Hitting the long ball

[Mr3Wiggle]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

I've played a lot of courses where there are long forced carries  . . . if you wanted to take them on. Smart course design allows average hitters to get around no problem and allows bombers to challenge themselves. People who hit the ball a long way see the hole a different way. They can visualize carrying trees and hazards. They'll pick a line and setup aiming in directions a 200 yard driver never even imagined. But there's not always much to gain other than it's fun to cut a corner or carry a creek. When a round matters, laying up might be the smarter play. It depends on the day and the course. Sometimes flying the hazards leaves very wide landing area and sometimes it's not worth the risk. One thing is for certain though, a person who wonders whether to try and carry 270 yards with their driver is probably still capable of hitting the green with their second. True long hitters hit all their clubs long - especially their irons.

Agreed on that.

[k-troop]

It's not magic, and it's not roll.  Most of the courses I play, a well hit drive will pretty much stop within a few feet of where it lands.  With modern equipment the ball launches high fast and flies with a soaring trajectory, which is primarily where all of the added distance comes from.  If you're hitting the kind of shots that are likely to fly 280+, you're probably not consistently rolling the ball out more than 10 yards.

Disregard the roll you see on TV.  Those guys are playing courses with tight, firm fairways.  Play the same course a month later and the ball won't roll 1/3 as far.

I don't average 300.  I average about 280-285 in neutral conditions.  That means I might mis-hit one 260, and I might crush one 305.  Downwind, 340 isn't out of the question (though that's probably 320ish carry plus 15-20 yards of roll).  But in my last round at my usual course (where I know the distances very well), I carried a ball 330 on the 7th (downhill, downwind tee shot with a bunker that covers the left half of the fairway--I carried the right corner of the bunker which sits in the middle of the fairway at 320-325 from the tee) and 320 on the 9th (downwind 370 yard par-4; ball landed just over a mound that sits 60 yards from the green and kicked forward to about 15 yards from the front of the green).  I hit a ball 360 on the 13th, a downwind 470-yard par-4, but I don't know how far it flew because I didn't see it land.

http://www.mccshawaii.com/courseguide.shtml

My key to a good drive isn't how hard I swing, it's all about two things:  get a good wrist hinge when the left arm is parallel on the backswing, and turn my shoulders so that my back faces the target.  If I do these two things, I'm going to flush it more often than not.  And I can do these two things while swinging easy, but I also rip at the ball in certain situations and pick up an extra 20 yards.  When I swing hard, the two "keys" for me still apply, but I also have to concentrate on keeping my weight loaded on the inside of my right leg on the backswing, so that I can keep the torque moving in a positive direction and under control.

[Infamous 273]

Originally Posted by Aquaguru

Honestly I think with your swing your drives may carry 240, you may get 280 with roll.

Back to the OP.  The key for me on driving is all about speed.  I'm only 5'8'' 155lbs.  I have shorter arms to so I cannot get to parallel on my backswing easily.  So in order to drive it out there 260 I accelerate as fast as I can.  It really looks like I'm off balance but I don't feel it.  My driver is really about feel, I swing it different (ie plane, grip, tempo) every time out.  I usually figure it out after the first drive.

My farthest carry has been 270.  My farthest drive with roll has been 325.  Both of these were measured with my GPS using the shot distance program.

I do not consider myself a long hitter but I out drive all my playing partners and dad.  But when I get into tournament play I'm right in the middle of the pack

fwiw (probably not much), that's a 43.5" 75g x flex shaft, with an 8 degree head.  the ss needed (imho) to achieve a purposeful trajectory with this club would almost certainly guarantee a carry >240 yards.  i'm by no means a world-beater off the tee, but my average carry with a typical shot is easily >240 yards.

Originally Posted by sean_miller

I've played a lot of courses where there are long forced carries  . . . if you wanted to take them on. Smart course design allows average hitters to get around no problem and allows bombers to challenge themselves. People who hit the ball a long way see the hole a different way. They can visualize carrying trees and hazards. They'll pick a line and setup aiming in directions a 200 yard driver never even imagined. But there's not always much to gain other than it's fun to cut a corner or carry a creek. When a round matters, laying up might be the smarter play. It depends on the day and the course. Sometimes flying the hazards leaves very wide landing area and sometimes it's not worth the risk. One thing is for certain though, a person who wonders whether to try and carry 270 yards with their driver is probably still capable of hitting the green with their second. True long hitters hit all their clubs long - especially their irons.

this.

a good example of this with a pro is phil: he's 59th this season in driving distance, however, there are few golfers on tour who can consistently hit their irons longer.

[hendog]

Here's my 2 cents. Before this year I was lucky to hit a 270 yd drive. I'm talking Max-Max. I probably averaged 250-260 (and of course I thought it was more). For reference I am 5'9" and about 215lbs and having been an athlete for a good part of my life, pretty muscular although I have built up a nice soft candy shell :)

In January I got disgusted with my Driver swing. It was so wild and ridiculous that I knew I would never be able to be consistent with it. It basically had quick fix on top of quick fix until it looked nothing like my normal swing. So I went to the range and started over.

I started with premise that the only reason to hit the Driver is to hit the ball a LONG ways. Otherwise a 3 wood, 5 wood or hybrid would be better options. As an aside, I realize that the Driver is actually very forgiving with large heads etc but I still think that Driver is not the club most people pull out if they HAVE to hit the fairway. So I wanted to HIT the ball as HARD as I could. I differentiated between HITTING the ball hard versus SWINGING hard. HITTING it hard meant solid, center face, square contact. I started focusing on nothing but contact. As I improved there, I started seeing and feeling a difference since I was getting more and more out of the club itself. After all they are designed to explode the ball off the face.

The final piece was my back swing. I found that when I was relaxed and not all geared up that I hit the ball farther. Makes sense but I needed to know exactly why. I experimented and found that when relaxed I was actually allowing my wrists to hinge at the top of my swing. This was a seemingly small thing but resulted in more consistent contact (the club seemed to get into a better position) and more distance (the distance the head was traveling was greater but the time it took to travel that distance was essentially the same which of course = more speed).

It took some time and tweaks as I learned the perfect ball position and a few other minor set up details that helped improve consistency but I can confidently say that I am now averaging 280 off the tee with occasional 290-300 yd drives. More importantly, with a more fundamentally sound swing, I have been able to make adjustments to hit cuts and draws when needed. I am much more proud standing on the tee box and telling my buddies that I am going to start it down the left side and cut it back to the middle or going around a dogleg perfectly than I am hitting a 300 yd drive. People don't even realize its 300 anyway so who cares. In fact I have gotten more and more conservative and am happy with 280 down the middle knowing that if necessary or safe enough I can gear up and blast one.

All of this of course is contingent on the fact that I have a great driver that is fit to me perfectly. TM R9 SuperTri, stock Stiff shaft, open 1 degree with weights shifted to the toe and a Winn Mid-Size grip.

My handicap on Jan 1 2012 was 11.1.

It now sits @ 7.3

Ok that was more like my 75 cents but there it is.

[trackster]

I played a scramble the other day which had about 2 teams per hole.  We got to see the tee shots of the group in front of us on almost every hole, and all I could say was wow.  I am a longer hitter at least from the people I have golfed with.  Hit it about 240-265 on average.  I came up probably 25-30 yards short of where the group ahead of me hit their drives on almost every hole.  On one hole they had a tire 275 yards down the fairway, I hit about 5 yards short of the tire, and some one from their group almost hit the tire.  What I am getting at, is that the long ball does exist, but people don't realize how far 300 yards is.  The farthest hitter from there group was about 6'4 with an almost "perfect" swing.  I just enjoy all the I drive 300, but can hit an iron, wedge, or putter to save my life stories.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by trackster

I played a scramble the other day which had about 2 teams per hole.  We got to see the tee shots of the group in front of us on almost every hole, and all I could say was wow.  I am a longer hitter at least from the people I have golfed with.  Hit it about 240-265 on average.  I came up probably 25-30 yards short of where the group ahead of me hit their drives on almost every hole.  On one hole they had a tire 275 yards down the fairway, I hit about 5 yards short of the tire, and some one from their group almost hit the tire.  What I am getting at, is that the long ball does exist, but people don't realize how far 300 yards is.  The farthest hitter from there group was about 6'4 with an almost "perfect" swing.  I just enjoy all the I drive 300, but can hit an iron, wedge, or putter to save my life stories.

I don't recall reading about the irons and wedges, but a lot of long hitters struggle with putting. They're different.

[Lost-Ball]

i honestly cant say how long im hitting it. i mean i could talk all day about how long it goes on the golf course but thats different with roll and slopes and bla bla bla. everytime ive tried to go to D.S.G.s their tracker thing is always down. at the driving range i have never clearly seen the point were the signs are measured from. its an outdoor driving range where they move the line every other day. sometime it looks like im hitting the ball 270 - 290 and some times it looks like im hitting it 240 - 260 and sometimes it looks like im barely getting it pass the 200 yard sign. id love to really test out the two different shafts i have for my RBZ driver and compare carry, launch angle, roll and all that but dont seem like thats gonna happen.

[Stargaze]

Originally Posted by Lost-Ball

i honestly cant say how long im hitting it. i mean i could talk all day about how long it goes on the golf course but thats different with roll and slopes and bla bla bla. everytime ive tried to go to D.S.G.s their tracker thing is always down. at the driving range i have never clearly seen the point were the signs are measured from. its an outdoor driving range where they move the line every other day. sometime it looks like im hitting the ball 270 - 290 and some times it looks like im hitting it 240 - 260 and sometimes it looks like im barely getting it pass the 200 yard sign. id love to really test out the two different shafts i have for my RBZ driver and compare carry, launch angle, roll and all that but dont seem like thats gonna happen.

Do you have a smartphone?  If so you can get apps like skydroid that will help you get an idea how far you hit it.  I use it fairly often when I play to determine how many yards to the pin but you can also determine how far you drove.

[Lost-Ball]

Originally Posted by Stargaze

Do you have a smartphone?  If so you can get apps like skydroid that will help you get an idea how far you hit it.  I use it fairly often when I play to determine how many yards to the pin but you can also determine how far you drove.

i have all that but its just telling you total distance with roll and all. i wanna know carry. no elevated tees and wind and factoring in this and that just tee it up, hit it, and get some real numbers. if i was to go by my gps thing im averaging in the 270s

[hendog]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

I don't recall reading about the irons and wedges, but a lot of long hitters struggle with putting. They're different.

This is really the big point here. 330 all day is pointless if you can't play from 130 in. I spend a tremendous amount of time on that part of the game. I love that I can get the ball out there as it makes the game a lot easier since the clubs I hit on second shots are easier (generally speaking) but ever since I eclipsed the 270-275 avg mark I've stopped caring how far they go. I'll gladly give up 10 yards to be in the fairway. Unless its just a monster par 4 then 270 will usually put a wedge in my hand and if it goes a little farther then its just a different wedge but for me a wedge is a wedge so I don't care.

[Dave2512]

Originally Posted by Jason M Henley

This is really the big point here. 330 all day is pointless if you can't play from 130 in. I spend a tremendous amount of time on that part of the game. I love that I can get the ball out there as it makes the game a lot easier since the clubs I hit on second shots are easier (generally speaking) but ever since I eclipsed the 270-275 avg mark I've stopped caring how far they go. I'll gladly give up 10 yards to be in the fairway. Unless its just a monster par 4 then 270 will usually put a wedge in my hand and if it goes a little farther then its just a different wedge but for me a wedge is a wedge so I don't care.

Yep. Reminds me of all the women I play with that hit 3 short shots from their tee on the way to a 1 or 2 putt and score better than the guys playing with them. Definitely more to golf than hitting a long drive.

[saltman]

I consider myself solidly long, certainly not grossly long.  320yds is a reachable number, 290yds is probably slight mishit under the same conditions.  Over the years it has become much more of a curse than a blessing.  The greater the clubhead speed the greater the miss.  I can miss fairways by 75 yards without even blinking.  Try getting that out of your head the next time you step to the tee.  All that being said, I have never ever met an instructor that advised me to "swing easier".  The last instructor said we will work on everything BUT my swing to become more accurate.  Posture, grip, alignment and course managment.  These days, I hit about 2-3 drivers per round.  It's a club that scares the dark matter out of me.  I have a 3-iron that I can rely on for 240yds which makes most courses these days very playable.  I don't know where my distance comes from as I am all of 5'6",  I suspect I have much more lag in my swing than the average bloke.  That said I would gladly give someone 30 yds for 3 more fairways per round with a driver.  I'd love to play from 280yds in the fairway as opposed to 240 or 315 out of the fescue or worse yet hitting 3 off the tee!

[hendog]

Originally Posted by saltman

I consider myself solidly long, certainly not grossly long.  320yds is a reachable number, 290yds is probably slight mishit under the same conditions.  Over the years it has become much more of a curse than a blessing.  The greater the clubhead speed the greater the miss.  I can miss fairways by 75 yards without even blinking.  Try getting that out of your head the next time you step to the tee.  All that being said, I have never ever met an instructor that advised me to "swing easier".  The last instructor said we will work on everything BUT my swing to become more accurate.  Posture, grip, alignment and course managment.  These days, I hit about 2-3 drivers per round.  It's a club that scares the dark matter out of me.  I have a 3-iron that I can rely on for 240yds which makes most courses these days very playable.  I don't know where my distance comes from as I am all of 5'6",  I suspect I have much more lag in my swing than the average bloke.  That said I would gladly give someone 30 yds for 3 more fairways per round with a driver.  I'd love to play from 280yds in the fairway as opposed to 240 or 315 out of the fescue or worse yet hitting 3 off the tee!

I'm sure you have done all this but make sure you have the right shaft and loft on your driver not to mention potentially the face angle. I don't know if you spray it or have a consistent miss but with that distance you could miss the fairway and still gouge it on. 75 yard miss though is hard to recover from. 10-15 though is survivable depending on the course.

[MajorSlice]

Originally Posted by Stargaze

For those of you that can hit 280 - 330 yard drives, what do you think contributes most to your ability?  Is it the swing technique?  Is it the raw power you inject into your swing?

The reason I ask is because I was at the range the other day.  As I was walking along the range I saw this guy drive a couple balls.  It was so wild because it was like his swing was so "soft" yet the ball just took off like it was a rocket nice and straight.  His swing also seemed a little unothrodox, it was like during his back swing he allowed his head to move back to his right shoulder and then give this nice sweeping drive.

I want to learn how to have a nice solid drive but not have to "crush" the ball to do it.

i drive the ball over 300 yards a few times each round.  i dont know what i do to get it there.  i dont swing particularly hard.  i have a nice easy looking swing on tape.  obviously it feels like i am putting more into it that i am, but looking back on the video, it doesnt look like i am trying too hard.  my longest confirmed carry was 324 (ball plugged in the green) and my longest confirmed overall drive with roll is 340.

now my normal drive is around 270-ish with my slice.  i think i am just lucky.  i am tall with really long ape arms and legs.  i know i get a lot of my power from my legs and hips, but that is all i know about why i am able to get the distance i get.  my swing is not particularly nice and i have an outside to in swing pattern.

i wouldnt worry about your drive too much though.  it is only a very small part of your game.  you have your putter in your hand more than your driver, so i worry about that.

[mikelegacy]

I think a lot of people need to get new range finders that are posting in this thread...

[Jimbo Slice]

Originally Posted by mikelegacy

I think a lot of people need to get new range finders that are posting in this thread...

I assume you are talking about me, or allot of people lol, but mainly me. The only reason I say that is because you recently posted in a different thread, doubting my distances. I'm not sure why its such a far stretch for you. I know people exaggerate and lie about distances and scores, and it fun to jump in and call them out, but.... You have the wrong guy this time.  All my distances are accurate and quite frankly don't seem far fetch at all to me. I hit a 326 yard drive, measured, and you think it's improbable because of my inexperience and handicap?

I'm also getting the hint that your not saying my gps is not working correctly but more to the affect that I'm lying, is this correct?... lol jk. I know you where.

No hard feelings lol. It actually feels good when someone doubts your accomplishments saying there's just no way he could do that. It happened and will continue to happen, "True Story Bra" .

Here have some fun and look at the swing that produced a 326 yard drive on a calm day and flat hole. I will admit it's quite nasty looking. I would even go as far to say it doesn't look like it would produce a 300 yard plus drive. Even when the clubhead does line up at impact.... But it can, and has before. My Swing

The top swing was a practice ball, and I'm not to sure if you can tell, but the bottom swing produced about a 275 yard drive.

[Jeffrey71]

At the driving range I go to the farthest distance sign is 250 yards. I use this sign as my aim point. Whenever I hit my driver straight at it, 9 out of 10 times I will carry the full 250. I usually have to guess what the distance is off the tee. There has been a couple times where, off the furthest back tee spot, I have ended up on the green. The scorecard says 330yds. When I ask if the distances are correct I get told yes. I'm sure, because the ground is so very hard, I get a lot of roll. I think I really drive the ball, on the carry, 250-275. Truth be known, I prefer accuracy.

[Righty to Lefty]

Originally Posted by Lost-Ball

the harder you swing at it the less likely you are to be able to find it. i think keys to consistence "long" drives are

1. hitting the ball in the center of the club face

2. using your upper AND lower body. not just swing your arms fast

3. good balance and timing

4. LAG and trajectory

look at old Freddy Couples. hes still crushing the ball at his age and finding fairways and it looks like hes just taking a smooth practice swing.

It may look that way because his muscle are well coordinated but at some point his clubheads gotta hit the 115+ mph accelerating speed to get the ball to go as far as his does.  Trying to eliminate the urge to "hit" the ball is huge for me and I think staying target focused on where I want the ball to go.  Hitting a big ball is a gift and a curse though because like others have said if you short game is junk then you'll never score and most holes get really narrow at those distances.  Distance is only an advantage when you have the short game to take advantage of it.