Cutting down my putter

[Beachcomber]

So I'm currently playing a 34" length putter.  But over the course of the last several months, I've been experimenting with getting a premium stance/address posture such that I could do the following:

1.) Left and Right Forearms and Shaft all in the same line when the putter is soled behind the golf ball.

2.) My hands are directly underneath my shoulders.

3.) My palms are facing one another on the putter grip.

4.) My thumbs are down the grip (left hand higher than the right).

5.) My eyes are right over the golf ball - or just inside.

6.) The ball position is in the center - or slightly forward of center of my stance.

- The putter is in the middle of my stance and the ball is like 1" forward of the putter.

7.) The putter shaft is straight up and down - or slightly forward pressed.

8.) My elbows rest on my rib cage such that as I bend at the waist - my hands fall directly under my shoulder sockets.

9.) My upper back is fairly straight (bend from the waist).

10.) My weight is on the balls of my feet.

11.) My shoulders are very square to my intended putting line.

12.) My feet are also square to my intended putting line.

When I really dial this setup - I make a very nice controlled stroke.  The challenge that I have found is that to get into this premier position, my current 34" putter - I nearly have to grip it down at the steel.  I'm 5'8" tall... And when measuring from the palms of my hands horizontally - to the ground.... I'm getting a measurement of ~ 28".

Looking at this - I believe I should be able to cut the putter length down from 34" down to 31" or 30"... Has anyone done this type of mod with any success on their putter?

Back in December of last year, I ordered a 75g counterweight kit - and have yet to install it.  I'm thinking I'm going to go and get my putter cut down tomorrow to 30" - and have this counterweight installed with a new grip.  Any thoughts or input from the forum before I go and do this? Would like to hear from you guys as I want to make sure I'm not doing something that I will regret.

(This is my last ditched effort to salvage this putter I'm using - and if this doesn't work - then I'm going to get an Edel putter)

[David in FL]

Sorry, but I'm just trying to wrap my brain around 12 swing thoughts for a putt! :-D

[Beachcomber]

Originally Posted by David in FL

Sorry, but I'm just trying to wrap my brain around 12 swing thoughts for a putt!

Hahhaha these are not 12 swing thoughts... This is just what I do to get into my proper putting stance/hand placement - which is repeatable if done correctly.

Really the only thought I have is getting my elbows into my rib cage - to grip the putter in the proper spot - and ensure I'm over the ball with my eyes and lined up properly (putter is aimed properly).

The more you practice your setup/stance/posture - you can do this in like 5 seconds without thinking about any of those 12 steps... Other than maybe - asking yourself if you are aimed properly.

The problem with amateurs - like myself - is that I've never been formally fitted for my putter.  I bought a stock putter from a golf store and have been using it blindly without a lot of thought into how much having the proper alignments - and hand placement effects the quality of your putting stroke.

I have the Ping putting app for my iPhone - and when I do this correctly (12 items above) I can get a + putting handicap every time and roll putts beautifully.

[Paradox]

I use a 34 and I always choke down to the bottom of the grip..just always done it.  I wouldn't think of cutting my putter down just because I wouldn't want to risk changing how it feels with the way I do it.

[thescarecrow]

I cut my putter down from 34 inch to 30 inch as well as placing a counterweight in the .handle.

No regrets, putter feels comfortable. and I feel confident putting ..............Had it for a few years now.

If i purchased a new putter I would do the same.  I am also 5foot 8.

Do it....Good luck.

[Bullitt5339]

I didn't go quite as short, mine is 32", but I had it cut down for about the same reason.  I can just lean over and my arms hang comfortably and naturally, which has really helped me a lot.

Now I'm working on alignment.

[Ernest Jones]

Last season I bought a Yes! Putter that was 31.5" in clearance for $25. I figured, heck I can't turn that down, it'll only cost a couple bucks plus a grip to get it extended. Luckily I didn't get the mod done right away as I wanted to take it home and play with it (new toy syndrome :-)) because I was completely amazed at how much better I was hitting my line with this stumpy little stick LOL. Did a little research and discovered that a LOT of pros putt with putters that are significantly shorter that what is sold to us hacks. I highly recommend shortening your putter, I think you'll love the results based on your thoughts above. I can't speak to the weighted issues as mine was a stock 31.5 but you could just play around with some lead tape till you get the right mix.

[LBlack14]

Sorry, but I'm just trying to wrap my brain around 12 swing thoughts for a putt! :-D

Didn't you know that putting was rocket science???:-\

[David in FL]

The problem with amateurs - like myself - is that I've never been formally fitted for my putter.  I bought a stock putter from a golf store and have been using it blindly without a lot of thought into how much having the proper alignments - and hand placement effects the quality of your putting stroke.

Ditto. I firmly believe the next significant movement in my handicap is going to come on the putting green. I really think I can drop a stroke and a half if I just get my putting to the same level of mediocrity as the rest of my game....

[newtogolf]

I have thought about cutting down my putter as well.  I am most comfortable and seem to putt the best when my hands are at the bottom of the grip on a 34".  My fear is throwing off the weight of the putter and ruining a good putter.  If someone does it I'd be interested in how they went about it.

[dsc123]

Have you thought about trying to find a cheap putter with those specs just to see how you like it?  I am considering that because I am afraid of cutting mine down and then regretting it.  34" to 30" would be a really big change.

After watching those Mike Shannon videos on youtube i've been trying to adjust my putting posture and stroke to conform to his advice.  I'm 5'10" with a 35 inch putter and I am thinking about cutting it down to 33" or even 32".  Right now I'm just choking down and I bought some weights to add.

[dfreuter415]

I am 6'3" and began using a 33" putter back in the early 1990's. Because putting can be erratic at times, I have also tried regular length putters and long putters over the years, but that never lasts more than a round or two. By far, I have found that, for me, the short putter has proven most consistent over the last 20 years. So, I say, go ahead and cut down your putter, but use an old putter for the first one.  By the way, my wife and daughter both requested that I cut down their putters after they got frustrated with regular length ones. And, without exaggerating, I have to say that the shorter putter definitely improved their game.

Just as an added note: Phil Mickelson is also 6'3" and I've read uses either a 34 or a 33.5" putter. You might remember that in September of 2011 he began using a a 45-inch Odyssey Sabertooth with a White Hot XG insert. That experiment didn't last long as he used an Odyssey Black Series Tour Design #9 to win the Phoenix Open n February.  (This putter is very much like the Odyssey White Hot HG #9. And, I think this is the putter he used when he won his first Masters in 2004.)

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by David in FL

Sorry, but I'm just trying to wrap my brain around 12 swing thoughts for a putt!

Originally Posted by Beachcomber

Hahhaha these are not 12 swing thoughts... This is just what I do to get into my proper putting stance/hand placement ...

Nonsense!  I think David is dead on.  Here I helped you ...

Just print out about 40 of those and bring them with you next time you play, whenever that happens to be ;)  Give them to your caddy or playing partner, along with a pencil, and I included handy little boxes for him to check off each of the keys for each putt.  Once he's checked each box, he'll give you the go-ahead and you can then hit your putt.

Also, don't forget to check if you're breathing in or out during your backstroke.

[Na5carr3]

I carry a pool cue for putting. Works well.

[Beachcomber]

Ok, meet the Ghost of Frankenstein...

I took my 34" Ghost Spider and cut it down to 32".  I also added a removable 75g counterweight which was installed into in the Super Stroke 3.0 grip.  The counterweight in the grip can go heavier or lighter... And I'll dial this in overtime... But practicing my lag putting - I was doing pretty well with the 75g counterweight.

Also, in the current setup, I have two removable 10g weights in the toe and heal of the head.... Which places the head into the 372g footprint.  But b ecause I was worried that the head would feel too light given I added the 75g counterweight into the grip - I also ordered 2x 20g weights today on Ebay to help increase the toe and heel weight if I decide that the head is too light... This would give me the option of going with a 392g head which would push me into the D-5 swingweight... Currently I'm at C-9 which is possibly too light?  But the removable weights won't be here until next week for me to toy around with.

I'm starting to really like this setup though as it is going to give me a lot of freedom to experiment...

(1.) I can increase/decrease the counterweight - easily with the Tour Lock weights.

(2.) I can increase/decrease the weight in the head - easily with the Taylormade weights.

(3.) I can finally grip down and get into the proper stance comfortably now that the putter is cut down to 32".

First practice session with it went well.  I drained several long putts with it.  And I can't wait to get some rounds under my belt with this puppy.

[newtogolf]

Originally Posted by Beachcomber

Ok, meet the Ghost of Frankenstein...

I took my 34" Ghost Spider and cut it down to 32".  I also added a removable 75g counterweight which was installed into in the Super Stroke 3.0 grip.  The counterweight in the grip can go heavier or lighter... And I'll dial this in overtime... But practicing my lag putting - I was doing pretty well with the 75g counterweight.

Also, in the current setup, I have two removable 10g weights in the toe and heal of the head.... Which places the head into the 372g footprint.  But because I was worried that the head would feel too light given I added the 75g counterweight into the grip - I also ordered 2x 20g weights today on Ebay to help increase the toe and heel weight if I decide that the head is too light... This would give me the option of going with a 392g head which would push me into the D-5 swingweight... Currently I'm at C-9 which is possibly too light?  But the removable weights won't be here until next week for me to toy around with.

I'm starting to really like this setup though as it is going to give me a lot of freedom to experiment...

(1.) I can increase/decrease the counterweight - easily with the Tour Lock weights.

(2.) I can increase/decrease the weight in the head - easily with the Taylormade weights.

(3.) I can finally grip down and get into the proper stance comfortably now that the putter is cut down to 32".

First practice session with it went well.  I drained several long putts with it.  And I can't wait to get some rounds under my belt with this puppy.

How are you determining the weight difference from cutting the length down by 2", is there some math formula to calculate it or are you doing it strictly by feel.  Did you adjust the weight of the putter head after you added the Super Stroke?  I'm asking because my instructor told me some of the SS grips are heavier and throw off the swing weight and feel of the head.

I was thinking if I cut down the length of the putter shaft and went with a SS I'd get close to original swing weight but I'm not sure how to verify that before I do it.

[Beachcomber]

Originally Posted by newtogolf

How are you determining the weight difference from cutting the length down by 2", is there some math formula to calculate it or are you doing it strictly by feel.  Did you adjust the weight of the putter head after you added the Super Stroke?  I'm asking because my instructor told me some of the SS grips are heavier and throw off the swing weight and feel of the head.

I was thinking if I cut down the length of the putter shaft and went with a SS I'd get close to original swing weight but I'm not sure how to verify that before I do it.

Good question... And I'd like to hear others chime in on this as well.  Because I'm no master club fitter/maker... Just a weekend hack - that is trying to find a stick that can help me shave a stroke or two from my average.  But here is what/why I've done what I've done.

(1.) The Putter Head Weight

The Ghost Spider stock putter head is 360g according to Taylormade.

- Head of the putter is actually 348g with two removable weights...

- The putter is shipped with two 6g weights, this is how they get the 360g head weight

(2.) The Putter Shaft Weight

The Taylormade Ghost Spider stock putter shaft appears to be the True Temper double bend stock shaft?  This is a guesstimate on my part - but looking at Golfworks club building site - this looks like the stock shaft being used...

So the shaft is advertised as 38" and 122g from Golfworks.  TaylorMade obviously cut it down to the standard 34" length which is what I purchased the putter at.  So the shaft in the Taylormade is going to be lighter than advertised by Golfworks given 4" of steel was cut off.  From reading and researching, it is estimated that e ach inch the steel putter shaft is cut down, you are reducing the weight of the club by approximately 3.2g. So I'm lead to believe that the Taylormade Ghost Spider 34" stock putter shaft is 109g.

(3.) The Putter Grip

According to Taylormade, the Ghost Spider has a stock 57g pistol grip.

So looking at the stock Taylormade putter... 360g head + 109g shaft + 57g grip = 526g approximate total club weight at 34". With the 526g overall weight of the club... I had a baseline to work with to get an idea of how much I was modifying the swingweight.

Modification 1.0

a.) Replaced the two stock 6g Taylormade weights with 10g weights, increasing the stock putter head from 360g up to 372g.

b.) Replacing the stock Taylormade 57g grip with a Winn Jumbo 126g putter grip.

*Going to the Winn Jumbo grip acted as a counterweight = 69g

Overall Putter Weight = 607g

I played for several months with the 607g mods... And found that I still wasn't happy with the setup.  So this lead me to make additional mods.

Modification 2.0

a.) Cut the putter down from 34" to 32".... Which is approximately 6g of reduction in weight just by cutting the shaft 2" (using the estimated 3.2g per inch rule of thumb)

b.) Replacing the Winn Jumbo 126g putter grip with the Super Stroke Slim 3.0 60g... 66g reduction

c.) Added a Tour Lock 75g counterweight into the butt end of the grip

Overall Putter Weight = 610g

So the current Frankenstein Ghost Spider is rocking out at 610g total weight, 372g head weight at 32".  The swingweight according to this Maltby matrix shows the stick at C-9, and I'll be able to bump it up to D-5 once I receive the new weights for the head:

The thing that I haven't been able to find - is how counterweight effects the clubs swingweight. But it looks like the measurements would be to simply place the fulcrum 14" down the club (from the butt end), and weigh the head of the putter?  Maybe someone familiar with this can chime in and help clarify?  But I believe that counterweighting (or adding a heavier grip) will make the head feel lighter - but it's not basic addition by subtraction.  Because the Super Stroke grip (non-tapered) helps you take some of the wrist movement out of the stroke.  And going with a counterweight, has been found to help smooth out the stroke as well. And I've used my iPing putting app which shows I can get a + Handicap more frequently by going with these thicker grips and added weight.

[SCfanatic35]

Originally Posted by Beachcomber

Good question... And I'd like to hear others chime in on this as well.  Because I'm no master club fitter/maker... Just a weekend hack - that is trying to find a stick that can help me shave a stroke or two from my average.  But here is what/why I've done what I've done.

(1.) The Putter Head Weight

The Ghost Spider stock putter head is 360g according to Taylormade.

- Head of the putter is actually 348g with two removable weights...

- The putter is shipped with two 6g weights, this is how they get the 360g head weight

(2.) The Putter Shaft Weight

The Taylormade Ghost Spider stock putter shaft appears to be the True Temper double bend stock shaft?  This is a guesstimate on my part - but looking at Golfworks club building site - this looks like the stock shaft being used...

So the shaft is advertised as 38" and 122g from Golfworks.  TaylorMade obviously cut it down to the standard 34" length which is what I purchased the putter at.  So the shaft in the Taylormade is going to be lighter than advertised by Golfworks given 4" of steel was cut off.  From reading and researching, it is estimated that each inch the steel putter shaft is cut down, you are reducing the weight of the club by approximately 3.2g. So I'm lead to believe that the Taylormade Ghost Spider 34" stock putter shaft is 109g.

(3.) The Putter Grip

According to Taylormade, the Ghost Spider has a stock 57g pistol grip.

So looking at the stock Taylormade putter... 360g head + 109g shaft + 57g grip = 526g approximate total club weight at 34".  With the 526g overall weight of the club... I had a baseline to work with to get an idea of how much I was modifying the swingweight.

Modification 1.0

a.) Replaced the two stock 6g Taylormade weights with 10g weights, increasing the stock putter head from 360g up to 372g.

b.) Replacing the stock Taylormade 57g grip with a Winn Jumbo 126g putter grip.

*Going to the Winn Jumbo grip acted as a counterweight = 69g

Overall Putter Weight = 607g

I played for several months with the 607g mods... And found that I still wasn't happy with the setup.  So this lead me to make additional mods.

Modification 2.0

a.) Cut the putter down from 34" to 32".... Which is approximately 6g of reduction in weight just by cutting the shaft 2" (using the estimated 3.2g per inch rule of thumb)

b.) Replacing the Winn Jumbo 126g putter grip with the Super Stroke Slim 3.0 60g... 66g reduction

c.) Added a Tour Lock 75g counterweight into the butt end of the grip

Overall Putter Weight = 610g

So the current Frankenstein Ghost Spider is rocking out at 610g total weight, 372g head weight at 32".  The swingweight according to this Maltby matrix shows the stick at C-9, and I'll be able to bump it up to D-5 once I receive the new weights for the head:

The thing that I haven't been able to find - is how counterweight effects the clubs swingweight.  But it looks like the measurements would be to simply place the fulcrum 14" down the club (from the butt end), and weigh the head of the putter?  Maybe someone familiar with this can chime in and help clarify?  But I believe that counterweighting (or adding a heavier grip) will make the head feel lighter - but it's not basic addition by subtraction.  Because the Super Stroke grip (non-tapered) helps you take some of the wrist movement out of the stroke.  And going with a counterweight, has been found to help smooth out the stroke as well.  And I've used my iPing putting app which shows I can get a + Handicap more frequently by going with these thicker grips and added weight.

All I read was,  (1.) The Putter Head Weight, and then I started feeling light-headed. I'm glad there are people like you know in the world who know this stuff so people like me can just worry about playing golf.