Bogey Golfers Only (Index 16-22) / Breaking 90 Topic

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

Congratulations! Nice job on dropping your handicap. Best wishes on getting out the this thread from the other side!

Thanks, my biggest weakness these days continues to be off the tee. Although I've been able to keep the number of penalty strokes down (ie. out of bounds or lost balls), still too many of my second shots consist of me having to pitch back in play due to a wayward drive. Fortunately the irons have helped me keep the scores in the low 90s for the most part. The number of true blow-up holes are down, but my scorecard usually consists of a lot of bogey's with the occassional par and/or double bogey thrown in there. Not a lot of realistic looks at many pars since my shots into the green are usually my third shot.

Needless to say I've been working more with the driver/3w at the range these days. At my last lesson, my instructor pointed out how open the club face was in my backswing so I've been working on keeping the club face a litte more closed on my takeaways so I don't have to work so hard to get it back square at impact. For whatever reason I don't seem to have the same problem with my irons (or at least not to the same degree). Feels very awkward, but the results (at least at the range) seem to be promissing so far.

Believe it or not, there are lots of people who can get par with their third shot onto the green (on par 4 of course).

I have been playing weekday mornings for a little less than 2 weeks now, and watched many senior golfers (man or woman) play near par golf. They do it by hitting straight shots off the tee. Short and controlled, and it looks like they could hit a little farther if needed. I also got partnered with two semi-retired women golfers today, and they played exactly by this strategy. They did not hit far, but they got to the green in three shots. In the cases where they left themselves a 5 foot putt, they would par the hole. The senior guys I have been playing are the same way. Yesterday I played the front 9 with a man who could only drive 160 yards and hit his 5i 150. He was deadly accurate from 150 yards. If he was within 150, he was assured a bogey or par. He barely missed a birdie on a 280 yard par 4 hole. I can give about 5 more examples of either a senior golfer or a lady golfer who employs this strategy very successfully. I am even getting to know some of them, as I have a monthly pass.

So, I've decided that I want to adopt this strategy. Keep the ball short and in play on any hole less than 350 yards. There are always the forced carries that you need to make, so I save those shots for only those holes, which are usually more wide open. Of course, I need to become more accurate from 150 and in to be successful with this strategy.

[billchao]

So, I've decided that I want to adopt this strategy. Keep the ball short and in play on any hole less than 350 yards. There are always the forced carries that you need to make, so I save those shots for only those holes, which are usually more wide open. Of course, I need to become more accurate from 150 and in to be successful with this strategy.

I don't remember reading anything like this in a certain book ;-)

[Lihu]

I don't remember reading anything like this in a certain book

Page 61 states that "the driver is arguably the most important club in your bag. . .It's the club most likely to result in. . ."

I am interpreting that as hitting as far as you can with a controlled swing that keeps you out of trouble. If I can improve my shot zones with this club by being more controlled, and still get decent distance why wouldn't I?

[GangGreen]

Good advice for sure, I've slowly come to the conclusion I need to do more of this. Lately my go to club on shorter par 4's has been my 5w. I seem to be able to get it out there around 200 yards and most of the par 4's on the home course are under 350 yards. The home course is pretty tight though so even a slightly errant 5w can leave you with a difficult shot in, but its still better then the pulled out of bounds driver...haha!

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

Believe it or not, there are lots of people who can get par with their third shot onto the green (on par 4 of course).

I have been playing weekday mornings for a little less than 2 weeks now, and watched many senior golfers (man or woman) play near par golf. They do it by hitting straight shots off the tee. Short and controlled, and it looks like they could hit a little farther if needed. I also got partnered with two semi-retired women golfers today, and they played exactly by this strategy. They did not hit far, but they got to the green in three shots. In the cases where they left themselves a 5 foot putt, they would par the hole. The senior guys I have been playing are the same way. Yesterday I played the front 9 with a man who could only drive 160 yards and hit his 5i 150. He was deadly accurate from 150 yards. If he was within 150, he was assured a bogey or par. He barely missed a birdie on a 280 yard par 4 hole. I can give about 5 more examples of either a senior golfer or a lady golfer who employs this strategy very successfully. I am even getting to know some of them, as I have a monthly pass.

So, I've decided that I want to adopt this strategy. Keep the ball short and in play on any hole less than 350 yards. There are always the forced carries that you need to make, so I save those shots for only those holes, which are usually more wide open. Of course, I need to become more accurate from 150 and in to be successful with this strategy.

Good advice for sure, I've slowly come to the conclusion I need to do more of this. Lately my go to club on shorter par 4's has been my 5w. I seem to be able to get it out there around 200 yards and most of the par 4's on the home course are under 350 yards. The home course is pretty tight though so even a slightly errant 5w can leave you with a difficult shot in, but its still better then the pulled out of bounds driver...haha!

I was thinking more on the lines of hitting your driver more controlled, and getting your 230 yards (based on your 5W distance). The other thing is to improve your irons such that you can reduce your shot dispersion from 150 yards and in (or more if you can).

The driver is still the longest club in your bag. It needs to be as long as you can reliably hit it. My shots are only about 220 yards (total distance), and I am getting a lot of fairways for my HI. If I really go after it I might be able to get 260 or more sometimes and 180-220 sliced/hooked all over the course most of the time. Arguably, there might be some in between distance that gives me enough reliability off the tee, while getting me closer to the hole on the first shot. I am still working on my swing, so this is all work in progress. However, the concept seems to work for the seniors.

[billchao]

Page 61 states that "the driver is arguably the most important club in your bag. . .It's the club most likely to result in. . ."

I am interpreting that as hitting as far as you can with a controlled swing that keeps you out of trouble. If I can improve my shot zones with this club by being more controlled, and still get decent distance why wouldn't I?

That would all depend on your ability from 150 as opposed to 120 or so. Remember, GIR is king, and distance is a huge factor. If you think you can afford to lose the 30 yards and still hit the green, go for it.

I'm not saying swing out of your shoes, but you seem to want to throttle it back almost too far.

[Lihu]

That would all depend on your ability from 150 as opposed to 120 or so. Remember, GIR is king, and distance is a huge factor. If you think you can afford to lose the 30 yards and still hit the green, go for it.

I'm not saying swing out of your shoes, but you seem to want to throttle it back almost too far.

Not trying. The ultimate goal is to drive as far as I can, but that just does not appear to be possible for me to go long and accurate. 220 is not that bad, and there is probably some optimal swing speed that allows me to make forced carries on the courses I play versus the accuracy I need to keep the shot zones small enough to make them playable.

I'm still working out my swing and just getting the distances I lost before my vacation a month ago. So, this is still a TBD conversation.

What I was recommending to others (and myself), is to play shorter and more controlled with the same clubs they use now to get their dispersions down and keep the ball playable. I was not recommending that they do it forever. As they gain swing speed through better mechanics, their distances will increase naturally playing with the same criteria.

[billchao]

What I was recommending to others (and myself), is to play shorter and more controlled with the same clubs they use now to get their dispersions down and keep the ball playable. I was not recommending that they do it forever. As they gain swing speed through better mechanics, their distances will increase naturally playing with the same criteria.

Ok, I understand you now. It seems like you might have just been overstating the distance you'd lose by dialing it back a little and making better contact (chances are, not much, if any because of the better quality of the strike). This is something I've actually started to do, too. My last round, I started taking one more club than I'd usually hit for a certain yardage and swinging a little easier, or even a 3/4 feeling. The result (at least on the approach shots) speaks for itself.

[chasm]

Believe it or not, there are lots of people who can get par with their third shot onto the green (on par 4 of course). I have been playing weekday mornings for a little less than 2 weeks now, and watched many senior golfers (man or woman) play near par golf. They do it by hitting straight shots off the tee. Short and controlled, and it looks like they could hit a little farther if needed. I also got partnered with two semi-retired women golfers today, and they played exactly by this strategy. They did not hit far, but they got to the green in three shots. In the cases where they left themselves a 5 foot putt, they would par the hole. The senior guys I have been playing are the same way. Yesterday I played the front 9 with a man who could only drive 160 yards and hit his 5i 150. He was deadly accurate from 150 yards. If he was within 150, he was assured a bogey or par. He barely missed a birdie on a 280 yard par 4 hole. I can give about 5 more examples of either a senior golfer or a lady golfer who employs this strategy very successfully. I am even getting to know some of them, as I have a monthly pass. So, I've decided that I want to adopt this strategy. Keep the ball short and in play on any hole less than 350 yards. There are always the forced carries that you need to make, so I save those shots for only those holes, which are usually more wide open. Of course, I need to become more accurate from 150 and in to be successful with this strategy.

I too play with seniors who adopt this strategy. It's OK, but only if you're happy to remain a bogey golfer. If you can drive only 160 yards you're going to be 200 yards from the hole on shortish par 4s. And by definition, for a hitter as short as that, that's more than one shot. The thing is, most of those seniors whose strategy you're admiring haven't adopted it as a matter of choice. If they could reliably hit the ball further, they would. What they are engaged in is damage-limitation now that they no longer have a the physical capacity to make a full swing.

[Hoganwoods]

Playing short ball is boring and I would think those that do it don't have the choice.  Lots of ways to play though.

[Lihu]

I too play with seniors who adopt this strategy. It's OK, but only if you're happy to remain a bogey golfer. If you can drive only 160 yards you're going to be 200 yards from the hole on shortish par 4s. And by definition, for a hitter as short as that, that's more than one shot. The thing is, most of those seniors whose strategy you're admiring haven't adopted it as a matter of choice. If they could reliably hit the ball further, they would. What they are engaged in is damage-limitation now that they no longer have a the physical capacity to make a full swing.

My senior drive goes about 220 here, and about 210 back east. I'm still working on my mechanics. My 7 is approaching 160 (total) again.

[GangGreen]

When it comes to club selection, a lot depends on how I'm hitting it that particular day. I went through an odd stretch earlier this year where I was hitting my driver really well (for me) but just couldn't seem to connect with my fairway woods at all off the tee so I found myself playing driver even on the shorter holes where a well-struck 3 or 5W would have given me more than enough distance to still play a mid-iron in. I have the same love/hate relationship with my 5i, just one of those clubs that I never know how I'm going to hit it until that first swing with it (if its off, I usually opt for the 4 hybrid).

[Lihu]

When it comes to club selection, a lot depends on how I'm hitting it that particular day. I went through an odd stretch earlier this year where I was hitting my driver really well (for me) but just couldn't seem to connect with my fairway woods at all off the tee so I found myself playing driver even on the shorter holes where a well-struck 3 or 5W would have given me more than enough distance to still play a mid-iron in. I have the same love/hate relationship with my 5i, just one of those clubs that I never know how I'm going to hit it until that first swing with it (if its off, I usually opt for the 4 hybrid).

Yeah, same goes for me. My driver was really good until a month ago, when I took some time off. I think the timing is much more critical, and I am just starting to get it back again.

[dave s]

Picked up a new weapon for this season in the way of a TaylorMade Stage 2 5-wood HL (high loft) model.  Idea was to be able to reach longer par 4s to at least green side or chipping areas and to eat up yardage on par-5 second shots.

So far, I've taken my lumps trying to figure out setup, swing and contact to make the club a useful tool.  Last month or so, I'm really making solid contact and hitting it from tight fairway lies in the 175-190 yards range.  Consistency is much better to a point where I can actually count on advancing the ball solidly each time with the 5-wood.  Ball flight tends to be off center to the right on misses, but not by much.  No slice, just blocked a bit to the right. I can certainly live with the results so far and try to clean up the direction with slight adjustments to my swing setup.

dave

[shankster pro]

Only 3 wood off the tee for me

[Braivo]

tight fairway lies in the 175-190 yards range.

I might just need to get one of those clubs.  Yesterday I was about 190 out on a reachable Par 5, pulled my 3i into a row of houses from a perfect fairway lie.  I can hit that 3i all day from the rough, but that fairway lie is a problem.

[Lihu]

I might just need to get one of those clubs.  Yesterday I was about 190 out on a reachable Par 5, pulled my 3i into a row of houses from a perfect fairway lie.  I can hit that 3i all day from the rough, but that fairway lie is a problem.

This sounds more like a mental issue. Just imagine that the fairway is rough. Pretend, it's way easier than the other way around.

[Braivo]

This sounds more like a mental issue.

Most of my problems are of this sort, indeed.