Patrick Reed - Is he arrogant?

[Golfingdad]

Umm, I don't think it matters much because it is THE MASTERS.

Right.  A tournament that history has shown requires a lot of experience.  So it's Reed's first Masters, and it's also his major of any kind ... it would not be a stretch to predict that he'll not do well.  It would, however, be a stretch for anybody to then say "see, I told you that he would play bad because his arrogance hurt him."  That would be silly, because, like you said ... that kind of stuff is not going to bother people who don't worry about what other people think of them, and Reed has yet to show, to this point, that he does worry about what others think of him.

Also, just because he said he's number 5 doesn't add pressure. What ever his mind thinks is what pressure he is going to feel. Heck he could think he's number 5 and not say it and still feel the same pressure even if have or had not said it. Saying something doesn't add anything to it.

I wouldn't go this far.  Saying something could certainly add pressure.

Lebron James, for example, could have kept his mouth shut when he went to Miami, and could have retired after last season as a god if he wanted to.  But since he promised "not 2, not 3, not 4, not 5, etc, etc" championships, he put more pressure on himself to deliver those.  He could think to himself that he's going to win every title and every MVP until he retires, but there is no pressure on him to do that, because nobody is expecting it.  Once he tells the world though, there could be some pressure.

There isn't necessarily going to be pressure, because everybody performs differently under different conditions, but there definitely COULD be.

[albatross]

Sorry, but this is just my opinion and you aren't going to change my mind.  I think it's common sense that if you decide to boast about yourself, it puts more pressure on you if you start to play poorly.  You can't help but think about how good you just told the golf world you are.  You can continue to debate it, but I think it's psychology 101 and the truth.

[Crim]

Say what you want, but golf is a mental game, and we'll see if I'm right.

LOL, if he plays poor at the Masters that doesn't automatically mean it's because he said he thought he was top 5 in the world over a month ago. I think that's stretching...and not just regular stretching....Jimenez stretching.

[saevel25]

Sorry, but this is just my opinion and you aren't going to change my mind.  I think it's common sense that if you decide to boast about yourself, it puts more pressure on you if you start to play poorly.  You can't help but think about how good you just told the golf world you are.  You can continue to debate it, but I think it's psychology 101 and the truth.

Yet the human condition is such that you can not make such generalizations. If the study of the human mind tells psychologist anything that they can not make general based assumptions.

Some people who might seem the strongest willed person would crumble under pressure. While some silent types are actually the strongest. Its also the reverse as well. Unless you sat down with Reed and actually psychoanalyzed him, you know nothing about who Reed is. You are just assuming based what you think is true. I have assumed nothing. Could he face more pressure, yes, but I will not assume he will.

Even if he does, even if he does fail at the Masters. Lets say he misses the cut, it doesn't mean it was due to what he said. It could be some sort of other pressure. It could be just the pressure of winning his first Masters. We wont know unless Reed tells us.

[albatross]

LOL, if he plays poor at the Masters that doesn't automatically mean it's because he said he thought he was top 5 in the world over a month ago. I think that's stretching...and not just regular stretching....Jimenez stretching.

I didn't say it would definitely be for that reason.  I was referring to my previous posts and my prediction that he plays poorly and misses the cut.  I just think that there will be times he'll struggle at Augusta, and the comments he made will make it more difficult, mentally, to recover.  There's already enough pressure around those grounds, and I think he added some more for himself when things get tough.

[albatross]

Yet the human condition is such that you can not make such generalizations. If the study of the human mind tells psychologist anything that they can not make general based assumptions.

Some people who might seem the strongest willed person would crumble under pressure. While some silent types are actually the strongest. Its also the reverse as well. Unless you sat down with Reed and actually psychoanalyzed him, you know nothing about who Reed is. You are just assuming based what you think is true. I have assumed nothing. Could he face more pressure, yes, but I will not assume he will.

Even if he does, even if he does fail at the Masters. Lets say he misses the cut, it doesn't mean it was due to what he said. It could be some sort of other pressure. It could be just the pressure of winning his first Masters. We wont know unless Reed tells us.

I think the comparison you make with yourself is  pretty amusing.  I don't know what you do for a living, but I'm guessing you weren't a headline in the newspapers this weekend, discussed on every major sports show, or interviewed on NBC and the Golf Channel.  I think that adds just a "little" more pressure to Patrick Reed's situation than it would yours.  I could be wrong about that.

And I disagree with your statement on generalizations.  I don't think ANYONE is immune to pressure.  He might handle it well if he gets in a jam at Augusta, but he's still going to feel pressure!  And I think it's more pressure than he would have had to deal with if he hadn't boasted so much.

I'm done debating. I'm fully convinced of my position, so for fun, predict where Reed finishes at Augusta.

[saevel25]

I think the comparison you make with yourself is  pretty amusing.  I don't know what you do for a living, but I'm guessing you weren't a headline in the newspapers this weekend, discussed on every major sports show, or interviewed on NBC and the Golf Channel.  I think that adds just a "little" more pressure to Patrick Reed's situation than it would yours.  I could be wrong about that.

And I disagree with your statement on generalizations.  I don't think ANYONE is immune to pressure.  He might handle it well if he gets in a jam at Augusta, but he's still going to feel pressure!  And I think it's more pressure than he would have had to deal with if he hadn't boasted so much.

I'm done debating. I'm fully convinced of my position, so for fun, predict where Reed finishes at Augusta.

Yea, notice I took that out pretty quick , hence its not in your quote. So I would say, "I don't know what you are talking about"

I never said he was immune to pressure. I am just not assuming he's going to fail do to a certain type of pressure.

If you check the thread about who you think will win the Masters, you see I put Reed on the list. Just because I would like to see him squash all those who complained about him boasting about himself.

[albatross]

Yea, notice I took that out pretty quick , hence its not in your quote. So I would say, "I don't know what you are talking about"

I never said he was immune to pressure. I am just not assuming he's going to fail do to a certain type of pressure.

If you check the thread about who you think will win the Masters, you see I put Reed on the list. Just because I would like to see him squash all those who complained about him boasting about himself.

You chicken.  Removing the best part of your post that I could nail you on. Fair enough man.  We'll see how the kid does.  This thread will come back to get 1 of us.  Or maybe he'll finish somewhere in the middle.  We can agree on this- We both want April to get here.

[Golfingdad]

You chicken.  Removing the best part of your post that I could nail you on.    Fair enough man.  We'll see how the kid does.  This thread will come back to get 1 of us.  Or maybe he'll finish somewhere in the middle.  We can agree on this- We both want April to get here.

He just got lucky with the timing.  I think if he was slower, or you were a little faster, even though he editted his own post, the quote would remain as you saw it.  That would have been pretty funny. ;)  What's even funnier is when somebody edits a post to add to it, and then you quote it, and your quote box has more stuff in it than the original immediately above.  You're like, "where'd that come from???"  ;)

Anyways, I don't think that either of you will get bitten by this thread, because it's pretty likely (just based on Masters history) that newcomers struggle there, yet there would be no way to correllate his struggles to this "controversy."  (Not the right word, but what can I say ... I ain't no thesaurus!)

[albatross]

He just got lucky with the timing.  I think if he was slower, or you were a little faster, even though he editted his own post, the quote would remain as you saw it.  That would have been pretty funny. ;)  What's even funnier is when somebody edits a post to add to it, and then you quote it, and your quote box has more stuff in it than the original immediately above.  You're like, "where'd that come from???"  ;)

Anyways, I don't think that either of you will get bitten by this thread, because it's pretty likely (just based on Masters history) that newcomers struggle there, yet there would be no way to correllate his struggles to this "controversy."  (Not the right word, but what can I say ... I ain't no thesaurus!)

Ha ha.  No doubt.  And you're right. I was never saying that it's the only reason Reed might struggle.  It's the biggest stage he's been on, and frankly, he might be able to win at Doral missing 14 greens, but not at Augusta.  Either way, it will be fun to see how he handles it.

[mvmac]

I disagree.  I think that he also generated a lot of negative buzz, and I think it will impact him at Augusta.  He's now ignored the world rankings and proclaimed himself a top 5 player.  In my opinion, it will hurt him mentally during his first major if he starts to make mistakes.

Did you see this? He talks about what he meant by the top 5 comment.

I think he's going to feel more pressure because it's his first major and it's the Masters, not because of an interview.

Callaway Podcast where they talk to Reed about his comments. Just need to listen from 2:50 to about 6:00

https://soundcloud.com/callawaygolf/interview-with-patrick-reed-03-10

Executive summary

- Just won the biggest tournament of his life and he was pumped up.

- His goal is to be one of the best players in the world

- What he really meant by his comments is that if he kept playing the way he's been, he'll become a top 5 player in the world

It has potential to work against him, it depends on how well he handles pressure.  Some people put extra pressure on themselves because they feed off of it.  Others crumble under it.  There's no way to know how Reed will respond.  He might also have a few hecklers in the gallery which might annoy or anger him as well.

And going by his track record he does pretty well under pressure.

What he says in an interview doesn't put any more or less pressure on his game. For a few it might, but I don't think Reed is that guy, I don't see him caring about what other people think of him.

Also @Albatros , please make sure to multi-quote

[Golfingdad]

What he says in an interview doesn't put any more or less pressure on his game. For a few it might, but I don't think Reed is that guy, I don't see him caring about what other people think of him.

I, on the other hand, would totally feel more pressure because I do care (way more than I should) what others think of me.  But I agree that Reed, and for that matter, pretty much the entirety of the PGA tour, doesn't have time for that kind of silly pressure.

Also @Albatros, please make sure to multi-quote

Yeah!  The fewer times that damn bird stares into my soul while I'm trying to type, the better!  Talk about pressure!!!

[albatross]

Did you see this? He talks about what he meant by the top 5 comment.

I think he's going to feel more pressure because it's his first major and it's the Masters, not because of an interview.

And going by his track record he does pretty well under pressure.

What he says in an interview doesn't put any more or less pressure on his game. For a few it might, but I don't think Reed is that guy, I don't see him caring about what other people think of him.

Also @Albatros, please make sure to multi-quote

I, on the other hand, would totally feel more pressure because I do care (way more than I should) what others think of me.  But I agree that Reed, and for that matter, pretty much the entirety of the PGA tour, doesn't have time for that kind of silly pressure.

Yeah!  The fewer times that damn bird stares into my soul while I'm trying to type, the better!  Talk about pressure!!!

Gotcha.  There you go. I've learned a new skill.

[saevel25]

I, on the other hand, would totally feel more pressure because I do care (way more than I should) what others think of me.  But I agree that Reed, and for that matter, pretty much the entirety of the PGA tour, doesn't have time for that kind of silly pressure.

Yeah!  The fewer times that damn bird stares into my soul while I'm trying to type, the better!  Talk about pressure!!!

You mean the part were you hit a golf ball out of a bar, over the water, to make the albatross, I mean Pelican fly off its perch.

[MS256]

I, on the other hand, would totally feel more pressure because I do care (way more than I should) what others think of me.

Seems to me that golf would be a bad game for people that care very much what others think.

Just about the time I think my game is good enough to at least be embarrassment-proof the golfing gods put me back in my place.

[club ho]

I can not begin to fathom what it is like to play on the PGA tour. I do know that as a 8-10 handicap confidence is paramount to having a good round. When things are going real good in my life I play the best golf. If something has me preocupied then the round is not that good. I'd say this guy has everything going for him and he feels it. I would not count him out of the Masters. Three wins millions of dollars a beautiful wife about to give him a child. Reed has every reason to feel the way he does. Making the statement that he is a top 5 in the world may have been a bit of a gaff but if he wins again on the tour this year he would have to be close to that number anyway.

[RightEdge]

I think the comparison you make with yourself is  pretty amusing.  I don't know what you do for a living, but I'm guessing you weren't a headline in the newspapers this weekend, discussed on every major sports show, or interviewed on NBC and the Golf Channel.  I think that adds just a "little" more pressure to Patrick Reed's situation than it would yours.  I could be wrong about that.

And I disagree with your statement on generalizations.  I don't think ANYONE is immune to pressure.  He might handle it well if he gets in a jam at Augusta, but he's still going to feel pressure!  And I think it's more pressure than he would have had to deal with if he hadn't boasted so much.

I'm done debating. I'm fully convinced of my position, so for fun, predict where Reed finishes at Augusta.

I'm going to agree with what some of the other pro golfers said in later interviews.  A few players mentioned that the course was REALLY tough and people were severely penalized even when they made great shots.  There were comments that on this course luck was much more of a factor than at other courses.  You could hit a perfect shot two feet from the pin and still roll right in the water and drop 2 shots because of it.  How many players made good shots and actually hit the green and ended up in the water when on a reasonable course it most likely would have ended in a birdie?

Now go back and think about some of the not so good shots that hit the outer edge of the green and ended with a 2 put par. Now factor in that Reed only won by 1 shot and I would have to agree with the other pro golfers.  Luck had too much impact on this course. I know that somebody is gonna say that they all had to play the same course and that is absolutely true.  However, I saw too many really good shots that ended in double, triple and quadruple bogeys. Hell some guys had 8s, 9s,10s.  Didn't somebody actually have an 11?  That is utterly ridiculous to design a green that penalizes good shots like that.

I watched the entire thing and people say Reed made some great shots.  He did, but there were some guys that made BETTER shots that got royally screwed.  I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that on a course with reasonably designed slopes on the greens Reed would not have won against THAT field.  That is my opinion and I am allowed to have one.

[albatross]

I'm going to agree with what some of the other pro golfers said in later interviews.  A few players mentioned that the course was REALLY tough and people were severely penalized even when they made great shots.  There were comments that on this course luck was much more of a factor than at other courses.  You could hit a perfect shot two feet from the pin and still roll right in the water and drop 2 shots because of it.  How many players made good shots and actually hit the green and ended up in the water when on a reasonable course it most likely would have ended in a birdie?

Now go back and think about some of the not so good shots that hit the outer edge of the green and ended with a 2 put par. Now factor in that Reed only won by 1 shot and I would have to agree with the other pro golfers.  Luck had too much impact on this course. I know that somebody is gonna say that they all had to play the same course and that is absolutely true.  However, I saw too many really good shots that ended in double, triple and quadruple bogeys. Hell some guys had 8s, 9s,10s.  Didn't somebody actually have an 11?  That is utterly ridiculous to design a green that penalizes good shots like that.

I watched the entire thing and people say Reed made some great shots.  He did, but there were some guys that made BETTER shots that got royally screwed.  I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that on a course with reasonably designed slopes on the greens Reed would not have won against THAT field.  That is my opinion and I am allowed to have one.

I agree with this.