it would be nice if athletes were rewarded less than the best doctors, nurses, firemen, policemen, military." I don't mean to suggest that there should be nurses out there making millions, just that I can see the argument that they are "worth" more than athletes.

[newtogolf]

It depends on the definition of worth.  I have a great respect for doctors, public school teachers, nurses, firemen, policemen and our military.  Unfortunately for them, those fields for the most part provide basic services required by society thus the services they offer need to be affordable so they can be made available to everyone.

Even in these fields there are large variances in pay based on ability and willingness to pay.  Nassau and Suffolk County Policemen and State Troopers with benefits and overtime average over $175,000 while the average NY City police officer benefits and salary total just over $100,000.  The police officer in the city is at much greater personal risk but that is not factored into the salary, instead the lower number of required officers and the taxpayers ability to pay more in Nassau and Suffolk is what drives the higher salaries there.  Doctors that perform cosmetic surgery or advanced surgical procedures make significantly more than an emergency room doctor who saves lives on a daily basis.

It's hard to quantify worth especially with how it relates to salary because of all the other variables that are involved.

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I guess it would have been better to say it like this ... "But in an ideal fantasy world, it would be nice if athletes were rewarded less than the best doctors, nurses, firemen, policemen, military."  I don't mean to suggest that there should be nurses out there making millions, just that I can see the argument that they are "worth" more than athletes.

[Kapanda]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I think there are two different arguments going on here.  One side is simply saying its a free market, the owners will get what they can from the fans and the players will get what they can from the owners.  They players aren't overpaid unless you think that the owners deserve a bigger share, or that ticket (and merchandise prices) should be lower - which of course in a free market is silly because we are willing to pay it.

The other argument (Kapanda's) is more a "in an ideal world" argument.  In a previous post, someone asked if he'd be willing to take a paycut at his job.  I didn't think much of it because it was basically a rhetorical question, the answer almost obviously being no.  If you told me that I had to take a 50% paycut, I would say no thanks and look into another profession.  However, if you asked a random professional baseball or football player who's making 1 million dollars per year if they would like to take a 50% paycut or find another job, how many of them would say no?  'My choice is 500k to play a game I love and be worshipped by kids everywhere, or go into the "real world" and find a normal boring job where I get paid 50k-150k to do work?'

In that sense, I agree with both arguments.  In the real world, everybody makes what the market will bear and nothing is really fairer than that.  But in an ideal fantasy world, it would be nice if the best doctors, nurses, firemen, policemen, military, were rewarded more than athletes.

Kapanda, stop arguing this nonsense and start concentrating on getting ready for your first ever game of golf!!!

Quote:

Off topic ... this is the first, and so far only internet forum I've joined so its the only place I get to see these acronyms.  Since I came in knowing only the basics, lol, btw, fwiw, I find it a fun amusing game to try and figure these out myself.  For the record, I had to cheat for iirc, but this one I think I've got (as far as I know?)

Ahh!! The voice of reason! If only you could make yourself omnipresent!

[x129]

The services they provide are more important. The individuals are not worth as much.  When a guy shows up to fight your house fire, it doesn't really matter if he is the top .1% or just average. When you are watching a basketball game, it does. People want to see NBA games. Nobody (except new girlfriends) wants to go see a rec league game (i.e. average basketball player).

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I guess it would have been better to say it like this ... "But in an ideal fantasy world, it would be nice if athletes were rewarded less than the best doctors, nurses, firemen, policemen, military."  I don't mean to suggest that there should be nurses out there making millions, just that I can see the argument that they are "worth" more than athletes.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by x129

The services they provide are more important. The individuals are not worth as much.  When a guy shows up to fight your house fire, it doesn't really matter if he is the top .1% or just average. When you are watching a basketball game, it does. People want to see NBA games. Nobody (except new girlfriends) wants to go see a rec league game (i.e. average basketball player).

I don't want to back myself too far into a corner here, because I do agree with you.  Just acknowledging that I think I understand the other point of view.

(Oh, and when I played rec league basketball, not even new girlfriends would be invited to those games because once they saw me play, they'd be old girlfriends.  Yes, I was that bad)

[brocks]

Better yet move to China, Cuba or North Korea - since you  preach communism, maybe you should live in a commie country,.

LOL, it's always nice to have a discussion with intelligent, reasonable people. Now if you'll excuse me, I have a busload of athletes I have to drive to the labor camp.

[clubchamp]

Originally Posted by x129

The services they provide are more important. The individuals are not worth as much.  When a guy shows up to fight your house fire, it doesn't really matter if he is the top .1% or just average. When you are watching a basketball game, it does. People want to see NBA games. Nobody (except new girlfriends) wants to go see a rec league game (i.e. average basketball player).

I see more it as the best fireman, nurse, teacher etc don't have the luxury of being able to deliver revenue to their place of work. Now the top NBA, NFL, MLB players do bring money to an organization in ticket sales, jerseys etc. Who should make what will always be a debate I mean even at a normal job there is generally at least one person in a company who is over paid.

[meenman]

Overpaid equals the morons that put a tip cup out when they get at least minimum wage, Tips are meant for those that work on a servers salary.