Jump to content
IGNORED

Girl Loses U.S. Junior Match After Raking Back Short Putt


iacas
 Share

Note: This thread is 1579 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

  • Administrator

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/golf-central-blog/shepherd-us-junior-final-after-concession-controversy

Quote

On the first playoff hole, the par-5 14th, Moon faced a 4-foot birdie putt for the win. She missed the putt and left herself a 4-inch comebacker for par. Already in with par, Shepherd didn’t concede her opponent’s short putt, and Moon mindlessly pulled her ball back to try again.

"I didn't say that was good," Shepherd said.

Because the putt wasn’t conceded, Moon violated Rule 18-2 (moving a ball in play) and received a one-shot penalty, resulting in a loss of hole and, ultimately, the match.

Ouch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Seems like both of them handled it really well, at least.  The comments in that link are funny - people are bashing her (the winner) since she's going to Duke.

1 minute ago, David in FL said:

2)  Some people are assholes.

Who, in this situation?  Neither of them did anything even remotely asshole-ish.

“And so I said, ‘I don’t think I gave that to you.’ Then I said, ‘I totally would have given that to you, no doubt.’”

Shepherd thought that because she intended to concede the putt, the match would be allowed to continue. But that wasn’t the case. Because the concession wasn’t verbalized prior to Moon raking her ball, Moon violated Rule 18-2 (moving a ball in play) and received a one-shot penalty.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

2 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

Seems like both of them handled it really well, at least.  The comments in that link are funny - people are bashing her (the winner) since she's going to Duke.

Who, in this situation?  Neither of them did anything even remotely asshole-ish.

“And so I said, ‘I don’t think I gave that to you.’ Then I said, ‘I totally would have given that to you, no doubt.’”

Shepherd thought that because she intended to concede the putt, the match would be allowed to continue. But that wasn’t the case. Because the concession wasn’t verbalized prior to Moon raking her ball, Moon violated Rule 18-2 (moving a ball in play) and received a one-shot penalty.

Yeah, the quote in the OP didn't really reflect the same story as the link.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

5 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

Seems like both of them handled it really well, at least.  The comments in that link are funny - people are bashing her (the winner) since she's going to Duke.

Who, in this situation?  Neither of them did anything even remotely asshole-ish.

“And so I said, ‘I don’t think I gave that to you.’ Then I said, ‘I totally would have given that to you, no doubt.’”

Shepherd thought that because she intended to concede the putt, the match would be allowed to continue. But that wasn’t the case. Because the concession wasn’t verbalized prior to Moon raking her ball, Moon violated Rule 18-2 (moving a ball in play) and received a one-shot penalty.

I don't disagree, but I would be curious how often putts of inconsequential distance are conceded without officially saying so.  And I say that because it's very noticeable how she turns to walk away and then pauses and her eyes get kinda wide before she turns back and says she didn't concede.  I find it hard to believe that anybody would care if she just continued that turn towards the next tee.  I believe that is the action Dave might be referring to (and also why I gave him a thumbs up)

I could be entirely wrong though. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

8 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

I don't disagree, but I would be curious how often putts of inconsequential distance are conceded without officially saying so.

OK - so I'm revealing my ignorance here (I've never played in an "official" match play tournament), but don't you have to verbally concede anything?

8 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

And I say that because it's very noticeable how she turns to walk away and then pauses and her eyes get kinda wide before she turns back and says she didn't concede.

Not that you can read her mind, but it looks like she clearly turned away because she thought Moon was going to tap the putt in.  Her eyes got wide when she raked it instead.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator
1 minute ago, Hardspoon said:

OK - so I'm revealing my ignorance here (I've never played in an "official" match play tournament), but don't you have to verbally concede anything?

No. You can motion "pick it up" or tap it away yourself or whatever.

1 minute ago, Hardspoon said:

Not that you can read her mind, but it looks like she clearly turned away because she thought Moon was going to tap the putt in.  Her eyes got wide when she raked it instead.

Ditto.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

3 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

OK - so I'm revealing my ignorance here (I've never played in an "official" match play tournament), but don't you have to verbally concede anything?

I dont know either but I would assume that by the rules you would indeed have to clearly concede, just that I wonder if they ever don't.

I can tell you with 100% certainty, though, that I f that was me that I'd have kept walking to the next tee.  If an official came to me and asked if I conceded I'd say I didn't but I wouldn't volunteer it.

8 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

Not that you can read her mind, but it looks like she clearly turned away because she thought Moon was going to tap the putt in.  Her eyes got wide when she raked it instead.

Agree completely about the mind reading but I don't think I've ever seen that happen - people finish out a hole in match play like that.  (I admittedly haven't watched all that much match play and I don't think I've ever watched junior match play)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

7 minutes ago, iacas said:

No. You can motion "pick it up" or tap it away yourself or whatever.

Ditto.

Looked to me like a concession....turning and starting to walk away.  No doubt that Moon should have confirmed it before raking it back though.  Shepherd could easily have said, yep, I conceded that, let's move on....

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

2 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

If an official came to me and asked if I conceded I'd say I didn't but I wouldn't volunteer it.

Per the story (and what you can hear on video), her coach did ask her "Did you concede?"  She hesitated long enough that she was asked, and then she had no choice but to tell the truth.

2 minutes ago, David in FL said:

Looked to me like a concession....turning and starting to walk away.  No doubt that Moon should have confirmed it before raking it back though.  Shepherd could easily have said, yep, I conceded that, let's move on....

Yeah, agreed...I guess I give her the benefit of the doubt since she's young and probably didn't realize what was going on.  I'd bet that next time she just walks away.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator
2 minutes ago, David in FL said:

Looked to me like a concession....turning and starting to walk away.  No doubt that Moon should have confirmed it before raking it back though.  Shepherd could easily have said, yep, I conceded that, let's move on....

Turning away is not a concession.

If she did not actually concede, but walks away and doesn't lodge a claim in time, it's effectively the same thing as conceding.

But it's not conceding.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Just now, iacas said:

Turning away is not a concession.

It is if the player says it is.

Again, Moon never should have assumed.  Her fault.  Had I been asked if I had conceded that putt, I would have said yep.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

It really is a tough break for both of them. In the end, the responsibility is on Moon to make sure the putt was conceded. 

9 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

I can tell you with 100% certainty, though, that I f that was me that I'd have kept walking to the next tee.  If an official came to me and asked if I conceded I'd say I didn't but I wouldn't volunteer it.

Yea, that is kinda what I am thinking I would have done as well. I am not sure what I would say or do if I noticed the opponent do what Moon did. I probably mention the same thing, that I didn't concede the putt. Though it would be very rare for me not to concede that length of a putt. I am pretty good at saying "That's good" early enough that this type of situation probably would not happen. 

Another question is, if you notice the opponent pick up the ball with out being conceded, and do not mention anything. Are you in violation of waiving the rules of golf and disqualified? 

4 minutes ago, iacas said:

Turning away is not a concession.

I agree with this. Unless the opponent makes a deliberate sign or says something then the putt is not conceded. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

6 minutes ago, iacas said:

Turning away is not a concession.

Agree, if she were older and wiser I'd say a well played hustle but seems to be a mistake on both parties with the fault really lying with the person who didn't hole out. Lesson learned for her about rules, lesson learned for other about sportsmanship. 

Edited by Gator Hazard
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Just now, iacas said:

No, it isn't.

See the rest of my post that you didn't quote.

I didn't quote it, because you edited it... ;-) 

I know of no place in the rules where it specifies exactly what needs to be done in order to concede a hole.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • iacas changed the title to Girl Loses U.S. Junior Match After Raking Back Short Putt
Note: This thread is 1579 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share



  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • Support TST Affiliates

    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    FlightScope Mevo
    Use the code "iacas" for 10% off Mevo after clicking this link. For Mevo+, click this link or the image above.
  • Posts

    • Single Plane. "Natural Golf." He patterned his entire approach after Norman long before he bulked up.  
    • I was able to pay off my loans early all by myself, so everyone else should too.  Of course I was only paying $1200 per year in tuition for a chemical engineering degree. Now get off my lawn. It does "feel" like colleges compete based on amenities more than cost than they did when I was in school. In addition to the added cost of those amenities, state governments have reduced funding per student to the schools which forced the schools to rely on  tuition more. The availability of student loans allowed the states to cut the funding. I don't know which happened first, the loans or the funding cuts. I assume there is also some waste at schools in the form of a higher administrator to student ratio. I don't know what to do about the high cost of college and the debt burden on students.  I don't think that the ROI is high enough for some degrees. Many would be better off learning a trade.  In addition to the limits Erik mentioned, I think loan forgiveness for certain degrees in certain locations could help.  In the mean time I recommend everyone use the plan that I used for my kids to graduate college debt free. I have 2 single siblings who make good money who started contributing to a 529 for my kids when they were little.  I only paid about $4K per year which was in order to get the max tax credits. Each kid did/does get some scholarships that covered around 25% of total costs. My son is currently in school and plays on the golf team, but he does not get any money for it. Maybe he can earn a little next year with some continued improvement. My back up plan was for my wife to get a full time job after having been a SAHM and then substitute teacher for all of our kids' lives.
    • I remember last summer, when he complained that a cameraman was "damaging my brand" by having the temerity to video Bryson's actions.  Same here, its not Bryson's fault, its everyone else.  If you care about other people's opinions of you, you better think before you open your mouth and give them a reason to think you're a doofus.
    • Well those are actual numbers for one school, so it’s a small sample. And it’s more years. 1957 was $600, 1978 was $6000 and WPI was $60,000 when my son graduated from HS in 2013. When I was in school it went from $6k to $8K in 4 years.
    • Technically yesterday- 80, Woodley Lakes from the whites - 38-42 with a horrendous 7 on the easy par 5 13th after hitting a great drive AND a very nice 3 wood to about 91 yards short…then the carnage began - 56 degree fat to the collar…square strike (yep, have on - love it) caught the seam of the collar and went 25 feet past…first putt burned the edge but slipped 4 feet by…4 footer right in the heart but only traveled 3 feet 11 inches…BOOM double bogey…   Tomorrow is Balboa - usually break 80 there, but we will see…   good round to all playing today!
  • Today's Birthdays

    1. Augie
      Augie
      (63 years old)
    2. Dukes1304
      Dukes1304
      (36 years old)
    3. Mmgolfwiz
      Mmgolfwiz
      (58 years old)

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...