Is or should there be artificial turf golf courses? (re: California drought)

[rkim291968]

I think some of you may not be aware of improvements made to artificial turf technology.   Less than one mile from my house, they built two artificial soccer fields some years ago.   It's not a "mat" as you know from the old days.   It won't dry and shrink as you think.   Google "artificial turf" and you will see that there are many different type of turfs that can simulate various fairway, rough, and green conditions.

[Dave2512]

That stuff is tough. We have lots of outdoor turf here CO, stadiums, people use it in yards etc. If you've never been here in summer 100 degrees at 5000 feet is brutal. Problem with it is not cheap and not maintenance free.

[newtogolf]

I understand the severity of the drought but not watering a golf course can be catastrophic to the course and club that is associated with it unless the course was designed for minimal watering.  Once all that grass burns off and dies, I'd think it would be very difficult and expensive to restore the course to playable conditions once  the water tables are restored.

[Dave2512]

Don't they put ponds on CA courses. I just looked CA gets more annual precipitation than CO. Every course I can think of here has water all over the place. It's not really in play just holding ponds for watering the course.

[Lihu]

Don't they put ponds on CA courses. I just looked CA gets more annual precipitation than CO. Every course I can think of here has water all over the place. It's not really in play just holding ponds for watering the course.

Yeah, we let water run off every time it rains here. We don't have as good a rain capturing system like in CO. I stayed in Fort Collins for a while and remember all the reservoirs in the area. . .

[Dave2512]

Grey water reclamation is big here.

[Lihu]

Grey water reclamation is big here.

It should be bigger here. We had enough rainfall in a couple of the storms to fill most of our water supplies, but we let rivers of it pour off into the ocean.

Sometimes, CA policies are not conducive to an efficient or conservation friendly way of doing things. . .It's because we have a leading political party devoid of any practical engineering sense.

[rkim291968]

Don't they put ponds on CA courses. I just looked CA gets more annual precipitation than CO. Every course I can think of here has water all over the place. It's not really in play just holding ponds for watering the course.

Most of water hazard (pond, man made creek) are dried out on purpose or b/c of drought.   Last year, my home course was told to cut down water usage by 25%.   Almost immediately, fairway condition deteriorated.  Some vegetation were left to dry out which helped scoring.   If the course is told to conserve more water, they will have to import East Coast snow.   That may translate into higher membership fee.  Oh, wait.  Maybe, that's why they increased the membership cost last year.    Ok, enough rambling.     At least, tee boxes can go turf without impacting the overall golf experience IMO.   This may save water a bit but more water saving measures had to be put in, especially, when the course is told to cut more water usage.

[Dave2512]

We have no choice with just 15" or so annual precipitation and 265 dry days. I drove through some places on the western slope last week that looked like the surface of Mars. Funny how many people think CO is some kind of perpetual snowscape.

Anyway we got a new pro and super and they've been working on the irrigation system all winter. When I started playing there in 2012 there were a few greens and boxes showing bare dirt. As it is with all they've done I don't think they can save 1/3 of the 5th green. The patches they put in last year are crumbling into dust, can't even put a hole on that side.

I predict a dry summer here. I crossed the divide last week and there was no snow below 9000 feet and little at the very top. Vail pass melted quite a bit in just a few days and we had snow just ten days ago or so.

[Lihu]

Most of water hazard (pond, man made creek) are dried out on purpose or b/c of drought.   Last year, my home course was told to cut down water usage by 25%.   Almost immediately, fairway condition deteriorated.  Some vegetation were left to dry out which helped scoring.   If the course is told to conserve more water, they will have to import East Coast snow.   That may translate into higher membership fee.  Oh, wait.  Maybe, that's why they increased the membership cost last year.    Ok, enough rambling.     At least, tee boxes can go turf without impacting the overall golf experience IMO.   This may save water a bit but more water saving measures had to be put in, especially, when the course is told to cut more water usage.

I could get used to courses that are primarily natural vegetation (or desert), and small patches of fairway and green. It looks nicer to me, and has a distinctly So. CA about it. Same with Nor. Cal. I could see a course with the natural surroundings with small patches of grass.

If I want a plush green course, I'll go east to play. . .

[Dave2512]

Most of water hazard (pond, man made creek) are dried out on purpose or b/c of drought.   Last year, my home course was told to cut down water usage by 25%.   Almost immediately, fairway condition deteriorated.  Some vegetation were left to dry out which helped scoring.   If the course is told to conserve more water, they will have to import East Coast snow.   That may translate into higher membership fee.  Oh, wait.  Maybe, that's why they increased the membership cost last year.    Ok, enough rambling.     At least, tee boxes can go turf without impacting the overall golf experience IMO.   This may save water a bit but more water saving measures had to be put in, especially, when the course is told to cut more water usage.

I play some places with mats used for tees on par 3's it's not a good thing. Looks bad, feels bad and just sucks and I don't mind hitting off mats.

[rkim291968]

I play some places with mats used for tees on par 3's it's not a good thing. Looks bad, feels bad and just sucks and I don't mind hitting off mat.

I'd have no problem to hit off the mat from tee boxes while drought is severe.   Water shortage is serious.   Golf is just a game.   As far as I am concerned, turning tee boxes into turf/mat is a low hanging fruit to save a little bit of water.

[Dave2512]

I'd have no problem to hit off the mat from tee boxes while drought is severe.   Water shortage is serious.   Golf is just a game.   As far as I am concerned, turning tee boxes into turf/mat is a low hanging fruit to save a little bit of water.

But how much impact would just that have? 18 tee boxes 3 a hole or so is what maybe 1/2 acre of land total. I see the problem as courses trying be huge parks of lawn rather than building to suit the local climate utilizing existing conditions. The course I play most here is built around natural gas wells. They didn't do anything to pretty it up. It's enough grass to make a hole surrounded by prairie. I think the problem in CA is as much about mindset as drought. They could build more efficient courses out there.

[rkim291968]

But how much impact would just that have? 18 tee boxes 3 a hole or so is what maybe 1/2 acre of land total. I see the problem as courses trying be huge parks of lawn rather than building to suit the local climate utilizing existing conditions. The course I play most here is built around natural gas wells. They didn't do anything to pretty it up. It's enough grass to make a hole surrounded by prairie. I think the problem in CA is as much about mindset as drought. They could build more efficient courses out there.

It'd not save much water but it'd be a start.

You are right about CA golf courses.   They are built to assume there are plenty of water available - lush greens, trees, ponds, pools, ...   I played a few Las Vegas, and other desert area courses and they were designed to use less water.

Screen golf anyone?  I heard it is all the rage in East Asian countries, with league/tournaments and everything.

[newtogolf]

I wonder if they have considered the increased risk of fire given the drought combined with reduced watering of the golf course will make it much easier for a lit cigarette or cigar to ignite the grass and brush.

[Dave2512]

Not sure but I see butts all over the place in the middle of summer.

[mdl]

There are a couple all sand courses in KSA. The greens are not kept well, but I heard they can be putt on.. Basically there is a line deciding the fairway and the rough, if you hit the ball in the fairway you can use a special rug you carry around, if you are in the rough you can use the rug but have to take a penalty stroke.. Something like that I'm not sure, I was told about it when I first got here, and I never had the interest to go try.

A little different obviously from an all synthetic golf course, but I can imagine this would be considered golf about as much as the sand golf course I described above.. Just wouldn't work IMO.

I have a friend who grew up on an ARAMCO campus in Saudi who use to play one of those sand courses.  He said the one he played at had an attendant at every green who'd run around in circles dragging  a little grader mat behind him between each group to smooth out the sand for the next group's putts.  Same thing with the little turf mats you carry around there too.  He seemed to think it wasn't bad, but obviously wouldn't trade it for grass courses!

[dfreuter415]

While this is not an 18 hole golf course, Dave Pelz has found that synthetic grass has definite benefits....

The house where the short-game guru Dave Pelz lives, in the foothills west of Austin, Tex., has practice grounds designed to fit its owner’s fantasies. Just outside his back door, Pelz can take dead aim at faithful reproductions of his favorite targets: the 12th green at Augusta, fronted by a creek and an alabaster bunker; the 17th at Sawgrass, ringed by water; and the 14th at Pebble Beach, with its tiny tabletop green. The elaborate landscape, also features tributes to the 17th at Pebble, the 13th at Augusta and the Road Hole at St. Andrews, along with enough practice greens, skewed at different angles, to keep Ben Crenshaw endlessly entertained. The short-game facility extends across two-acres of SYNLawn synthetic turf that never requires watering or mowing, and that features a special patent-pending underlayment that allows his putting surfaces to receive shots like real bent- and Bermuda grass greens.

http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/golf-short-game-guru-dave-pelz-still-changing-game-golf